Beliefs of Mormons

Factual Questions
1

A fellow schoolmate who is rather devout said, “I hope to have a big Mormon family.” Naturally, I was thinking that was a stereotypical kinda thing. However, it got me wondering. What are the views towards procreation? Are people encouraged to get married and breed? Would a person be looked on with disdain if he or she remains single after he or she reaches marriageable age?

On a related note, does a spouse have to also be a member of the Church? Would it be a total sacrilege to marry, or even date, an atheist?

Thanks.

Goomba

2

I’m sure an LDS will be along shortly to set all of this straight. But in the meantime, here’s what I’ve gathered.

A lot of what you observe isn’t religious, but cultural. Mormons (members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints, or “LDS”) do tend to marry early and have large families, but not because they’re following a biblical or Book of Mormon injunction. If you want to know what living in the LDS Church is like, don’t go to books on religion – get the books of cartoons by Pat Bagley and Calvin Grondahl. Both excellent cartoonists, both LDS, and both keen observers of the Salt Lake social scene. (One of the cartoons has a pair of booths at what is obviously the Utah State Fair. ZPG has a Zero Population Growth display, while the LDS display is labeled “Babies a Go-Go”. Another has a very pregnant woman surrounded by screaming kids saying to a neighbor that they’s “multiplied and repopulated the Earth, Mars, and part of Venus.” There are also gags about friends trying to hook up spinsters that are 23 years old.)

As for LDS weddings, they strongly encourage unions between Mormons, as all religions try to keep marriages between their own – it makes things simpler. In the case of the LDS, however, there’s an additional dimension, since the LDS “Sealing” ceremony can only be performed in a Temple, and only LDS “in good swtanding” and with a Temple REcommend can go to the Temple. LDS certainly can marry outside the faith (I know of such a couple), but they can’t get sealed. This is kinda like a Catholic getting a Civil Ceremony, but not being able to get the sacrament of Matrimony in a Church. I’ve been a Best Man at an LDS wedding – but, as I’m not LDS myself, and it wasn’t in a Temple, it wasn’t a Sealing.

3

I was raised mormon and was pretty active, including a full two year mission, until I got back home and sort changed my outlook on things. But here’s definitely an answer to your question.
Mormons are counselled by their prophet to take the book of Genesis seriously when God commands Adam and Eve to “multiply and replenish” the earth. Thus, large families. During an institute class I attended we were basically told that if we put off having children (like, right after marriage) - even for school or whatever, that we were indeed NOT following the prophet’s teachings. They want you to get crackin’ - there are lots of souls up there waiting for their earthly tabernacles. Mormon couples that have been married for a few years and have not yet had children definitely get plenty of crap for it! :slight_smile:

Mormons are heavily dissuaded from dating non-members - the premise being that you can’t marry a non-member in the temple, be sealed together for eternity, etc etc. Definitely a sorespot for a lot of people, and especially youths who take interest in non-members, only to have their parents vehemently oppose/forbid any such interaction on the basis that “you could fall in love!”

Any other questions?

4

lukas: Please don’t perpetuate incorrect “information.”

Feel free to do a search on this board for “Mormon” (and, due to some folks’ inability to spell “Morman”) and you’ll find a lot of information and bumpkis about the LDS. Luckily, you’ll be able to tell straight away who’s in the information camp and who’s in the bumpkis camp.

5

Considering the importance of Genesis in Mormon belief, is Creationism a central tenet?
Is polygamy still practised amongst Mormons?
Are posthumous baptisms still performed and is it true that Hitler and Stalin were so baptised? What was (is) the rationale for this practice?
Has there ever been a schism in the Church?
Is there a clergy and established hierarchy?
Was the founder considered the last and ultimate prophet as Muhammad is in Islam? Was (is) he considered to be divine or entirely mortal?
Are his teachings and pronouncements still accepted literally as in fundamentalist Christianity and Islam or have they been re-interpreted in the light of modern science and society?

6

I’m not a Mormon, BUT:

It’s been renounced as a belief, but yes, it’s still practiced by some.

