I read a short story in a book written by Paul Theroux where he expresses his dislike for being a man. He says that the whole idea of being a man in America is pitiful. He thinks that the concept of being masculine is abusive and insulting. In his opinion being a man means: Be stupid, be unfeeling, obedient, soldierly and to stop thinking all together. Here is a direct quote from his writing that I cant help but disagree with.
“Man means “manly” -how can one think about men without considering the terrible ambition of manliness? And yet it is part of every mans life. It is a hideous and crippling lie; it not only insists on difference and convines at superiority, it is also by its very nature descrutive-emtionally damaging and socially harmful.”
I was wondering if anyone else in here thought the same as me. Thanks in return.
I don’t know what you think except that you disagree with Paul Theroux.
For my money everything he talks about is a cop-out. I’m an individual. That I happen to be male defines me only slightly more than having brown hair defines me. Society may have ‘norms’ for men and women but it is up to you to choose the individual you want to be. You may conform to Theroux’s notion of a man or you can be entirely different. That’s one of the cool things about consciousness and free-will…you can decide who you are and how you will act.
“For my money everything he talks about is a cop-out.”
First off what do you mean by “cop out.”
My question is do you think that its wrong for boys to be brought up and raised in believing in the masculine ideal. Theroux believes that it is wrong in many different ways…such as how young boys are taught to deal with women at a young age. He believes the concept of manliness is to belittle women. He says feminity implies needing a man as witness and sudcer but masculinity celebrates the exclusive company of men which is why there is no manliness without inadequacy because it denies men the natural friendship of women.
Also everyone is quite aware of how few in number athletes actually act like gentlemen, he says sports teach you to be a poor loser, the manly attitude toward sports seems to be little more than a recipe for creating bad marriages, social misfits, moral degenerates, sadists and latent rapists which I do sort of argee with.
He believes masculinity to be based on a lack of creatism and anyone who prefers to be creative is just uncompetitive and essentially solitary people.
He mostly objects to the way we turn boys into men.
IMHO Thoreau was a freak and a mental masurbateur.
Of course, ever since the abolition of “Man Class” which began for all of us (males) in 3rd grade men have become increasingly “womany.” But seriously, The “Man” Thoreau refers to is what we today would call a “Pig” in certain of our sub-cultures. In other sub-cultures it’s right on the mark. And perhaps there were more and stricter social sanctions for not being dominant, tough and competetive back then.
As a man (and I much prefer the term “guy”) I can honestly say that my IMPULSES tend more toward the model despised by HDT, but how I act is more in line with what is socially acceptable. I attribute this to having a normal level of testosterone and a normal desire to not be viewed with disgust by at least 50% of the people I associate with.
In light of the quote in the OP, maybe our society has already addressed in large part HDT’s concern. That said, I believe there is a place for competetiveness, toughness and the will to dominate all life (ala Sauron). There are times when the ability to turn off all emotion and bust heads is necessary. Women can do it effectively as is evidenced by women in positions of power within our society, but I would argue “not as easily as men.”
Is it wrong for boys to brought up with this ideal? It really depends on how effective the attitude is in a given culture. If the women don’t demand respect, they may not respect the man who gives it to them.
Simply put that because I am male I should be labelled as having the bad attributes he ascribes to men. That because male socialization occurs in a certain way men are somehow blameless for their actions. As though all men are cretins but really that’s a result of society and maybe biology.
As a man I was raised in the fashion Theroux describes. I was subject to the same societal pressures (generally speaking) all men in this country are. While I certainly have my asshole moments like anyone else does I do not believe I generally conform in any significant way to the ‘male’ described in the OP. Just because society pushes one way or the other does not absolve an individual from responsibility for who and what they are. To me it is a ‘cop-out’ to just kick back and not take personal responsibility for yourself. It’s akin to a serial killer who pleads for mercy because he was abused by his father. Sad as that is he’s still a prick and should be locked away forever. His past does not excuse what he does in the present.
How are boys taught to deal with women at a young age? I have no idea how Theroux thinks they’re taught or what they’re taught.
There may be something to the bit about femininity, but ideals of both men and women have changed in recent years.
That sounds like a bunch of overgeneralization. Plenty of non-gentlemen are non-athletes. SOME people are taught to be poor losers. I don’t think that has anything to do with sports, the mistakes are made by the teachers.
I consider myself creative, and I love sports. It’s fun to compete sometimes, in certain ways. And I think it’s fun to exert yourself. I’m a very non-competitive person when I’m not playing sports, and when people see that I enjoy athletics (which is usually a surprise in itself), they’re surprised that I compete.
What the hell is a “latent rapist?”
