I have a twist on the old “When Harry met Sally” question of whether a man and a woman can be friends. For the record, I happen to agree with the movie, i.e. “no”. If you spend a lot of time with someone and you and that person are in each others’ demographic of interest, you should expect that the other person may develop romantic interests. Pretending otherwise is dickish. A girl I knew in college was really close friends with me and several other guys (the school was ~80% men); we all lusted after her and she acted shocked whenever any of us admitted it. Pretty dickish IMHO.
Back when I started grad school in my early 20s, another new student (a man) and I met and we hit it off famously. He was fairly effeminate but the question of whether either of us was gay never came up (initially). I remember thinking that I might be leading him on, but I also felt like that only makes sense if he assumes I’m gay, which I had never indicated that I was. [What a pain it must be to be gay…straight folks at least have probability working for them…].
At first it was fun, we had a lot in common and we commiserated about our stressful courses. It was the best friendship I had ever had up to that point. Interestingly, some mutual friends had asked him whether he was gay and he said no. I never asked him because I guess I didn’t care.
Fast forward a few months…the guy has clearly developed a major crush on me. Example: at one point, a very pretty girl in our class mentioned to him that she liked me, and afterwards he freaked out, getting teary and saying how he had “invested so much in our friendship”. I had to cut off contact with him to keep him from hovering around me in class & calling me all the time. But I felt like a dick for leading him on.
Hence, I am amending the previous rule. New rule: Don’t become close friends with someone if YOU are in THEIR preferred demographic, even if the opposite doesn’t apply and they know it. The heart is a complicated muscle, feelings form even when you don’t want them to. Don’t be a dick by leading someone on.
This one may be less strict – more true for men than women perhaps?
WTH? Of course a man and a woman can be friends. And a straight man and a gay man can be friends. And a straight woman and a gay woman can be friends.
What’s problematic, is a friendship where one person has or develops a strong romantic attraction to the other, which is not returned. That makes a friendship difficult or nearly impossible. But just being in the other person’s “preferred demographic” doesn’t make it inevitable, or even likely.
Dunno. I’m friends with plenty of men that I feel no sexual attraction to. Perhaps I’m too judgmental but I would consider a person who cannot spend time with a member of their preferred gender without becoming infatuated to be weak.
What the… I don’t even…How can you… Look, you’re massively, objectively wrong. Men and women can be friends. Straight and gay men can be friends. Ditto women and lesbians. It’s easy for anyone who’s a functioning adult to separate friendship and sex. Really.
I agree. I find it somewhat insulting when people say that men and women can’t be friends. Like men are only driven by their sexual desires, or that the only reason men would be friends with women is to get into their pants. And it’s not like people are attracted to everyone in their preferred gender.
Also, according to the terrible theory of “Don’t become close friends with someone if YOU are in THEIR preferred demographic”, does this mean that when anyone meets a bisexual person, they should run the other way? Poor bisexuals, no one would be their friends.
I agree with the OP that there’s the potential for a problem when one friend has an unrequited attraction for the other and it’s too bad it happened to the OP. But you shouldn’t project a possibility into a general rule.
Certainly. I have a few gay male friends, one of whom is a close friend and has been for years. Never been a problem. He’s never hit on me, or expressed any interest in that area whatsoever. He’s good friends with my wife as well.
I have women friends who I would never consider approaching in an amorous manner, nor they me. I don’t see why gay male friends would be any different.
You’ve gotta be kidding. You mean every gay man I know is doomed to eventually make a pass at me if we have too much contact, because I’m just so damned pretty? And all the straight women, too?
Any day now.
I have had several female friends. Most of them, I would have been willing to have a romantic relationship with, but they all had boyfriends, and were happy with them, and I knew it, and so I didn’t make any moves in that direction. You know, because I’m not a jerk.
The guys at Thank God I’m Atheist seem to do just fine. And now this thread has served an actual purpose, because it reminded me to go look at their southern road trip videos.
My best female friend during my thirties was a Lesbian who was ten years younger than I. Unlike many people that age she had very good boundaries and so did I.
We were mentors for each other. She taught me about homosexuality and I supported her in abuse issues she had. We’d still be close but she died in an accident.
I felt a deep affection for her and it was reciprocated. But it wasn’t sexual in nature. Sometimes people can confuse being loved by another person for a sexual attraction and that whole complication needs to be understood, I think, before adults can be friends with potential sexual partners.
But is it impossible? Not at all. It just requires understanding the various natures of mature love and having healthy boundaries with others.
Sorry, I always forget how much more evolved SDMB members are than I am. I will admit that most women who I really like as friends are also somewhat sexually attractive to me. I think that makes me a neanderthal jerk, yes?
As pointed out by Sam Lowry, you understand that your thesis means that no one can be friends with bisexuals, right?
I mean, I’m sorry that you had a friend who was a closeted and/or in-denial gay man who was also Full Of the Drama, but life is weird sometimes and you move on rather than making grand edicts about who others choose to be friends with.
I think it’s important to qualify that I’m referring to a close friendship, in the sense of spending significant amounts of one-on-one time. I think this risks stimulating an uncomfortable level of sexual attraction.
If you let something like that ruin a friendship, then yes, it does. If you have a modicum of self-control and look at women as people before rather then seeing them exclusively as an object of sexual desire, then no.
I had considered the bisexual problem. No idea what to think about it.
Reiterating from above, the issue is with extended one-on-one time type close friendships. I’m not saying “one cannot socialize with that person ever”.
You’re seriously judging on this? Like I’m weird for feeling this way? It was basically the whole point of one of the most popular romantic movies ever made. I’m clearly not alone.