I’ve heard that these are done. I don’t know if Stalin and Hitler were among them, but apparently Shakespeare and Einstein were. The idea is that it gets their souls into heaven. I’ve read that this practice got the Church into some trouble because they started posthumously baptising Jewish Holocaust victims. :mad: :confused: Some Jewish groups actively check these lists now to make sure that doesn’t happen again.

7

Welcome to the board Gest. As a suggestion it might be worthwhile to do some SDMB searchs on some of the extremely extensive board threads here relating to Mormon beliefs, culture and lifestyle that would answer most, if not all, of your questions.

I’ve asked a question or two about Mormon beliefs in my time here and have usually gotten (mostly) polite responses, but having said that, I’m beginning to understand the crankiness of some SDMB Mormon members at feeling like exotic zoo animals that people are always pestering.

8

I had considered doing a search as you had suggested astro, but thought better of it. If I’d wanted a list of names, dates and facts, I probably would have just found one of the homepages the Church surely would have. If the SDMB was solely a repository for the accumulated knowledge of its members, then I dare say any question in this forum would be redundant. One would think the archives cover almost every conceivable query.

Rather, in asking these questions here (and yet again), it’s the opinions of the members of the faith that I’m after. I was actually seeking to engage in a dialogue with the rank and file as it were rather than a monologue from the archives or Church literature. As instructive as such a monologue would be, it would leave me none the wiser as to breadth of opinion or depth of feeling of the average Mormon so to speak.

I also felt this would be the appropriate forum. I don’t have an agenda or sufficient background hence it’s not debate material (for me, at least) and it didn’t seem appropriate for IMHO either as I wouldn’t regard the opinions of Monty or Lukas as… humble enough when it comes to matters of fact regarding Church dogma.

Having said that, I hope I haven’t elicited any crankiness or ill feeling from the Mormon participants we’ve had thus far. My intention was surely not to pester anybody directly which was partly why I didn’t address the questions to any specific poster. However, thanks in advance to any for their views and in arrears to astro for the welcome.:slight_smile:

9

All scripture is considered important by the church.

No. Even advocating such a practice will get a member of the church excommunicated. Those who assert that it is practiced by some Mormons are incorrect. There are so-called splinter sects, which have nothing to do with the LDS church and some of those splinter sects practice or at least advocate polygamy.

Baptisms for the dead are routinely practiced withing the confines of the temples of the church. I’ve no idea if anyone performed the ceremony on behalf of Hitler or Stalin; however, I’d venture to say that I wouldn’t do it myself once I’m eligible to perform such ordinances.

Nobody baptizes the dead. Nobody goes to the grave and digs up the carcass. Essentially, the ceremony is just a prayer.

The basis for this practice is found in one verse in the New Testament and one section in the Doctrine & Covenants. Since we hold that the D&C is also scripture, we find that we don’t need a rationale for it.

The most important schism was the divide in the church after the murder of Joseph Smith, Jr. A few years after that murder, those who did not sustain Brigham Young as the president of the church formed their own. That church used to be called The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints (Reorganized) {and still maintains legal right to that title} but is now known as The Community of Christ.

We have what’s known as a lay ministry. In other words, no paid priests.

No. One of the basic tenets of our belief is that God will still reveal important matters regarding the church to the president of the church. In Islam, Muhammed (PBUH) is considered the Seal of the Prophets.

The president of the church is considered to be another mortal just as you and I are.

There’s a lot of debate on that amongst members of the church.

10

Do a search for the phrase “ask the mormon” going back about three months. I think it got to 5-6 pages. You’ll be absorbed for hours. (Hamsters wouldn’t let me search.)

11

CalMeacham is right. You have what’s called Mormonism, and you have what’s called The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints: the first is a cultural phenomenon, and the second is a religion. There are many Latter-day Saints who live a cultural Mormon life, and there are many Latter-day Saints who don’t. Saints outside of predominantly Latter-day Saint areas (areas of Utah, Idaho, Utah, Arizona, etc.) tend to be less homogenous or “Mormon”. This is especially true for Latter-day Saints outside the United States and Canada.

There are many reasons why Latter-day Saints have large families. The Church disourages people not having children for selfish reasons - however, medical and other reasons are acceptable. Sure, people might be harrassed for not having kids, but that’s a manifestation of the cultural and not religious or doctrinal side of the membership. (The Restored Gospel is perfect, the members are not.)

