Have you seen the Coloring Book for Lawyers (PDF)?
Hey! I work for a Big-4 accounting/consulting firm. There is no work more glorious than bean counting!
Because you learned a trade. One that seemingly pays well. Yay you.
You make more than a burger flipper because your trade is a middleman professional services trade. You are a necessary evil in the process of actually accomplishing something in business, like acquiring another company or making changes to corporate governance or capital structure. That’s fine - there are rules to making change happen and we understand that lawyers help us frame our actions in accordance with existing laws.
I am happy for you, in that you have an income that is at a level that you feel proud enough to start this thread about. But as I have said in the past, I hire guys like you, and you and I both know that you are just a tool - a step in my (i.e., the business executive’s) process to accomplish something. You don’t sit at the grown-up table and participate in any decisions of substance, except to confirm that the associated legal agreements comply with requirements - and even then, you only speak when you are spoken to.
So, from that standpoint, it is laughable to read your posts as you strut around like a kid wearing his father’s business jacket. Go enjoy your money.
Ahhh! The jealousy! It burns! You evil, evil man. How dare you do something as outrageous as study hard at school, bust your butt to pass the bar, work long hours to make partner, stay current on tax law and think you should be allowed to enjoy the fruits of your labors. You heartless bastard! 
I know some people who make a hell of a lot of money and not one of them had it handed to them. My FIL was a union electrician when he decided to start his own electrical contracting company. 30 years later he now makes enough to be able to travel the world, owns two homes, a 38 foot boat and a Cessna 172. His sons are taking over the business but they still typically work 60 hour weeks, excluding weekends and holidays. I don’t begrudge them from having the money that they earned nor do I think they should do anything with the money that they don’t want. If they give to charities, that’s nice. If they want to buy an Escalade, good for them. If they don’t want to pay extra taxes, I don’t blame them. My wife is on medical disability and our combined income is maybe a third of theirs but I don’t think they owe us anything. They made their choices, we made ours. I’d rather struggle day-to-day than have to work for someone as horrible as my FIL.
Rand, back to your OP: are you satisfied to be partner or have you ever considered going out on your own? Since you work with non-US investors, are you required to travel for your work and, if so, what percentage of the time? Do you have to keep up on the international laws regarding real estate ownership? Does this require re-certifications or tests? What countries do you primarily deal with (if you can tell us)?
Finally, as a greedy, heartless capitalist obviously hell-bent on taking children’s candy and stealing widow’s pensions, do you think the tax laws should be re-written and simplified and, if so, how would you do it?
Yes, yes. Anyone who doesn’t want to embrace Rand Rover is jealous.
Dang.
If I buy turbo tax and wrap it in a joseph abboud suit can I call it rand rover?
awesome
Do your clients think that Biggie Smalls was right? (Mo Money Mo Problems)
You are right that I don’t make business decisions or exercise business judgment. But I do make legal decisions and exercise legal judgment. I don’t merely make sure there aren’t any typos in the legal docs. People like you won’t do deals unless they get an opinion from people like me that the tax implications will be as expected.
Also, I get paid whether or not you do–my fee is paid whether the investment makes money or not.
So, from that standpoint, it is laughable for you to attempt to swing your business-guy dick around when you won’t do shit unless I say it’s OK and I make money even if you lose your ass.
How is being ‘rich’ being defined here? Making a large annual income doesn’t necessarily translate to being rich. If you make $250k a year and spend $240k a year, then saving the $10k you don’t spend isn’t exactly going to make one rich. Someone making that kind of dough who lost his job would be soon enough be out on the street just the same as the average Joe who spend $38k of his $40k a year. If I lost my job frankly I still would be well off and I would survive financially just fine, where the person I just described above would not be.
Now if you have a large net worth then you might be rich but again that depends on what you mean by rich. Without going into much detail here our household has a high six figure income and a seven figure net worth–yet we live a very middle class existance. My wife and I save for our retirement probably what many people live off in a year. We have no debt other then our home, which is almost paid off. If we want something we certainly can just go buy it, but we rarely do that. If you met us you would not have any inkling of how much money we make or have. Being wealthy doesn’t translate into being flashy in my opinion.
