Meteorman is also another good movie
I guess that’s to be expected, thank you. I had a curious experience a few weeks ago that you might be interested in, it made me think anyway.
I’m in Saudi and occasionally get some Africans through here. Not the North-African Arab types but regular Africans from Kenya, Nigeria, the Congo, etc. Incredibly dark, mostly tall, some with tribal scars on their cheeks. Anyway, I met a few of these guys and their attitudes are completely different from those of a black guy from the US. If I had started jabbering about race-relations, they would have wondered what I was talking about. They seemed more curious than anything else. (It was mutual) Anyway, our respective melanin levels were a non-issue.
It made me realize that the reason for poor race relations in the US was cultural instead of actually having anything to do with skin color. ie “people with X amount of melanin are expected to act in a particular way.” Compared to actual Africans, a guy from Watts would be straight-up normal to me.
So, after reading that rambling anecdote, what would be your view on how Americans could change this? What would be considered a reasonable approach by both sides?
Regards.
Testy.
Another anecdote along the lines of the previous post.
The postgraduate student trust in London where I lived for three years had a series of cultural nights organized by the residents, to celebrate the various cultures represented with the trust. To avoid having hundreds of these, they were grouped rather broadly – there was an Asian Night (meaning South Asia – India, Pakistan, etc.), Africa Night, North American Night (lots of Canadian and US residents; no Mexicans, alas), Antipodean Night, etc.
One year an “African-American” resident (and I use the term because he was rather militant about it) decided to get involved in the arrangements for the Africa night, and suggested that the theme for the event revolve around the cultural exploitation of the African people by whites. He got laughed out of the meeting, and was told to go join the North America Night committee instead.
I mention this merely to illustrate the cultural gap between “African-Americans” and modern Africans. Many black people in America may feel disconnected from mainstream American culture – and not without good reason – but they’re still a lot more “American” than they seem to realize.
Anecdote 2: I used to do international admissions for a US university. At one point the administration decided to change one of the little boxes on the form for race from “Black” to “African-American”. I subsequently pointed out that this meant there would be no appropriate designation for non-American blacks, but they went right ahead and did it anyway. More cultural myopia from America.
I have a question. From watching Office Space.
I’m a 24yo white male. Normal looking guy mostly, clean cut etc. I like to listen to some hardcore gansta rap sometimes, songs with excessive use of the N word. If you were to see me in my car, and were able to hear what I was listening to, as well as hear me singing along to it, would it make you mad or would you feel offended by it? Would you be angry at ME? Or just confused? Do I really have to turn down the music and stop singing if a black person is within earshot?
Testy & jr8
You reminded me of something I almost forgot. I had your exact esperience once while stationed at San Antonio back in my Army days. We would commonly had troops from other branches of service and other countries. I met some Afridcans (I can’t remember the country) that struck me as being as different form my self as I was from Asians.
It is undoubtable that it’s culture that has caused this. I’m not so sure that’s a bad thing. I mean it would tend to confirm to me that we should be Americans fist in this country instead of all those xxx-American labels.
c_goat
I guess I’m used to it. It’s not uncommon for me to hear white kids playing gangsta rap. But then I live in a pretty diverse neighborhood. Anyway you’re unlikely to see a response from me. I don’t think my response would be atypical.
Stuffy my friend…I haven’t visited this thread until today. Did you decide to locate to Newport News in VA! If so the kids and I would love to have you and the kids up for a cookout. Richmond is only about an hour and a half away.
Needs2know…P.S. I’ve tried to email you but couldn’t get it to go through.
Beadlin…I can offer a little advice on children’s entertainment. Perhaps this child doesn’t have access to cable televison and that would be a shame. Now we have a full time Disney channel in the package that is part of basic, for ethnic diversity this channel is wonderful. Not only does the programming show young people interacting with children of different ethnic backgrounds but occasionally they will produce made for TV movies that inform kids about other cultures. But for the most part the station runs shows that are fun for kids to watch, and you never have to worry about violence or sex being part of the content. Thank goodness my son chooses to watch this channel. (Although his little friend is always bringing over Chucky movies, and things I do not consider age appropriate. Just another indication that parents either do not pay attention or do not care.)
Needs2know
Hi Needs
We’re trying to decide about the move. I’m leaving this friday and hope to be there till Tuesday (I originally planned to visit for the weekend only but now I’m trying to stretch it out, since some family members I haven’t seen in years want to show me the sights. Anyhoo, I’ve been having trouble with my hotmail account but try this e-mail address:
I’ll try the new address. You couldn’t have picked a nicer week to come out the weather has just gotten to be great lately. It might even be a little on the hot side this weekend. You’re gonna love the humidity! I had forgotten you had family out this way.
Needs2know
hey Needs
Got it, check your in-box.
[[I think the Jamacian accent thing may be uniquely Afro-British.]]
Well, and a Jamaican thing.
I especially love it when you’re stuck on a crowded Jamaican bus and someone’s jheri curl is drippin glycerin on your face.
Would you consider it OK for a non-black guy to tell jokes making fun of a specific black celebrities physical features if those features are ones associated with old stereotypical views of blacks?
I’m asking because I saw a black comic start telling jokes about rapper Jay-Z’s lips, i.e. ‘Jay-Z’s lips are so big he can roll a blunt with no hands’ and ‘Jay-Z’s lips are so big he can whisper in his own ear’.