Unlike most other conservative Christian denominations, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is not adamantly opposed to birth control. It’s a matter between the couple and God, and must be prayerfully considered.

And almost all religions focus on marriage with members of the same religion and sect. Heck, in Islam, a Sunni marrying a Shi’a is huge issue and strongly frowned upon by both sides. (An uncle was introduced to a wonderful woman who was a potential wife for his son. His first question was, “But, isn’t she a Shi’a?” He would not tolerate his son marrying a Shi’a, despite my cousin’s not caring whether she was Shi’a or Sunni.) So, this isn’t specifically a Latter-day Saint hang-up.

Like most religious communities, this advocacy rests in an interest in the propagation and survival of the community. This might also be one reason why Latter-day Saints feel big families are good.

(Aside: Orthodox Jewish families can also tend to be big. Having children is a mitzvah, one of the first given to Adam and Eve. Latter-day Saints believe the first commandment given to Adam and Eve was “be fruitful and multiply”, which may be another reason why big families are good.)

And the reason Latter-day Saints are discouraged from dating non-Latter-day Saints is because dating is done with marriage in mind. Why date someone you can’t marry?

Latter-day Saints desire to “baptize” all the dead, regardless of creed, race, or morality. (Baptizing the dead - living people acting as a proxy for dead people, with the proxy being baptized on the dead person’s behalf. The deceased is free to accept or reject the ordinance). If they are eligible, the ordinance is valid and is acceptable. If is not eligible, the ordinance is null and void, even if the deceased wants it. There are those who believe shedding innocent blood makes all ordinances null and void for the living or the dead. But that’s just speculation. In this way, a punishment can be having an ordinance done for a person but then not having it be acceptable.

In any case, like all religions, Latter-day Saints believe that their religion is the supreme truth (although elements of the truth exist in all other religions), and so the work should be done for all. In deference to the Jewish community (Latter-day Saints and Jews get along quite well, this issue and missionary work notwithstanding), Holocaust victims cannot be baptized unless the person submitting the name is related to the victim. This standard exists for all names - one must be related to the deceased or get permission from the deceased’s relatives.

Oy, this should be enough for now. :slight_smile:

WRS

12

As a loose term, the term “mormon” is often applied to those splinter sects, however. Just as there are small splinter sects of the Catholic Church. But although they in some cases use the “Mormon Bible”, etc, they are not in any way shape or form connected to the mainstream LDS church. There are dozens of them, few with any great numbers, AFAIK (except the “Community of Christ” as Monty pointed out). You COULD say that those sects are A “mormon church” just so long as you don not get them confused with THE Mormom Church.

I though some of the higher level postions were paid? What is the level right above “Bishop”? (“Bishop” more or less equates to a Protestant “Minister” for those who don’t know).

13

Official Site of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints

Basic beliefs

Family History

Provident Living

The “level” above bishop is Stake President and they are lay ministry.

14

It is my understanding that this is why in media kits the church asks that it be identified as The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and its members be identified as LDS and not the mormon/morman/mormom church.

The entire ministry is a lay ministry from sunday school teachers, to bishops, missionaries, and stake presidents. In some areas the teachers of daily high school religon classes are paid a salary. I don’t know about in Utah or areas where the classs are held in buildings across from the public schools, but here in Texas where the classes are very early in the morning 5:45 am to 6:30 am in meeting houses, the “stipend” is so small that people who don’t understand why we do the things we do, would find it laughable that someone spends so much time for such an incidental amount of money. Well I guess that’s my point… it’s not about the money, it’s about the reason and the perceived benefit to the youth (and others) that we serve.

Finally, while they are not paid a salary for their time, their time is volunteered, at the highest levels of the church (the President and the Council of the Twelve Apostles) there is a modest living and travel stipend. They live in modest accomodations and do not travel “first class”.

15

In what way was my post perpetuating incorrect information? Everything I said was totally true. Mormons are taught to multiply and replenish and are admonished to not date non members. If you can look me dead in the eye and tell me that a mormon couple of 10 years who’re capable of having children, but choose to have none - and dont get any flack from other members and priesthood leaders, then you’re crazy. Hell, I’ve only been home from my mission about 2 years, and I get unbelievable guff just for the fact that I’m not married yet.

