Okay… hello i’m tee- ur neighborhood friendly, and out lesbian. (also very very new to this site- love it here). but i have a question… what’s up with the christian discrimination towards homosexuals? i thought christians were suppost to love everyone (even their enemy). it’s to the point where i think im the only homosexual i know who still believes in god. It’s like every christian i meet is like “oh… ur one of those ppl” grr?
My sister is a very strong christian and i wish others had her “you are who you are attitude”.
can’t we all just get along?
whats up with the whole fight?
Some just don’t like homosexuals.
It says various things in the Bible about homosexuality being a sin, or I think it does. More importantly, THEY think it does.
Some people think that since God made Adam and Eve (and if someone comes in with that stupid Adam and Steve line, I’ll clock you), that’s exactly how we should be.
Some people are scared of the Homosexual Agenda.
Some people think homosexuals are out to molest kids and children and convert them to the Homo Cause.
And then some get posted in the wrong forum, fomenting fear and discontent.
Eeny, meeny, miny, mo…
GD? Pit? IMHO?
Hi, rainbowskittles, and welcome to the board!
We have a vocal minority of Christians here (myself included) who are quite happy to call gay men and women their brothers and sistrs, and stand beside them in the battles against bigotry. (Others will, I’m sure, be along to add their voices.)
I could link you to a number of sites that expose the worldwide nefarious conspiracy that I’m sure you’ll be surprised to find you belong to, which has the goal of subverting the faith once given to the apostles. I could, that is, but I limit my exposure to that sort of toxic waste. See my “Snopes’s Evil Twin” thread here in the Pit for a typical sample.
Andygirl, one of our well-beloved longtime members, isa devout Methodist and a Lesbian. Thre are a couple of other gay Christians on the board, whose screennames I don’t recall right at the moment.
Cute Ike.
OOOhhh! Let me pick. I vote GD. Too tame for the Pit. Too controversial for IMHO. Let’s find this thread a home.
I could speak of such in hypothetical terms, but I’m afraid that I could not accurately put forth such arguments. What type of discrimination are you talking about – are you speaking of opposition towards homosexual acts, or actively trying to prevent homosexual persons from taking certain actions?
I do believe they are. If anyone’s heard otherwise, please let me know.
I’m sorry you have come to feel so alienated from your religious beliefs by way of your sexual orientation. However, there’s actually a wealth of resources available on the internet and elsewhere for those who both identify as homosexual and Christian – everything from support groups to discussion groups within various faith traditions to churches which promote being open and affirming to churches which exist primarily to minister to those who are GLBT. If there’s anything you’re looking for, here’s a great place to ask!
I don’t quite understand, but I’m also not a Christian either. There are verses in the Bible which may appear to portray homosexual acts as contrary to the will of God; however, there is controversy over such verses. Then again, there is that bit about love, which is rather important.
Welcome, rainbowskittles! (I keep hearing that old Skittles commercial in my head now! :p)
All true.
Many Christians also tend to be socially conservative, and consider homosexuality a threat to traditional values of marriage and family.
The Old Testament does mention homosexuality as a sin (Leviticus). Of course, it classifies a wide range of activities as sins, in between enthusiastic accounts of massacres and murders, many of which are considered okay (or nonexistent -witchcraft) today. But there’s a certain type of bloody-minded thinker, whether they call themselves Christian, Muslim, atheist or whatever, who have never let logic get in the way of their own much-cherished prejudices.
The New Testament has much more to say about simply loving your neighbour and not judging him than who’s good and who’s bad.
It may now be too tame for the Pit, fruitbat, but if there are two things I’ve learned about sexuality issues discussed on the board:
- Gay man will always show up and be fabulous
- Things, in general, can get ugly
Now on to the meat (ha) of this question. There are a few factors that contribute to ignorance/bigotry, in general (not at all limited to those who self-identify as Christian):
- Lack of desire to be educated on the matter (to the point sometimes where people figuratively run around with their fingers in their ears refusing to either listen to facts or assimilate asid facts into their worldview)
- Fear of the topic itself (which means, for practical purposes, that you’re afraid of being confronted by the person/thing you’re ignorant about)
- The belief that if things change, life will be worse for you
Add to this mixture a shepherd/flock analogy where the flock is afraid of listening to anything the shepherd doesn’t approve (or, sometimes, say himself), and you have people who are afraid of anything they haven’t been told about before. It’s actually kinda sad.
