How do you mean, “flip?” Like she’s making too little of Willow’s pain? Eh. Buffy’s got everyone in the group trumped in the “relationship angst” department. I mean, sure, Tara died, but it’s not like Willow was forced to kill her herself. Considering that her friends are stabbing her in the back and throwing her out of her own home, I’d say that was positively restrained.
Probably too late for just another “me too” post, but: I thought it sucked. It just didn’t make any sense. I guess I should maybe be grateful that something finally happened this season. But all this time I’d been hoping that when something finally did happen, it would make sense.
People just don’t act like that. It was as if they were going for a really symbolic and powerful ending, but it was just dumb. You just don’t kick someone out of her own house. Especially if she’s just announced that someone super-powerful has tried to kill her earlier. And I don’t mean it in the sense that it was bad manners or a poor decision, it’s just something that doesn’t happen.
If they’d wanted their dramatic “Buffy is all alone” ending, they should’ve had everybody else file out of the house and leave her alone. That may seem like a trivial distinction, but it’s not. And the way they mis-handled it in the episode just drove home that these are no longer real characters, but just names that stuff happens to.
With the awful ending, and the deus-ex-machina inscription, and the killer cops, it’s as if they’re just not even bothering to explain themselves anymore.
[nitpick]And I was wondering why The Bronze was still open. They close the high school, they are evacuating the city, but they keep a nightclub open?[/nitpick]
Well, yeah, but people don’t naturally turn into mice and back again (and then back into mice) either.
Well right, which is why I’m not saying Willow is incapable of re-growing Xander’s eye. I was discussing the re-growing only in terms of “she regrew her skin and resurrected someone so she has to be able to re-grow Xander’s eye.”
I think I mentioned it last week but it has been established that medicinal magic isn’t totally reliable in the Buffyverse. That’s why Tara and Willow didn’t save Joyce because the odds were that they would just make it worse. I bet Willow could probably pull it off now but even a perfect job may have lingering side effects.
Remember dating anyone seriously in Buffy is a bad idea.
Buffy: Angel was sent a hell dimension, nearly killed lots of times, and their romance didn’t fair much better. He is forced to skip town. She pretty much screwed Riley over. And she turned Spike from a compelling character with some of the best lines, to a pathetic victim of the week, helpless as a puppy half the time, and tied to her apron strings the rest. Maybe Riley got off easy.
Willow: Xander broke her heart. She finally makes out with him at the wrong time, hosing two relationships. Oz broke her heart, and ended up a werewolf, forced to leave town. Tara dies, causing Willow to try kill her friends and end the world. Then she ends up with the biggest sack of one dimensional crap as a completely unbelievable girlfriend. Ugh.
Zander: Sigh. He chases a disinterested Buffy, ignoring Willow until its too late. He somehow ends up with Cordy, only to mess that up with Willow, who he could have dated before. Cordy leaves town too. He also hooked up with Inca Mummy Girl, and demon who wanted to drain him to open the seal. Need I meantion the whole horribly written failed engagement to Anya.
Given the bad things that happen to them, and the even worse things that happen to those they date, they seriously should think about investigating the wonderful world of on-line porn or powerful shower attachments. 
You forgot about the Teacher who wanted to eat Xander.
Re: Kicking Buffy Out
When everyone began questioning her decision, she was unwilling to discuss anyone else’s POV. She set it up as “fall in line” with me instead of trusting the people who have given her advice and help for seven years. She was the one who set it up as My Way or the Highway. When everyone made it clear that they didn’t like that plan, she could have discussed a new plan; but, rather, she forced them to choose.
Finally, Buffy was the one who said she wouldn’t stay and watch Faith lead them to death. She made the decision to leave even if it was Dawn who told her to leave. If she had been willing to be a part of the team rather than dictate, she could have stayed.
Uh, I think you got those events a little out of order along with implying a cause-and-effect relationship that doesn’t exist.
That’s because all season long they were setting her up as the boss. Giles told her to act like a General, make tough decisions, make them fall in line, lead them to battle. She didn’t want to do that, that’s not her style. And everytime after that, they did fall in line. Now though, when it really, really matters, they no longer respect her authority. I’m particularly disgusted and offended by Giles’ actions when he was the one who told her she had to the General, the boss, when he told her in BOTN that she was their only hope, that it all came down on her head. My husband said to me, “You know, she’s right. THose guys don’t do jack without her, and now they’re kicking her out? If I were her, I’d let them all die one by one.”