16

There is no book titled the “Mormon Bible”.

LDS scriptures include
The Bible most commonly found in the hands of LDS members is the King James version. (It is also the version that the church will send you if you request a free copy of the Bible.) The bible includes the Old Testament which is a set of sacred texts written prior to the birth of Christ. Many of these prophets in the Old Testament prophesy of the coming of a Savior and Redeemer.

The New Testament records the life of Jesus Christ who we (and other christian faiths) believe was that Savior and Redeemer and of the establishment of his original church on earth.

And
The Book of Mormon is another witness that Jesus Christ lived, and that He is God’s Son.

We also include as scripture, the Doctrine and Covenants which we believe contains revelations given to Joseph Smith, the prophet with some additions by his successors in the presidency of the Church regarding the restoration of Jesus Christs church on earth.

And the Pearl of Great Price which we believe contains revelations, translations, and narrations of Joseph Smith, which include among other things his testimony of Jesus Christ and how he came to have the plates that he would eventually with divine aid, translate into what would become known as The Book of Mormon.

lukaspriest I know you are addressing Monty and I am not at all trying to speak for him. But I do want to say that it seemed to me you are using a really broad brush with your statement:

.
As you well know the churches postion is that God’s commandment for His children to multiply and replenish the earth remains in force. And I don’t doubt you have encountered people who where this pushy (so to speak), my brother claims to feel as though he was pushed into serving a mission. However, not every ward/stake has all pushy leadership. Sure it happens, but it doesn’t happen in every congregation and your post did make it sound as if it was a universal practice within the church.

Abb

(An active, endowed, member, married to a non-member, who did not have her first child until over two years after she married and has has had only two sons, one of which died quite young, and who has never been “admonished”, “encouraged” or “given crap” about the small size of her family.)

17

I’ll keep this posting to you, lukas, out of the Pit where it reallly belongs because this thread is very interesting, in a GQ way. Accordingly I will keep it in GQ language.

Your posting is wrong in that:

  1. We are not taught to “multiply and replenish the Earth.” It is encouraged to have a family with children. It is up to the couple to determine the number of children they shall have. In other words: We ain’t taught to be baby factories.

  2. We are not admonished to date non-members. We may be encouraged to date those whom we may have a potential temple marriage, but that does not mean we are taught not to date people of other faiths.

  3. Don’t ever lie to me again.

  4. I don’t care what kind of guff you get from bigots of your acquaintance. The OP asked questions about church teachings–not teachings of some bigots. It is your problem, not mine, that you are unable to distinguish between the two.

18

Sorry. Having worked in a used book store (where we got quite a few “Book of Mormon”) we casually called it “the Mormon bible”. No offense intended.

I know several Mormons, and one dude I know will cheerfully date “gentiles” (note, I don’t care for that term, except as used by a Jew to refer to a Christian, but…), and he “wears the Temple” underwear (i know there is a better term for that, so again, excuse me), so if that is a “rule”- Lukas- it does not seem to be a Temple rule, but perhaps more a Utah culteral thing?

19

DrDeth: Oddly enough, a lot of people refer to the Qur’an as “The Muslim Bible.” That’s incorrect. The Old & New Testaments are, in fact, the Muslim’s Bible also. The Qur’an is additional revelation, AFATC. Just like the Book of Mormon is additional revelation AFAWC.

BTW, the “better term” for the underwear is Temple Garments.

20

Just chiming in here, as an LDS member who is currently living in Utah…

Some time ago my wife and I decided that our family was complete at four children. I came from a family of eight children, my wife from a family of seven (yes, we both came from LDS families). In all of our time in Utah we have not once been chastised, criticised, or rebuked for our decision.

Yes, we do know one couple here in Utah who feel strongly that they should have as many children as they are able. And we also knew one couple when we lived in Virginia that felt the same way (eleven so far, and still counting). But their decisions were not based on church doctrine or culture. That was just what they had decided, and I suspect they would have decided the same if they were not LDS. Yes, there are some obscure quotes from both major and minor leaders in the LDS faith in which opinions are stated and upon which you could base an opinion one way or the other, but the number of children an LDS family has is based upon a personal decision, not doctrine.