That’s not necessarily always the result of bad planning, IMO. For example, here’s my situation on why I couldn’t afford it when I graduated from school: I didn’t take out any loans, and worked to pay my bills. With the way my time was divided, I graduated on time, but had no debts or any savings. I’m moving on to grad school in the fall, and needed the time back home to make sure that I could afford to apply and to live on my own. I really don’t see how this makes me lazy or a loser any more than it shows that I was (and still am) motivated to achieve my own goals.
Hmm. I don’t think I said I was equating close families with wife beating and I’m not sure why you went that way. I thought I made it clear, but if not, I’ll say it again: It’s all a matter of personal perspective. I am not close with my family and don’t want to be particularly close to anyone else’s family either. And I don’t see where you disagree that Indian men are close to their families.
I will say your family, from what you say, in my experience is a wonderful exception and not the norm at all. Too many families I know in America say it flat out - one of our sons is expected to take care of us. And too many families I know in India continue to live in the same house, even after marriage. My three male cousins all brought their wives home and now there is so much tension in that house. In the States, the community I was raised in it was a common belief that the sons would take care of their parents and the daughters would not move out except for college, and then go straight to marriage.
I don’t want a huge family or community around me, period., And as you say, for better or for worse, that is a huge part of Indian culture…so I choose to avoid it entirely. I conflated two statements in my post, though - Indian men are family-knit and some Indian families expect very stringent ties on their sons - and that’s probably where the confusion comes from.
On a more personal note I like his family to be amiable and loving but maintain their own space. Same with mine. And I hope neither family will ever be living with us. We both value our personal space extremely highly.
I am always impressed by your family. They sound wonderfully supportive, as is evidenced by the way you grew up. I wish it were the case more often. It’s not been my experience at all…my family was an extreme exception, but I’ve seen plenty of it.
(Sorry is this is disjointed, I’m typing on the laptop and the keys are so tiny that it’s hard to type, and the screen makes everything tiny.)
One more thing that’s slightly unrelated to the topic - you don’t “waste valuable blood pressure points” when they do this because you know they are doing this out of *love *for you. And concern. And not just one more attempt to control your life.
See this is why I think people with good parents and people with bad parents can never fully understand each other. You see this as getting stressed over nothing. I see it as control.
And just to make it clear this is a different point I don’t feel this is directly the reason to move out, but in a way…let me see if I can explain. Moving out is not a way to remove your parents’ control over your life (in optimal conditions). It’s a way to assert your *own *control over your life.
I don’t either, but that’s because my parents wouldn’t do something like that, any more than Mr. Neville or I would walk around naked in our apartment while my parents were visiting, or any more than your parents would re-structure your investments.
Not all of us who aren’t close to our families have issues with them, nor are we necessarily cold, any more than all Indian men who live with their parents after college are necessarily mama’s boys. The people who are actually estranged from their families probably do have issues with them, but most of us are just operating from a different set of cultural assumptions than you are- that doesn’t mean we’re cold or have issues with our families.
It all depends on the hotness of the 26 year old woman.
But if there were two women, of equal hotness, I’d choose the one who lived on her own.
I’m not judging your choices and you certainly don’t owe me or anyone else any explanation. I went from university to law school at 22 and lived with my parents the summer between. Was I a loser? No, and neither are you. But I’m not sure about you (nor am I asking) but I wasn’t exactly date-bait, living back there in the ruffled pink bedroom I’d had since I was six.
That said, you made the choice to not take out loans and to move back home. And graduating debt-free is an accomplishment, no question. But others might have chosen to shoulder the loans and get their own place – to find out, IOW, if they could afford to live on their own by actually going out and living on their own. While you are ahead of them financially, they may be ahead of you in terms of establishing their own independent lives. Whether the financial gains are worth it is something only you can say.
I think there is a double standard, but not as big as you think it is.
I knew a guy who lived at home with his mother and never cooked or cleaned and never did any errands unless nagged to death. He was a college student so he wasn’t exactly in loserville, but he definitely was milking the situation. I don’t have any hard data, but I’m thinking this kind of behavior is more common in guys than women. I can’t see my mother cooking and cleaning for me (hell, when I visit for the holidays she has me cleaning!), but I can see her doing that for my brother (or at least giving him an easier time about helping out).
So when people see a guy living at home, they think “Oh, he’s being cared for.” But when they see a woman, they think “Oh, she must be caring for her parents.”
It might often be a wrong assumption, but I think it’s more likely to be true than not.
To answer the OP…
If someone is thirty and has NEVER left the nest, then yes, I would consider that person malfunctioned in some way (especially if that person hasn’t exhibited independence in other ways, like getting a driver’s licence or establishing a credit record). I would wonder what was holding them up in life. However, if they were in some kind of transitional state (temporary bout of illness or unemployment, waiting for grad school, etc.), then I would give them a pass. Unlike what most people here have said, I actually respect the person who’s flat broke and living with his parents more than the person who’s flat broke and living in the streets, begging. At least the first has some level of self-preservation and self-respect, and sometimes living with parents is the smartest move. Recognizing this shows sound judgement, IMHO. If I’m in real dire straits, my parents are the first folks I’m going to lean on because I know their love is unconditional. So no, I’m not going to judge someone harshly just for seeking refuge with parents, as long as that person acts like an adult and doesn’t revert to adolescence. Which, unfortunately, is just way too tempting to do.
