Maybe I’m alone on this one but it seems like the Levy family needs to move on stop blaming Condit with no proof that he did anything to contribute to the disappearance of their daughter. The police have interviewed him 4 or 5 times and do not consider him a suspect. I realize that the parents are desperate for closure but the reality is that as of now, the whereabouts of this woman are a complete mystery. All Condit can really be accused of at this stage is being in the wrong place at the wrong time.
Maybe the guy is a scumbag, his wife probably thinks so, but whatever happened to “innocent until proven guilty”? I read that they are “very suspicious” that he wouldn’t meet with their private investigators. I don’t think that given similar circumstances, I would be inclined to do that either. And I wouldn’t be all that open to speaking with the media either. Hell, they have practically convicted him already.
The likelyhood is, the guy had an affair. He didn’t come out and proclaim this because, duh, he didn’t want his wife to know. I’m not saying that is admirable, but unreasonable?
That doesn’t mean that he killed her. Hell, there is no proof that she is even dead. In other words, no proof that a crime has even been committed.
That only applies to Courts of Law. In the Court of Public Opinion, a well-delivered accusation, no matter how baseless, can be the most damning thing of all. Especially if they make jokes about it on The Tonight Show.
IIRC, lying to police officers is a crime, that being obstruction of justice. Further, I seem to recall that he told DC police that he was not romantically involved with the intern when questioned about her disappearence.
There is no proof she is dead. Proof would be her dead body. Then the murder investigation could begin. There is proof that she is missing, and the circumstances strongly suggest foul play of some sort.
Someone has GOT to use this as a sig . . . I would, but mine’s already long enough:)
I recall hearing on the radio about the “privately-administered” polygraph test Condit took. Apparently it was of no use to the police because it didn’t show where questions had been asked, or what specific questions were asked, or something like that. The people on the radio compared it to OJ trying to find the “real killer.” FWTW.
spooje, as I heard it, lying to the cops is not actually a crime, lying to the FBI, OTOH, was most certainly a crime. We’ll need a lawyer to help us with this one.
Anyway, as to the ‘Innocent until proven Guilty’ line, that’s complete bullshit. You are innocent if you didn’t commit the crime!!! Whether or not a court can prove you guilty is only relevant in regards to the government punishing you for committing the crime. Just because a criminal is good (or lucky) enough to cover his tracks, doesn’t make him innocent.
That line should read ‘The government must treat you as if you were innocent, until you are proven guilty.’
I think you have to put yourself in the Levy’s shoes in looking at this situation. Assuming Condit didn’t have anything to do with the disappearance, he still mislead the police. So, to the Levys, Condit is, at best, a guy who wanted to cover his ass more than help find their daughter. I’d be pretty pissed myself.
There are three possibilities for what Condit did:[List=1]
[li] He killed her, or had something to do with the disappearance and lied to cover it up.[/li]
[li] He didn’t have anything to do with it, but early cooperation could have helped find her.[/li]
[li] He didn’t have anything to do with it and early cooperation wouldn’t have helped.[/List=1][/li]
If it’s 1 or 2, the Levys, as parents, have every right to be royally pissed. The thing about # 3 is that we might never know if this is the situation. All the Levys know is that the guy mislead the police, so I’m going to cut them some slack if they want to assume its 1 or 2 and not 3.
I’m inclined to believe that he lied to cover his ass. I never said he was a good guy. And if I was the Levy’s, I would be pissed off too. But he hasn’t done anything that has caused the police to believe that he was involved in any way.
It would seem that the daily attacks on Condit from the Levy’s serve one purpose and that is to keep this story in the news. Granted, that increases their chance of finding their daughter and if I put myself in their shoes, I can’t say that I would act any differently.
But until something comes up that points to Condit, in any way, as it stands he is only guilty of extremely poor judgement. That does not equate to murder. At some point, you have to move on and explore other possibilities. You have to consider that maybe your accusations are not correct. People have affairs every day, that doesn’t mean they murder them afterwards.
In a small way, they are very lucky that their daughter had this affair with Condit. Otherwise, this story would get buried with all the other missing person cases after a few days. How it must feel for the families of other missing persons, who do not have the luxury of it being a nationwide news story.
I’m not so sure about that. The cops have said he’s not a suspect, but in Washington the phrase “not a suspect” is not the phrase you want said after your name. Marc Fisher, a columnist for the Washington Post has said that his police sources have said that the believe Condit is still hiding information and that many are unhappy with the deference Condit received from the police. Does this make him a murderer? No. But you can’t really go by the public pronouncements that the police are happy with Condit. The DC police are very careful when dealing with congressmen.
