Baseball Thread July 2008

The Game Room
161

[QUOTE=Mister Rik]
To be fair, for his first two seasons in Seattle Sexson performed as expected. He started off poorly last year, but he’d historically been a slow starter so everybody assumed he’d pick it up as the season progressed. By the time it became apparent that he wasn’t picking it up, the team was in a quandary.

The team as a whole was playing much better than expected, which allowed them to keep Richie around and hope he snapped out of it. There were a ton of fans calling the postgame shows asking why the Mariners didn’t just trade him, and the basic answer they always got was, “Who’s going to take him, hitting the way he is and with the contract he’s got [$14 million in '07 and $15 million in '08], and what are the Mariners going to get in return? Nobody and nothing.” It wouldn’t surprise me if they decided to take the chance that he might get off to a good start in '08 and then trade him while they had the chance. But once it became clear that it was going to be more of the same this year they finally decided to just write him off.

This article on the Mariners Web site provides a good, candid explanation behind the decision to finally release him.

Me, I wonder if his eyes have gone bad. I normally listen to games on the radio — I rarely watch TV and don’t even have cable at home — so I haven’t actually seen Richie batting very many times. But I was housesitting for my sister the last couple weeks and caught a few games on TV there. I could clearly see that Richie was squinting during his at-bats. It could have been because of the sun, but none of the other players were squinting like that. Maybe the squinting is normal for Richie, but I couldn’t say since this was the first chance I’d really had to see his face during an at-bat. I suppose if the squinting was something new that somebody on the coaching staff would have noticed.
[/QUOTE]

Sexton reminded me of Sheffield. Great history and no future. Both are swinging slow bats. Sheff and Sexton swing at terrible pitches now. I see no hope for either one.

162

[QUOTE=Mister Rik]
To be fair, for his first two seasons in Seattle Sexson performed as expected. He started off poorly last year, but he’d historically been a slow starter so everybody assumed he’d pick it up as the season progressed. By the time it became apparent that he wasn’t picking it up, the team was in a quandary.

[/QUOTE]

I can understand all that. What I can’t understand is how the Mariners, after seeing him play all of last year, decided that he would be an adequate first baseman this year. Even that wouldn’t be so bad if the team prepared for the possibility that perhaps Sexson would still suck. Instead they went with a backup plan of Miguel Cairo and Jose Vidro, two people who would have little value even if they could play shortstop, let alone an offensive position. This team is spending over $100 million on payroll, traded away its top prospect to win now, and somehow didn’t foresee this could be a problem.

163

[QUOTE=Hawkeyeop]
I can understand all that. What I can’t understand is how the Mariners, after seeing him play all of last year, decided that he would be an adequate first baseman this year. Even that wouldn’t be so bad if the team prepared for the possibility that perhaps Sexson would still suck. Instead they went with a backup plan of Miguel Cairo and Jose Vidro, two people who would have little value even if they could play shortstop, let alone an offensive position. This team is spending over $100 million on payroll, traded away its top prospect to win now, and somehow didn’t foresee this could be a problem.
[/QUOTE]

On the positive side, the Mets’ Mike Pelfrey threw eight shutout innings last night. This has nothing to do with the Mariners or Richie Sexson, but I thought I’d mention it anyway.

164

[QUOTE=dalej42]
Where’s my pincushion? :smiley:
[/QUOTE]
Watch yourself, or I’ll be forced to play my Dan-Haren-and-Conner-Jackson-and-cash-for-Chin-Lung-Hu-and-Jason-Schmidt magical trade card.

165

[QUOTE=Hawkeyeop]
This team is spending over $100 million on payroll, traded away its top prospect to win now, and somehow didn’t foresee this could be a problem.
[/QUOTE]

Good points. I don’t think any Mariners fan is happy about the way the Bedard trade has turned out. If they’re like me and a couple of my friends, they’re actually less concerned about losing Adam Jones (.281, 5 HR, 41 RBI, 8 SB) than they are about losing George Sherrill (4.08 ERA, 28 saves).

Erik Bedard? Sure, he’s got a 6-4 record and a 3.67 ERA. He’s also averaging only 5-1/3 innings per start and has apparently decided that he’s not going to throw more than 100 pitches (contributing to wearing out the bullpen), and is now on the DL for the second time. He hardly speaks to the press after a game, and it sounds like he hasn’t made much of an effort to fit into the clubhouse.

Catching: Signing Johjima to a big 3-year extension apparently wasn’t a very popular move in the clubhouse. Especially when the entire pitching staff prefers to pitch to Jamie Burke.