The only time I get annoyed with folks who live with their parents is when they complain too much. I can tolerate home-life complaints from folks out on their own, but there’s only so much “Mommy and Daddy” drama that I can take before I start thinking someone’s a spoiled brat.
Aside from issues of character, there’s a good reason to move out as soon as you can: You need the education and experience. You need to learn to care for yourself and how to be responsible for yourself, and you need to do it before you get into a relationship with someone else and especially before you have a family. Mistakes that are embarassing and annoying at 24 and single can be devastating when you’re 35 and married with children.
Moving out isn’t easy. Learning to live on your own isn’t easy. Some people take to it like ducks in water, but some have some learning to do. Lose a couple of jobs, run out of money, run up a credit card, get behind on the rent… If you’re going to make those mistakes, it’s best to make them when you’re young and resilient than it is when you’re older and responsible for dependents.
People who live at home in their late 20’s or later are at a disadvantage to the rest of the people of their generation who already have years of life experience behind them.
This thread and some of the harsh tones are making me a bit uncomfortable. I’ve moved back home twice, but at least I’m not there now. I went away to college at age 18 and learned how to keep a budget, save money, cook, clean, do my own laundry, pay my own bills, use a credit card responsibly, maintain my car (which I bought with my savings), and all those important life lessons – that time on my own was probably the best thing I ever did (and probably the best time of my life).
I moved back home the day after graduating college because I had a job lined up that was 15 minutes from my parents’ house, where I grew up. My plan was always to save up every penny so I could move BACK OUT to attend law school, as I had already been accepted and chose to defer my admission so I could sock some money away. I worked at the job and lived at home from early May to late December that year, and moved back out in January to return to my college town and do the law school thing, as planned. My parents were okay with it, and actually applauded my financial planning. Would I have preferred to have my own place for those months? Sure, but this was Miami, and renting a tiny, shitty apartment in the same neighborhood where my parents lived and my job was (knowing I’d be there less than a year) would have been pissing away the money I was earning and saving.
After law school, I moved back home again because I was studying for the Bar Exam and didn’t have a job lined up. A lot of law students, at least ones I know, did the same thing, since we were all in such transitional states until we passed the Bar, either jobless and studying full-time, or burning the candle at both ends while balancing both, knowing the job would be snatched away if we didn’t pass. That was probably the lowest point of my life due to a variety of factors, and I certainly felt like a loser for that stretch. But to cut out a lot of unnecessary details nobody would care about anyway, I finally got a great job out of town, and moved back out immediately. I’ve changed my career and my entire life since then (no more lawyerin’, yay!), and I’ve been living in the same place ever since, four hours from my parents. While I wish I didn’t have to move home twice, it made sense both times, I pulled my own weight while I was there (including taking on the lion’s share of grocery shopping and cooking), I got out, and I’ll never go back. And at the end of the day, I don’t think I’m a loser. YMMV, of course.
What an enlightening thread for me to go through, considering my family, our culture and our history.
My parents both lived at home until they got married, my father was 27, and my mother was 24. After they were married, they lived with my father’s parents for another 11 years. Along the way, my sister and I were born so there ended up being 3 generations under the same roof.
When I headed away to University at 19, there was a rather large uproar from both sets of grandparents and others about how inappropriate it was that I would want to leave my parents’ house to go to school 4 hours away. I spent the first year in residence and the next three in a house with one other roommate.
[Hijack]I hated that damn inefficient house. My electricity bill at school was double the bill that my parents pay here and the house here is at least triple the size. Damn landlord and the appliances from the '60s.[/Hijack]
Similar sentiments were also raised the following year when my sister decided to go away to school.
After finishing school last August, I moved back home where I’ve been taking care of mother who’s been undergoing radiation and chemotherapy for breast cancer. Would I still be at home, if I wasn’t take care of my mother? I imagine I would be, it just wouldn’t be “right” for me to move out on my own without a comfortable sum in the bank and steady-paying job. And I mean “right”, in the sense of family and culture. I mean I could have come home and moved straight out but why rock the boat unnecessarily? I have a girlfriend (2 years, 5 months as of today) who doesn’t have an issue with my living at home, in fact she likes the idea of saving up. {See below}
My girlfriend, 25 in August, does not intend to move out until she’s saved up enough money for the down payment on a house. She feels rent is a waste of money. And her parents are quite content with that, that’s how she was raised. She also went away for school.
Hey, it’s easier to obtain and begin a job right after college with a degree and a pair of boobs rather than having only a degree.
As for me, I left ‘home’ just after turning 19 to go to college 168 miles away, and with the exception of occasional visits stayed there even in the summers. I had some financial help from loans and scholarships and the parents, but I still worked part or full time most of the time while I was away.