The way the Levys are acting is, I think, partly a reflection of this reality. They believe he is still withholding information. The fact that the police have interviewed Condit four or five times tends to show that the Levys aren’t being entirely irrational.
I’m not saying Condit did anything. But look at it from the Levy’s perspective: Condit lied to the cops initially, and the cops have felt it necessary to interview Condit repeatedly and search his apartment. Right now, it’s the strongest lead anybody has. If it was my daughter missing, I’d be pressuring Condit, too. Not because he had an affair with my daughter, but because he seems to be acting evasively. Given the three possibilities I mentioned in my first post, the smartest course for the Levys is to keep up the pressure, in my opinion.
My understanding though was that it was given by a FBI expert who had many years of experience giving polygraph tests. If I’m not mistaken, he stated after the test that there was no indication that Condit was being deceitful during the tests. That seems to be a far cry from OJ, who, as I understand, never came close to passing a polygraph.
Sorry, the quote above should not have been attributed to Spoofe, my apologies.
And yes, I agree that the police absolutely considered him a suspect initially. They seem to have cooled to that idea though. Or maybe as you suggest, they are just being extremely careful because he is a congressman.
This may be a bizarre theory but I have wondered if perhaps she is sitting somewhere, watching all of this transpire and watching him sweat as his political future dissolves. Hell hath no fury like a woman scorned.
I have sympathy for the Levy’s, can only imagine their horrible situation.
Mr. Condit was apparently correct about his concern regarding disclosing personal information to the police (ie, police ‘sources’ have confirmed the affair, there’s been leaks after leaks regarding what he’s said to the police etc.)
The police searched his appartment because he allowed it. pure and simple. Apparently they found nothing that gives them any idea where she is today.
There’s apparently quite a few folks in her appartment building who’ve never answered the police’s attempts to question them. Why aren’t the Levy’s naming them on the nights news, and complaining that they’re not ‘telling all they know’???
Condit’s position could legitimately have been “I don’t know where she is, have no idea what may have happened to her. Yea, I had an affair with her, but I’m certain it has nothing to do with her disappearance, why send the police on a wild goose hunt towards something that has nothing to do with her disappearance, and may also get leaked to the press and therefore harm me?”
The Levy’s most recent statements (“had ‘deep suspicions’ about Condit’s involvement in his daughter’s disappearance”) while they serve the pupose of keeping their daughters disappearance in the headlines (as opposed to the thousands of other young women who disappear), not only do less than nothing to help the police find their daughter, but IMHO, at this point are worse than Condit’s original reluctance to come clean w/the police about his relationship. By forcing the police to continue to answer media’s questions about Condit’s ‘involvement’, this is time that would be better served actually looking for the woman. They have checked out Condit’s actions during the period of time in question. He appeared to have been with the Vice President, in the House, in his office and/or with his wife during the day/2 days that her whereabouts were last known. The Levy’s should allow the police to investigate the case according to where the evidence leads, not according to what’s the juciest angle.
I’m not arguing that the Levys strategy will ultimately lead to resolution of the issue. I was responding to musicguy’s OP in which he seemed to be questioning why the Levys are acting this way.
But I do want to address a couple of your points:
He made the choice to save himself embarrassment instead of giving information that can be helpful. Whether the subsequent publicity validates that choice or not doesn’t really address the issue of whether the Levys should be pressuring him.
He made his choice and paid the consequence of the Levys (and the police to an extent) not believing him. The guy lied and now the Levys don’t trust him and are pressuring him. The issue isn’t whether the Levys are objectively right, it’s whether that’s a reasonable course to pursue.
Well, if they ask they can search my house too. But they don’t want to. They searched Condit’s apartment because they thought it would be helpful. Perhaps it wasn’t, but to say they searched only because they were invited isn’t accurate.
Because they weren’t banging Chandra. People who have intimate relationships with missing people are always the focus. Again, I’m not saying Condit is still holding out. But when it takes a person three interviews to admit a highly relevant fact, that person’s veracity is clearly open to question.
If Condit’s watched the Discovery Channel or read any crime books he knows that police want information from intimate associates even if they know that person isn’t guilty. And your scenario would be a little more believable if he had only denied the affair in the first interview. But when the police come back a second time asking, it’s a clear indication that they believe the information you have is relevant. Only a willfully blind person would cling to the idea that hiding the information won’t hurt the investigation.
I think any investigator would rather a person with possible material evidence come clean in the first few days when the investigation is fresh. The Levy’s pressure might end up being harmful but it’s a stretch to say it’s worse given that every cop I’ve ever heard said the first few days are the most important.