Yuniesky Betancourt: Trying to be Ken Griffey, Jr. when he should be emulating Omar Vizquel. He’s probably the second fastest guy on the team behind Ichiro, but so far this season, with 326 AB he’s drawn a grand total of 6 walks and stolen 1 base, and scored 34 runs (hitting in front of Ichiro!). Meanwhile utility man Willie Bloomquist, with only 111 AB has drawn 18 walks, stolen 11 bases, and scored 23 runs.

166

[QUOTE=Hawkeyeop]
This team is spending over $100 million on payroll, traded away its top prospect to win now, and somehow didn’t foresee this could be a problem.
[/QUOTE]
The up side of the currently disastrous season is that it finally gave ownership the balls to cut away some serious dead weight in the management department. That Bavasi hung on by his fingernails, idiotic decision after idiotic decision and mediocre season after mediocre season, is an object lesson in indecisive leadership.

Let the rebuilding begin! :rolleyes:

167

[QUOTE=Cervaise]
The up side of the currently disastrous season is that it finally gave ownership the balls to cut away some serious dead weight in the management department. That Bavasi hung on by his fingernails, idiotic decision after idiotic decision and mediocre season after mediocre season, is an object lesson in indecisive leadership.

[/QUOTE]

So this passage makes me think of a discussion my father and I had a few days ago, to wit:

Of all the fanbases in Major League Baseball, which is currently suffering from the worst mismanagement on the part of ownership and the GM? Seattle has finally fired Bavasi. Brian Sabean hasn’t really sucked and it is becoming evident that some of his recent sucking might have been a misguided attempt to build around Bonds at all costs. Pittsburgh has what appears to be a sharp new GM, and while it may take some time to turn things around there, at least there’s call for optimism. The Dodgers have a terrible and not-very-bright General Manager, but they have a good roster in spite of him so they’re not eligible.

So what think? Which fanbase is most deserving of our sympathies, now that Seattle has exorcised Bavasi?

168

[QUOTE=storyteller0910]
So this passage makes me think of a discussion my father and I had a few days ago, to wit:

Of all the fanbases in Major League Baseball, which is currently suffering from the worst mismanagement on the part of ownership and the GM? Seattle has finally fired Bavasi. Brian Sabean hasn’t really sucked and it is becoming evident that some of his recent sucking might have been a misguided attempt to build around Bonds at all costs. Pittsburgh has what appears to be a sharp new GM, and while it may take some time to turn things around there, at least there’s call for optimism. The Dodgers have a terrible and not-very-bright General Manager, but they have a good roster in spite of him so they’re not eligible.

So what think? Which fanbase is most deserving of our sympathies, now that Seattle has exorcised Bavasi?
[/QUOTE]

It is an interesting question. Most of the hopeless teams in the game have at least started to move in the right direction. Are you just considering from this point forward, or does the past come into play as well. For example, I don’t think the Astros will be very good for a very long time, but they were in a World Series not too long ago, which prevents from feeling too bad for their fans.

169

[QUOTE=Hawkeyeop]
It is an interesting question. Most of the hopeless teams in the game have at least started to move in the right direction. Are you just considering from this point forward, or does the past come into play as well. For example, I don’t think the Astros will be very good for a very long time, but they were in a World Series not too long ago, which prevents from feeling too bad for their fans.
[/QUOTE]

All factors are included, so as you say, the Astros, who were good not long ago, probably aren’t eligible. Which team is the team that, if someone came up to you right now and said, “I’m a die-hard XXX fan,” you’d respond with an audible wince?

Washington seems like the easy answer, but I don’t know. Are there die-hard Nationals fans?

170

[QUOTE=storyteller0910]
All factors are included, so as you say, the Astros, who were good not long ago, probably aren’t eligible. Which team is the team that, if someone came up to you right now and said, “I’m a die-hard XXX fan,” you’d respond with an audible wince?

Washington seems like the easy answer, but I don’t know. Are there die-hard Nationals fans?
[/QUOTE]

Expos! :stuck_out_tongue:

171

[QUOTE=storyteller0910]
Of all the fanbases in Major League Baseball, which is currently suffering from the worst mismanagement on the part of ownership and the GM?
[/QUOTE]

RickJay, do you have any opinions on this? :slight_smile:

172

[QUOTE=Cervaise]
The up side of the currently disastrous season is that it finally gave ownership the balls to cut away some serious dead weight in the management department. That Bavasi hung on by his fingernails, idiotic decision after idiotic decision and mediocre season after mediocre season, is an object lesson in indecisive leadership.

