In my experience I would use the word ‘sexist’. Misogynist is rarely used by people in my life, and refers to something stronger than saying women’s sports are unwatchable. People who beat their wives because they think women are contemptable subhumans are misogynists. People who think it’s not worth it to watch women’s sports, because they think it’s more fun to watch men, well, that’s a matter of (sexist) taste. To be honest in a bro conversation a homo joke would not be out of place - he’s clearly not watching to admire pure athleticism if women are unwatchable.
So when I read threads like this I have to constantly remind myself that ‘misogynist’ is thrown around rather lightly. Hateful isn’t part of it on the SDMB, at least not to the extent I would expect in any other context. As Left_Hand_of_Dorkness defined it,
When the performers and creators are classified by gender, that’s sexism. When the gender so classified is women, that’s misogyny.
Even if I were unwilling to construe misogyny so broadly, I still agree with MrDibble who writes in the alternative,
Mostly some flavour of sexist , though? Yeah, that’s the way I’d bet.
And the distinction between the two is semantic only.
It’s not just about the effect of the modding on the particular poster, but also on the rest of us, in as much as it speaks to a certain attitude and, more importantly, interpretations of the rules, that any of us could possibly be affected by. I’m referring to the retaliatory, and frankly petulant, tone of Chronos’ warning, as well as the invention of a “mandatory warning” rule out of seeming thin air by Hari_Seldon.
Same here. Especially when we know that previous poor or outright non-modding of misogyny has caused female posters to quit the board before.
No one thinks that she’s in danger of getting banned. That’s not the issue. It was just unbelievably tone deaf after such an egregiously bad call was corrected (and I do appreciate that). Then @Hari_Seldon claimed that their hands were tied and it was “mandatory” when it was very very clearly a discretionary call.
It couldn’t be clearer that the mods don’t really want to mod misogyny. And that when pushed, and ONLY when pushed, they’ll do as little as possible. Ugh.
But more than ready to take a swipe at Helena330 for poor form. Ugh.
I’ve heard someone say, “No one wants to watch women’s golf because it’s totally dominated by Korean players” while Danielle Kang, Megan Khang and Lydia Ko were in the top 5 on the leaderboard. The first two are American, the third is a New Zealander!
So, close. To make matters worse, this tool is married to a Japanese American (umpteen generation Japanese-American). His wife defended him!
The house style at one of my publishers is that sexist describes actions that discriminate against one sex (almost always against women), and misogynist describes the feeling or motivation of a hatred (or at least a strong disdain) for women.
In common parlance, though, they’re basically synonyms.
FWIW I think the “strong disdain” meaning is pretty common, and is evidenced in the linked thread, and is the sort of misogyny we too often see on this board.
I’m torn on this one. I run into dalej42 pretty often in the Game Room. He’s certainly ramped up his misogynistic posts regarding female athletes of late, but honestly, they pale in comparison to his constant bitching about male athletes who dare to express their feelings about social justice, police brutality, etc. IMO, the topic ban is too narrow.
Also, I honestly don’t feel like his SI Sportsman of the Year post was “blatantly misogynistic” - it was only misogynistic in light of his history. I came into that thread to make the same suggestion, and could see myself having used the exact same language - and not as a shot against Biles and Osaka, but in celebration of them.
I’m not sure anyone is taking the mandatory warning thing seriously; I do think that was silly but I think it was Hari miscommunicating.
I 100% get where you are coming from on Helena, I thought her posts in the thread were mostly good and a good response to dale’s nonsense. But looking at the specific passage she got warned for:
I think it’s two things, “this tolerance of misogyny is disappointing and vile” seems like a very deliberate, very direct criticism of moderator’s moderating in a non-ATMB forum. She then adds on that she disapproves of his threat to warn, that’s arguably two strikes for attacking a mod’s moderating in a non-ATMB thread. Then at the end she signs off with “I’m fully prepared to take this warning”, which I think made it clear she knew she was breaking the rules and was doing so deliberately to make a statement.
I agree with her opinion on dale and her general outlook in that thread, but she was basically deliberately flouting a rule to deliberately eat a warning. I do think that somewhat tied the mods hands, I think they could’ve come down on the other side of it, but I think it’s a difficult call and one that ultimately is discretionary. That is what we “pay” (in non-existent money) these mods to do.
I think that’s a different strategy than Helena was using. I could be wrong, though. King wanted to be arrested to bring visibility to the movement. Helena had something that needed to be said, and she (?) was willing to take a warning over it.
Doesn’t mean that she should take a warning over it.
I honestly don’t understand the purpose of a topic ban. If the person has shown a pattern, despite corrections and warnings that they will continue to be a problem, they should be gone. Period.
I for one would be okay if you stop playing judge and just call ‘em as you see ‘em. It is ok to be wrong. It is ok to reverse a ruling.
The taking time to get all mods to agree resulted in a warning for Helena and a whole thread of people clearly irritated with the lack of (visible) action.
I appreciate that you have been working hard on this the whole weekend.
I believe the result would have been better if Dales post had been noted “pending review” directly. Then we would have less outraged posters, less urgent “endless mod-loop discussion”. Less work for everyone.