Not that I believe that particular myth, but in the interest of accuracy, there is no such mention in Leviticus. Leviticus is generally translated in terms of men “lying with” men as they would with women. There is no mention of women lying with women, which were the verse a blanket declaration on the sinfulness of homosexuality would seem to be required.
I’m sure our Wiccan and pagan Dopers will be along in a moment to take issue with your characterization of their religion as “non-existent,” but in case they don’t make it, would you please, oh I don’t know, have some idea of what you’re talking about before you post nonsense?
Unless you’re not referring to the passages that say things like “thou shalt not lie with man as with woman; it is an abomination”, this is incorrect. While it is arguable that there are a few passages in Leviticus that specifically proscribe against “homosexual acts”, there is absolutely nil in the bible that says that the natural tendency to people of one’s own sex (as opposed to the natural tendency to people opposite one’s sex, or the natural tendency to both) is a sin.
What is even more amusing is that those who quote this particular passage as having to do with a proscription against non-heterosexuals is that they do not realize that in order for man to lie with man as with woman, that man and woman would first have to engage in some form of non-vaginal intercourse, seeing as very very few men have vaginas:D
13 If a man also lie with mankind, as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.
That is the verse. There are other, but they all say basically the same thing. I don’t see how you can argue with the basic meaning of the verse. The archaic defination of “lie with” is ‘To have sexual intercourse with’ (I checked two dictionaries). People have been twisting the Bible to suit there own needs for centuries, so I really shouldn’t be surprised.
So we’re back to Old Testament Hebrews writing in 17th century English, again? Or do you have a fantastic dictionary? I want one.
People certainly HAVE been twisting the language for centuries to suit their own needs. . .
Got it. So, should I put my penis in another man’s vagina, we would be committing an abomination. That makes sense.
“It’s always Leviticus. Thou shalt not lie with man as with woman. Well, I don’t.” - Maggie Cassella
I’ve never understood how this verse is supposed to apply to me. I’ve never lain with a woman, so how would I lie with a man like that?
Well, that’s not true. I lay with a woman once. Andygirl crashed at my place for Pride last year and we shared my bed.
We didn’t touch each other all night. So would that mean I have to sleep with any guy who finds himself in my bed?
I’ll just pre-emptively revise this to “have sex with any guy…” to avoid the obvious joke, thank you.
You blew it, matt! You were covered, not having lain with women, up until that point. But you had to go and sleep in the same bed with Andygirl! Now whenever you have sex with a guy, you’ll be “lying as with a woman.”
It’s celibacy for you from here on in!
;j
Oh come on… by quibbling with the precise wording, you’re implicitly surrendering the far more important and meaningful part of the argument, which is that those early old testament books include all sorts of random stuff which does not apply to modern day Christians… dietary laws, how to deal with your slaves, horrible sexism, etc.
Any remotely impartial reading of that passage will conclude that the Bible does, in fact, in that passage, in whatever context that passages should be read, claim that gay sex is a sin. But who cares? That doesn’t mean that Christianity and homosexuality are incompatible.
Getting knotted up about “lie with like” misses the forest for the trees, imho.
Just to verify…according must Christian doctrines, the only time the “random stuff” in the old testament is no longer valid is when they are devalified (is that a word 
) in the new testament. Example:
Exodus:24 Eye for eye, tooth for tooth, hand for hand, foot for foot
then in Mathew, Jesus revokes the Exodu law
38 Ye have heard that it hath been said, An eye for an eye, and a tooth for a tooth:
39 But I say unto you, That ye resist not evil: but whosoever shall smite thee on thy right cheek, turn to him the other also.
I could be wrong, but I don’t remember where Lev.'s homosexual verses where revoked anywhere in the new testament.