After graduating college though at age 23, my lease soon expired and I didn’t want to renew because I didn’t know where I’d be working in a year. I had just earned a degree in materials engineering which is a field where most of the entry level jobs were in Texas or California or some other place far from WV. I had done a couple slightly more local job interviews by then that were somewhat related to me degree of study, but was still a few months away from obtaining a job. Should I have been job hunting 6-8 months before graduating? Sure, I could in a perfect world, but I had to do homework and go to lectures, and work on a huge senior engineering design project, and work part time as a research assistant, and work part time as a night desk clerk while doing homework and daydreaming about sleep, and study for the Fundamentals of Engineering exam. I moved back home later that summer but it was mostly because I did not want to commit to a lease before knowing for certain where I’d be getting a professional job. Most of the jobs I interviewed for were lengthy processes sometimes involving 1 or 2 phone interviews and then 2-3 in-person interviews for the same job and then waiting 2-3 weeks after that to receive either an offer or a rejection. I moved ‘home’ for several months during this period as it was the most logical choice. I really like my parents but I don’t prefer living with them because my sleep schedule doesn’t mesh well with theirs, but we managed okay. almost immediately, I returned to work at the same place I started working in high school which was at an architecture-photography firm. Meanwhile, I had applied to grad school in WV and got in, and then I enrolled, and then I moved in with a friend near WVU (no lease, good friend), and then I accepted a job offer about 400 miles away in Louisville after only a few days of classes.
So after a brief hiatus, I recently returned to being back out on my own again. The money is a bit better this time, so the adjustment has not been at all difficult since I grew accustomed to being on my own while working and going to college.
Living with one’s parents at any age does not automatically equate to being a big loser; I agree with the other Dopers who seemingly acknowledge that it depends on the situation, culture, zeitgeist, etc. However, there are indeed many losers who still live with their parents, and many of those losers would still be losers in the outside world too. Loserdom and late adulthood filial habitation certainly coexist often but one does not imply the other by default.
Moreover, I think a person who goes into their mid-twenties without ever living on their own, having a job, continuing education, or having sex is likely either a major loser or mentally disabled or part of a distinct culture or maybe a comination of the three.
I wouldn’t say that going back home for a short time (less than a couple months) due to crisis like divorce or “post-graduation lack of immediate job” in anywhere in the same category of “25-30 and never moved out” guy. YMMV
Wow. We could be related. My dad is totally like that. It bugs me, but it bugs me more when he doesn’t do stuff like that. When he nags me about my retirement account (“how is it allocated?”) I know he’s just telling me he loves me. It’s kind of cute, except when it gets on my nerves.
Heh. My dream guy has no family. Because then there’s no fight about who’s family we spend time with. It’ll always be my family, so I’ll be happy. And, of course, he’ll love my family too, because they’re eminently loveable. Even, sometimes, my dad…
I don’t think you’re a loser either. I think you had a plan; you made wise decisions about allocation of your resources, and you weren’t dependent on your parents, but used connections that you had to get done what you needed to get done.
I think that there has to be a distinction drawn between people with no plan and people who are pragmatic. A friend dated a guy who lived with his parents. After a couple months, it became plain that he was all talk; he had no plan to get out and although he swore it was a temporary thing, it clearly wasn’t. That’s a problem. (Turns out his failure to plan wasn’t just about living with his parents; it extended to things like “calling when I say I will” and “making reservations when I say I will.”)
I appreciate hearing it from someone else, especially a Doper whose opinion I respect. I was just waiting to have my post dissected and be raked over the coals of loserdom.
There’s a difference between children living with the parants and parents living with the children.
In Thailand, it’s still pretty much expected that at least one offspring, and usually the youngest one, will remain with the parents until the parents die, although this practice is falling by the wayside somewhat in Bangkok. Still, the Thais never understand why it’s considered unusual at best for Westerners to remain living with their parents when I tell them about it.
Pah. Anyone tries that, I’ll take them out. 'Cause they’d be wrong, so I’d explain to them all the shades of wrong they are. It might take days. But so be it. 
How’s 3 out of 4? 
I live at home.
Heck, for all the grief it cost me to secure a mortgage and all the aggravation of making the payments every month along with the upkeep, the bank had better let me live at home!
I think anything beyond 22, 23 max is loser territory. I’m 21 and my mom kicked me out in December and I’ve had to move in with my grandparents. I am very glad they are letting me live here and I work and go to school so its not like I lay around the house all day or anything. But as soon as I graduate next spring or next summer at the latest I plan on moving out and being completely self sufficient.
Sorry, tom, bobo did that joke on page one. 
With regards to the male vs. female living at home issue, in my opinion, one of the things women look for in a man is his ability to support her. I know how sexist and 50’s that sounds, but it is hard-wired - a pregnant woman or a woman with small children has been extremely vulnerable since we climbed down from the trees, and subconsciously we want to know that we will only be looking after the kids, and the guy will be looking after us. A male who is still living at home has given no traditional signs of readiness to take on the supporter and protector role.
Plus, women are attracted to a guy’s nest, and a guy still living at home doesn’t have one.