I was thinking it was OK because he’s not talking about black people in general, just a particular one who does happen to have really big lips, but since I have heard plenty of jokes about the lips of black people in general I’d feel a bit uncomfortable telling them in the presence of black people. I guess I could change the subject of the jokes to Angelina Jolie…
Badtz
I’d consider it fair game, but YMMV
stuffinb,
what do you think about black people using the word “nigger” to refer to themselves and each other? I know that in context it isn’t derogatory, but how do you feel when you hear the word in the non-derogatory sense? For my part, I know that I personally am not offended by my friends walking up to me and saying “what up, cracka”, but I have no idea how other people feel about it.
Also, what do you think of white people using the word in the same sense? It’s common among my group of friends for someone to say “oh, that’s my nigga”, or “that nigga so & so’s coming over”, and none of my friends are black (due to the extremely low concentration of black people in my town). When a black person is around, they try not to use the word because they’re afraid it would be offensive, even in an obviously non-racial context. Would it bother you, or does it bother other black people, to hear a white person say things like that?
I’m glad you bought this up, **nevermore **
I’ve never been of the school of thought that by claiming the word it empowers you. That said I don’t readily take offense to it when used in a non-racial context. I do know white people who use it that way, and I’ve never called them on it. On the whole, I don’t particularly care for the term.
I don’t let my kids use it that way though. But I don’t allow slang of any kind from them, at least not until they master proper english. (I’m kind of anal that way :D)
A question for you. What does “signify” mean? I’ll give you a context: I was watching the excellent show ‘Homicide: Life on the Street’, and there was a black cop teamed with a white cop, and they were questioning witnesses about a crime, and the black cop says (about a group of black men hanging out) “There they are, just signifyin’ the day away.”
The white cop says, “what do you mean?” and the black cop says “You wouldn’t understand.” So whats it mean? Thanks.
Signifying, The Dozens, snapping and dissin’. They were goofing on each other. I guess he meant they were just bullshitting around all day.
No, no, no, Biggirl, you were supposed to tell moggy that he wouldn’t understand.
From britannica.com
http://www.britannica.com/eb/article?eu=2510&tocid=0
According to Henry Louis Gates Jr.
Pretty much nails it, as far as my understanding of “signifyin’” goes.
Peace,
mangeorge
This is a pretty good thread. Seeing as how I’m the OTHER black guy around the SDMB, I’ll take a stab at a few of these, with the kind permission of Biggirl and stuffinb.
Few declarations:
-
I’m African-American male, 30, unmarried, no kids. I teach elementary school, I draw and watch lots of bad TV. On the other hand, I read a lot and listen to lots of music – R&B – with a liberal sprinkling of reggae, rock, pop, gangsta rap, hip-hop, techno, a cappella, gospel, some classical and (sigh) country, too… it’s just R&B with banjos, really.
-
Askia is my name since birth. Parents never married, so I fit that stereotype – but I’m very close to both, particularly my father since adulthood, so I buck the other one.
-
Affirmative Action was a genuine, yet misguided attempt to systematically ‘level the playing field’ in a society built on institutional racism in every major bastion of employment, from academics to military service to journalism to politics and the blue collar trades. Charitably, it had its successes and abuses. Effectively a two-generation phenomenon, it’s largely outgrown its usefulness and increasingly has a stigma attached to recipients of its implementation. I have participated in programs where I know I was been evaluated in my training by a separate, lowered standard. It was insulting.
-
The paper bag test (press a paper bag against a black person’s skin; if they’re darker they flunk) reveals a deep-rooted schism in some African-American communities/organizations based on preferential treatment given to lighter skinned blacks of middle-class affluence against darker skinned blacks regardless of socioeconomic status. Collounsbury mentioned its use in the 19th century but I have heard of persuasive anectdotal tales of it used MUCH, MUCH later than that in states like Louisiana, Texas and Ohio. I strongly suspect it’s still practiced in some other circles: some black college Greek organizations at HBCUs come to mind.
-
I laughed my ass off at Blazing Saddles. Still do. Loved it end-to-end, especially the Richard Pryor-penned lines with Cleavon Little seducing Madeline Kahn in her dressing room, and especially the classic lost dialogue after she gushes, “Oh, it’s twue, it’s twue!” – “That’s my arm.” (Cutting Room floor, according to Brooks.) The homophobic humor is typical of attitudes 25 years ago, tho. Mixed feelings about Lee’s School Daze as the definitive black college film. Some things, like the “Good and Bad Hair” musical number or the plaintive “Wake Up” segment at the end of the film seemed eclectic, inspired and wildly experimental ten years ago, but just strike me as dumb, now. But how can I hate a movie with a young Lawrence Fishburne as a campus revolutionary, Samuel L. Jackson in a bit part as a jheri-curl-cap wearing local thug or EU’s Doing the Butt on the soundtrack?
-
I say “nigga” all the time to certain of my male friends, but rarely say “nigger” – especially females – no matter how mad I get. Yes, there is a difference. Don’t be niggling, please. Anybody not black who tries to use ANY of the above around me is just plain suspect.
-
I just felt this list needed a “7”.
-
Friends was usually better than the shrill and embarrassing Martin, but Homocide: Life On The Streets was just brilliant, period – often far more compelling than episodes of its sister show, Law and Order.
-
Prefer Dave to Jay and Arsenio combined.
-
A lil’ Oprah goes a long, long, lo-ooo-oong way.