Let the rebuilding begin! :rolleyes:
[/QUOTE]

Can we get Pat Gillick back?

173

It’s gotta be the Nats, hands down. Old Leatherpants Bowden can’t seem to let go of his infatuation of former Reds players (where he used to be the GM) that suck, like Austin Kearns, Felipe Lopez, Dmitri Young (ok, he’s not awful, but mediocre), Ryan Wagner, Aaron Boone and Wily Mo Pena.

I am so glad the Reds are rid of him and now we’ve got Walt Jocketty.

174

[QUOTE=storyteller0910]
All factors are included, so as you say, the Astros, who were good not long ago, probably aren’t eligible. Which team is the team that, if someone came up to you right now and said, “I’m a die-hard XXX fan,” you’d respond with an audible wince?
[/QUOTE]

Pirates!
Or Brewers, because of Bud Selig.

175

The first team that came to mind were the Pirates. The Nationals haven’t been there long enough for the layers of crap to pile up.

176

[QUOTE=Rysto]
RickJay, do you have any opinions on this? :slight_smile:
[/QUOTE]

As much as I think J.P. Ricciardi has overstayed his welcome and had led the team into a dead end, no, they’re not the worst run team in baseball, for three reasons:

  1. While they’re at a dead end, they aren’t REALLY terrible.
  2. The franchise is otherwise much better run than it was during the Gord Ash years. Their marketing and fan relation work has improved dramatically; their purchase and upgrade of the stadium was a welcome move and long overdue.
  3. Other teams are worse.

It’s hard to imagine a team could be worse run, in the current MLB scenario, than the Nationals. I don’t agree with the Pirates at all; while they have been really bad for a long time I think there’s decent and well established ownership there and some potential goodness.

The Nationals, though… the entire point to that franchise appears to have consisted of getting a franchise and a stadium. Clearly there was no plan at all for what they were going to DO with a franchise. They’re an absolutely horrible team, top to bottom, don’t have a lot of talent in the wings, and their fan support, given the market size and their having a new stadium, is frighteningly poor.

The Marlins are also perpetually on life support business-wise, but at least they have exciting talent on the field and a new stadium may be on the way.

177

After thinking about it a while, I think there are four legitimate contenders, the Orioles, Royals, Pirates, and Marlins.

I’m surprised to see the Nationals mentioned. This is their fourth year of existence, they were a contender into the summer during year 1, and at least won 70+ games years two and three. That isn’t a long history of suffering. They also have a brand new stadium, which has to be considered a positive for fan enjoyment.

I also disagree that they have been badly run. Minaya left the team with very little in the way of assets, but given the situation that was an entirely reasonable course of actions. Bowdon has been a mixed bag, but he has done some very good things for the team. He traded Wilkerson for Soriano, convinced someone to take Jose Vidro off his hands, hired a promising young manager in Acta, and built a pretty interesting core of young hitters out of other teams’ unwanted players. Sure he has made significant mistakes like not trading Soriano, but I think he has done more good than bad. The future is bleak, but the team has to struggle for another decade or so until they approach the misery of the other aforementioned teams.

As for the other four I’d order them:

  1. Royals

They have been terrible for a long time, but they did at least contend for a while in 2003. They also have some very good young talent, and a division where two teams are very old, and the other two have recently traded away aces since they couldn’t afford them. There is a possible window for them within the next few years.

  1. Marlins

Marlins are difficult to rank as they have had much more on field success than the other options. Still it is difficult to root for a team who keeps trading away its best players, and complains about how their fan support is lacking.

2.Orioles

Not only have the Orioles been terrible, but they have been boring a terrible, losing with older mediocre players. They seem like there starting to turn things around, but matching the Yankees and Red Sox in resources or the Rays in talent will be very very difficult. They do have enough exciting young offensive talent to avoid the last spot at though.

  1. Pirates

Hiring a smart guy as gm, doesn’t undo 15 straight years of finishing under 500. They have run out team after team without stars who’s biggest ambition was to maybe win as many games as they lose. They still have little in the way of young talent, and many wasted draft choices has left the minors pretty bare. They are still a long ways from being a contender.

178

I’m glad they replaced both All-Star teams with the Blue Jays. Somebody end this…please.

I quit.

179

The NL (Cubbies!) is going to lose Homefield advantage because Dan Uggla can’t get out of his own damn way. He’s got 3 errors all ready, bobbled a couple other grounders that he barely salvaged and choked on what should have been a caught stealing throw. What a bum, I don’t care that he’s carrying my fantasy team.

180

Bud Selig thanks God…