Well, I think they were right to throw her out (bad writing and all)
The only reason that Buffy has lived this long is because she’s different from all the other slayers that came before. And how is she different? She has friends - the Scoobies are good for her. But it’s not really “all about her”, it’s about the group. Yes she’s the Slayer. But slayers didn’t last long, when they didn’t have a support network.
::Wanders out of the thread, humming “I get by with a liitle help from my friends…”::
I didn’t intend it to be taken that way, rather a simple litany of a few of the many bad things that happen to those foolish enough to date the “big three”. But even seriously dating Giles has proven bad to long term survival chances.
The “throw out” plot line seems to be a tissue thin ruse to get Buffy out of the house and “vulnerable”.
But none of this makes sense. Killing the potentials was so important the first half of the season. Caleb has most of them at hand and lets them go. Now he knows where all of them are, and does nothing. Huh? Why not just surround the house that night with Bringers to kill the strays, then let Caleb stroll in, kill Buffy, Faith, Willow, then Spike. The rest would be easy pickings. The town is half empty anyway. Just kill them already!
Its like watching fricken Austin Powers here. . .
You might be on to something there, elf6c. Oz is actually Scott Evil in disguise.
elfc – I think you’re right to a certain extent. Except the first evil seems to get off on messing around with people’s heads.
On the other hand…seems to me most of the potentials wouldn’t be that big of a loss. Especially Kennedy. Please Kennedy.
Its all coming together now. . .
Hopefully Caleb turns her into a organ-filled Pinata. How they managed to pair up the best character on the show with the worst is beyond me. I wonder if this was some sort of Tori Spelling deal. . .
Seriously now, the First was obsessed with killing the potentials, even showing up personally to make sure it happened. Yet, just when it could actually kill them all, ot at least thing the herd a bit it farts around playing footsie with Caleb.
in the words of the great Scott Evil:
Scott: If you’ve got a time machine, why don’t you just go back and kill Austin Powers when he’s sitting on the crapper or something?
Dr. Evil: No, no, no.
or
Dr. Evil: As you know, every diabolical scheme I’ve hatched has been thwarted by Austin Powers. And why is that, ladies and gentlemen?
Scott: Because you never kill him when you get the chance, and you’re a dope?
or of course, the classic
Dr. Evil: Scott, I want you to meet daddy’s nemesis, Austin Powers
Scott Evil: What? Are you feeding him? Why don’t you just kill him?
Dr. Evil: I have an even better idea. I’m going to place him in an easily escapable situation involving an overly elaborate and exotic death.
Uhm, Miller, while I’ll grant you that Buffy could feel superior to her friends, let’s not forget Normal Again. She did, in fact, try to kill all of them except Giles. Not that I blame her.
Yeah, but that wasn’t remotely her fault, and she did stop herself before she did anything. Everyone else attempted (or, in Giles case, were completely willing to but never had the opportunity) to kill Dawn because of their own character defects. Willow going grief-crazy and tanking up on dark magics to cope, Giles deciding that saving the entire world was more important than saving Dawn (okay, Giles had a point there), and Faith just generally going bat-shit loco. Oh, and Xander summoned that dancin’ demon because he’s a commitment-phobic pussy with oatmeal for brains. Which I admit is stretching the point a bit, but details like that should never get in the way of a good rant.
And none of them stopped themselves from killing Dawn; someone (i.e. Buffy) had to step in and stop them from killing Dawn. And yeah, technically Faith never actually tried to kill Dawn, since Dawn didn’t exsist until season five, but everyone remembers her being there when the Mayor got all wormy, so I think that still counts.
Anyway, the point is that if Buffy had wanted to, she could have made everyone in the room look like heels by spinning past events as hard as everyone else was spinning last week’s events.
One last point: I really hope that black SIT with the broken arm is next SIT to go. “Ding Dong the witch is dead” my ass. If it weren’t for Buffy, she’d never have made it out of the freakin’ bus stop alive. Ungrateful little booger.
Okay, but just to play devil’s advocate here, grief makes people crazy sometimes. Not just eccentric-crazy, we’re talking underpants on the head territory. So if Buffy gets a get-out-of-attempted-murder free card on account of insanity, so should Willow, especially since we know that the Monsters of the Week are just outward manifestations of the characters’ inner problems. Er, that’s supposed to relate to the monster in Normal Again, not to Willow.
Now, here’s the other side to Buffy feeling superior to all her friends. Anya, well, there’s just no excuse for her, so I’m not even going to try, but some of the others are at least as good, as people, as Buffy.
