If I say that Blacks tend to have kinkier hair than White people, is that a racist claim? If I say that they have more melanin in their skin, is that a racist claim?
Just because they similar claims have been made by out-and-out racists in the past, it does not follow that everyone making a similar claim is racist.
Oh, this discussion about intelligence is such bullshit. We know there are a ton of non-genetic things which can affect intelligence, such as early socialization or environmental exposure or nutrition. We have no idea how all these things fit together and we have no idea how they interact with genetics. And on top of that, we don’t even have a scientific way to demarcate “races” with regards to genes. So, we’ve got a bunch of racist speculative bullshit with no scientific basis masquerading as science.
It is when you equate claims about intelligence of a group with claims about the character of a group. Either that or you believe that character has a genetic component. So, which is it?
No. I’m pointing out that, for literally centuries, people have been claiming that black people are inherently inferior in intelligence. And for centuries, these people have been saying that they have good data and good reason to believe this. Also, for centuries, people have been saying that Jews are inherently greedier and less trustworthy. And for centuries, these people have been saying that they have good data and good reason to believe this.
Why is now different? They still have no good data, for either claim. Are you saying that the people in the past who thought black people were inferior, and Jews were greedier, weren’t racist? if you’re not saying this, then what are you saying?
What’s the difference between the people in past centuries who said black people were inferior in intelligence to the people in past centuries who said Jews were greedier? What’s the difference between the people in past centuries who said black people were inferior in intelligence to the people who make the same claim today?
If you mean no genetic component, then no, I’m not saying this.
I say, without any reasonable doubt or reservation, that people in 1840 who asserted “black people are inherently inferior in intelligence” were making a racist assertion. Do you disagree, magellan01? I also assert that people who made the same claim in 1880, 1920, and 1960, were also making racist assertions.
I don’t think it’s different today – if someone makes that same assertion, they’re still making a racist assertion. I don’t understand what changed, or when it changed.
Possibly. Hell, I personally think that’s probably the truth of it. But, still, nature may have resulted in intelligence having a genetic factor.
No, what I said is the truth of it. We simply don’t know enough about intelligence and genetics to make any definitive statements about how intelligence may break down along socially constructed “racial” lines. And anyone trying to pretend otherwise is a racist asshole.
There is now evidence. You just need to refer back to any of the threads to remind yourself of it. As I’ve said, I think the evidence is week, and that any small genetic advantage that may exist is likely a smaller factor than all the cultural ones you’ve cited in those threads. Still, there is evidence.
Surely you are not of the mind that CP is making these claims with no more evidence than a racist in 1820. Right?
No, there is no evidence, and if you read the threads that CP has been involved in (you bigoted fuck) you would know that his “evidence” gets shot down routinely. He’s just very persistent in posting the same crap over and over.
If you want to argue, “b-b-but there are no races!!”, you’re really just avoiding the discussion in those threads. Really.
Yes, there are socially constructed races, moron. But we’re talking about genetics. If you don’t understand the difference here, then you’re too ignorant to be lecturing anybody about the topic.
Oh brother, you’re seeing the light. Typical pit threads are about as exciting as watching octogenarians fornicate, or the post-coital unconsciousness that follows their efforts.
That is not my recollection. What I recall is that his evidence gets characterized as weak (which I agree with), But that is not the same as zero evidence. You may want to go back and read some of those threads. You are m mistaken here. Whether I am a racist or not.
No, I’m not mistaken. He posts ahistorical bullshit and bad genetics and then ignores all the refutations.
He’s an idiot lecturing people about intelligence.
I still think you’re mistaken. And why do you think he “ignores” the refutations offered? Why is he not simply unconvinced by the counter explanations?
Actually this is pretty much what I’m saying. The data he puts forward is uniformly not actual evidence for the assertion that black people are inherently inferior in intelligence due to genetics. It might be evidence for something, but not for that, in my view.
Is the empirical evidence of IQ disparities among ethnic groups (notably the higher averages among Ashkenazi Jews) valid?
If the genetic mechanism isn’t explained does that negate the underlying trend being observed? Does it make one a “racist” to say, based on one measure of intelligence, Ashkenazi Jews are intellectually superior to other ethnic groups?
Are you uncomfortable with the notion that fighting ignorance might involve supposedly “racist” implications? Am I a racist just for asking these questions (JAQ’ing off, as they say)?
It is, in fact, evidence for his position. It’s just not direct evidence identifying the gene. You’re just trying to not allow the discussion until the actual gene is identified and we see a higher prevalence of them among non-Black races. Surely you’re aware that science usually works the other way. You make a hypothesis based on observation, do research to understand things better, then, if you are right, you might actually find proof that shows that your hypothesis was correct.
Hey, you racist dickhead. I know you were in the thread where we discussed the Ashkenazi and then you ran away from it after you were shown what an idiot you were. So don’t fucking try to bring it up here again like you have a new point. In thread after thread, you show yourself to be a complete idiot. Where do you get off lecturing people about intelligence?
You are a racist because you refuse to learn anything about intelligence development or genetics and keep spouting the same nonsense over and over.
Oh, please. In addition to being a homobigot, you’re also clearly a racist. I’ve given my refutations in many of his threads. Go fucking read them and educate yourself. It’s clear you don’t know the first thing about genetics or how the human brain develops. You’re just a racist moron who wants to spout out about yet another topic you haven’t studied.