Mind you we don’t live like paupers and we do enjoy our money but we have the ability to make financial decisions on our terms. We buy things outright rather then pay interest on them, etc. But our goal is an early retirement. I love what I do for a living but once my daughter is out of the house we plan on doing a bit more traveling, etc. And to do that we need a solid cash flow and that comes form our net worth, not our annual income.
Now I came from a poor background and government programs clearly benefited me and my educational goals, so it would be hypocritical of me to be against them just because now I have to pay for those programs. Thus I am very supportive of goverment programs such as educational loans, etc. I got to my position by a combination of hard work, luck and good government programs. I for sure made several good decisions along the way but I can’t fault others for making different decisions. We contribute both time and money to many charities as we recognize that not everyone is as fortunate as we are.
The problem I have with this thread is that it comes across as arrogant and crude. Many of my clients live the ‘high style’ life and have no money whatsoever since they are mortgaged to the hilt with leased fancy cars, vacation homes, boats, etc. The vast majority of millionaires are your next door neighbors who don’t live that fancy lifestyle (read The Millionaire Next Door for the cite).
I would advise anyone who wants to have a high net worth to start investing in their 401k as young as you can. You don’t need a high income to save, but you do have to live below your means.
As to some of the other questions in here. Am I worth what they pay me? Some days I would say no, but on other days I am quite certain they don’t pay me enough. I provide a service that my clients need but I recognize that there indeed are others who can provide them the same service, but I hope and trust that they come to me because I bring some perceived value to them. But that is their decision to make - whether they want to pay my fees or go to another Architect who charges them less.
But the real reason I think I am rich is because I have a beautiful wife who loves me, a beautiful daughter who loves me and good friends and family. Money isn’t what makes one happy in life. Granted it is good to have money but it won’t by itself make you happy in my opinion.
Mr. WordMan is in a meeting now. Please go back to your office and wait. You’ll be contacted if anything is needed from you.
Look, I’ve been yelled at in this thread both for intimating that I’m rich and for saying “not really,” so I’m bored with the issue. It has no relevance anyway. I just used the r-word to parallel the poor thread.
Doesn’t anyone else find this ‘whose dick is bigger’ contest pretty funny?
Color me unimpressed by Rand Rover’s alleged wealth.
Also color me unimpressed for waving it around like we’re supposed to go ooh, aah over it.
Especially when we’ve seen exactly what RR’s attitude toward people who aren’t wealthy.
I think you got told, RR.
Is this a joke? :dubious:
I’m not waving anything around to make others go ooh and aah–i just thought I’d start an ask me thread to parallel the other one.
Also, I hope you have seen my attitude toward people who aren’t wealthy and have compared it to fiscal liberals’ attitudes. I think people who aren’t wealthy are human beings while fiscal liberals treat them like pets.
Or they just go to a place like Dubai or Qatar where people like you aren’t needed since there are no taxes and thus no need for tax gurus.
That’s absolutely right. Most people don’t let pets out in the cold to starve to death. But Libertarians are happy to treat human beings that way.
I don’t think too many people are jealous or even care what Rand Rover does for a living. What people have a problem with is his unabashed arrogance over his high income and his overinflated sense of worth. He’s just a lawyer. He didn’t build the Panama Canal or design the hybrid car or anything.
I’m in NYC and nearly everyone I know (including myself and my girlfriend) is some sort of lawyer, investment banker, Big-4 accountant, trader, management consultant or other six figure earning professional. Most of them have the good sense to act like normal people. But every now and then, you do get some bigmouth who for whatever reason has something to prove to everyone.
And actually, FWIW, the people I know who aren’t in those fields and don’t make as much money actually seem a lot more interesting.
Quite frankly, it is nice to have a bit of money though.
I think it’s laughable that you are such a Ayn Rand fan when your job is clearly more Wesley Mouch than Hank Reardon or John Galt. You’re a tax attorney. You only make money as long as people earn an income to tax and as long as our system of taxation is so complex as to require the advice of $600 an hour lawyers.