True, Giles poisoned her. And repented, told her, and got fired for his troubles. Not his finest hour, I’ll grant you, but she made him dump Jenny because Jenny was, er, not at all responsible for Angel turning. So she gets to screw with his personal life even though it’s none of her bleeding business. Also as a direct result of Buffy’s pelvis meeting Angel’s is the fact that Giles gets mercilessly tortured and later, when Angel returns, Buffy keeps his resurrection secret from Giles, endangering not only his life but the lives of all the Scoobs (remember, when he came back he wasn’t exactly Mr. Personality). Plus, I really side with Giles on both the kill-Dawn and kill-Spike fronts, not just because I dislike both their characters, but because they were both bigger liabilities than they were assets.
Now, see, I suppose she could say she’s better than Faith. Of course, she would also be saying she’s better than Angel and Spike, because they’re both On a Mission of Redemption, same as our Newly Good Slayer. So, like I said, if she decides that she’s superior to Faith based on Faith’s past actions, it would be a major character break. One with which I wouldn’t agree, and not just because Faith’s the hottest thing on Tuesday nights since Willow went all bulky clothing again.
We’re going to say that Buffy is better than Xander because he summoned Sweet without understanding the consequences? This is the girl that boinked the soul out of Angel, remember. Sweet may have killed a couple of redshirts, but Angelus was the direct or indirect (i.e., The Judge) cause of death for countless people during his brief return, not least of which was Ms. Calendar. She also can’t take the high ground about withholding information (FTR, I’m in the camp that says that it wouldn’t have mattered if Xander told Buffy about the curse). See above, re: Angel’s season three return. Oh, and Xander has never willingly (crazy or no) tried to kill Dawn. Or anyone (alive), that I can recall.
Anyway, my point is that the Scoobs had ample reason to call Buffy out on her lack of, well, sane leadership recently. Let’s not forget, kiddies, that this is the same girl who allowed a psychotic killer (oh, I’m sorry, you called him their strongest ally, forgetting that Willow could take them both out with a thought) to help train some inexperienced girls, even though she knew the Ultimate Evil was out there pulling his strings. Nor should we forget that she is incapable of making a rational decision when Spike is involved, so much so that Giles, who has manifested a more level head than Buffy many times over the last seven years, tries to have him taken out of the picture without her consent. Then, in the latest and greatest example of her blundering, she leads them all into a big huge trap (AGAIN! See When She was Bad and Becoming, part One for more examples of how well this works) over everyone’s objections. Not only that, but she leaves her biggest weapon at the house. And what’s the result of this extremely poor decision-making? Deaths and maimings! Wow, I really don’t get why they didn’t rush to forgive her and head right back into the Cellar o’ Doom.
One last point. Just as we can’t really play the “who really meant to kill Dawn the mostest” game with these guys, we can’t play the “I’ve saved your life so you owe me” game either. They’ve all saved each other so many times that I’m sure they’ve all lost count. Sure, Buffy has probably saved the gang more times than they’ve saved her, but she’s also been the one that placed them in the danger that she’s saving them from, for the most part.
Actually, I mostly agree with what you said, wizard. The point of that rant was that Buffy should have fought back. She’s the Slayer, dammit. And she’s also pretty self-centered by nature. She should have laid into them. It doesn’t matter if what she said was accurate, it still would have been better drama.
And throwing Buffy out was just so incredibly stupid. If they wanted her alone and isolated from the rest of the cast, they should have had her walk out. She’s stubborn enough. Look at her break up with Riley, where she also felt betrayed. If they’d phrased it as an ultimatum, if they said “Do out our way or get out,” there’s no way she wouldn’t choose “get out.” The way they wrote it, all the character rang false. Even Xander, who I expected more bitterness from. This is the guy who said, “You want to forget all about Ms. Calender so you can have your boyfriend back.” That was drama, dammit. This was just embarassing.
I don’t see Buffy until Sunday night. We don’t get UPN but WB is nice enough to air it.
I’ve missed most of this season’s episodes and usually just check in here to see what’s going on. I’m getting a different vibe on last week’s show.
Anyone see Buffy as a martyr in the making? A Christ-like figure? The SITs have become Doubting Thomases and her best friends have denied her. She’s on her own, like Jesus in Gethsemane. Not sure what Caleb would tempt her with though, or who she’ll call on, now that everyone’s deserted her.
She will sacrifice herself to save the world, again.
Or not. I got a big religious vibe from the recent Angel arc too, with everyone being “saved by the blood” and my Sunday School lessons were a long time ago and have been well-mixed with Charlton Heston and Victor Mature movies.
But it’s a thought.