Of course, none of this means that Condit did it or that the Levys pressure will pay off. But it’s all they got going right now and I think I’d be doing the same thing in their shoes.
I also meant to add that Billy Martin, the Levy’s lawyer, knows his way around a politically charged investigation. I would guess that the public statements about Condit are only a part of his strategy – and not a part that would harm the chances of finding Chandra Levy. In his estimation, it’s best to do what they are doing and he has much greater knowledge of the overall investigation than we do.
It’s possible that, in five years time, Martin’s strategy will be proven wrong. But he is an extremely astute guy and sees this as the best way. So I doubt that the public statements are more harmful than Condit’s failure to divulge relevant information in two separate interviews.
You’re assuming that her relationship w/Convey is ‘highly relevant’ to her disappearance. The fact the police would ‘want to know everything’ doesn’t mean that ‘everything’ is relevant. According to her last known communication (to her mother), she was heading home. She apparently was packed, ready to vacate her apartment, had advised other people she was heading back to CA. So, how is the identity of who she was fucking the week before relevant to what she did that day, given her plan to leave town?
RE: her neighbors, we don’t know what they may or may not e able to say, 'cause they’ve refused to talk to the police at all. Condit has been repeatedly interviewed. Yet, the Levy’s only focus is on Condit. “has he been completely truthful, has he told as much as he knows etc” . Again, we know that Condit has at least, talked to the police, submitted to a search of his appartment, had his phone records checked, had his wife and staff interviewed, had his personal whereabouts checked, and nothing has led to any evidence of where she is, or that Condit knows anything about where she is or what happened to her. The same cannot be said for these other people. Her neighbors may have information about when they last saw her, her general habits, and, for all the police know, may have had intimate relations with them as well. They don’t know 'cause these people have refused to cooperate at all. But they are busy answering news reporters questions about Condit, based on the Levy’s continued accusations.
Again. Consider the position of some one who knows that they had nothing to do with the person’s disappearance and know nothing about where they are now. Knows that being open with the police will lead to that information being leaked to the press and more importantly, will not lead to information about where the woman is. And frankly, that’s where we are now. After all the time and energy spent on talking to COndit, searching his residence, talking to his family and staff, the police are no closer to having any idea what happened to Levy than they were day one. Given that piece of truth, it is more unreasonable to me, to believe that continuing focus on in this one person will lead in the future to any useful information.
the police are certain (and have been for quite some time) thatCondit’s not central to the case , so the Levy’s continued insistance that the Congressman has something to do with her disappearance borders on slander. And on a more practical point, has not led to any relevant information as to her whereabouts or what happened to her. On the other hand, it has encouraged false FBI reports and much wasted police investigation time. ( re the search this suggests that the police search
has Condit acted perfectly? of course not. However, he’s also cooperated more than most of the other people involved in this case, subjected himself and his family to more scrutiny than anyone else, and the end result is that the police are still saying that Condit is not central to the case. Wouldn’t it make more sense to pursue leads not already checked??
I suspect that the Levy’s (and their attorney) are aware that ‘cold cases’ don’t garner much investigator time, that the only reason the media is still focusing on her case is 'cause of the congressman, and if the focus goes off him, then the investigation would also go away.
But that’s insufficient cause to continue to focus attention on the one person that they’ve checked on and wasn’t even around when she disappeared. IOW, time spent investigating where Condit threw away some watch box some one else gave him, diminished the available time for an investigator, to say, attempt again to interview for the first time, her neighbors. Which leads me to suggest that this insistance on focusing on the Congressman is actually taking investigators time away from persuing other more likely to be profitable leads.
Let’s not forget Richard Jewel and the Atlanta Olympic bombing. He was arrested, tried, convicted and hung in the court of public opinion via the various news media. When it was all over some of the major media culprits and the Atlanta police had to fork over some serious settlement cash for their zeal. Maybe the DC police learned something from that experience.
Why is it that the pulic and the media feel that they have the right to know every detail of Condits private life anyway. Yes, he is a congressman and is accountable as such in matters relating to his job but family matters are nobody’s business, no matter how intrigued we are to know every little detail. Yes, he has marital problems. So do a lot of other people. That is a private matter between him and his family.
Condits only responsibility regarding this investigation is to help the police in any way that he can. He has no other responsibility to you, I or the media. The police have stated that they feel he has been straightforward with them. If that were to change, they will interview him again, I’m sure. Until then, let this guy get on with his life. I’d like to see how cooperative some of these news reporters would be with the media if they were a murder suspect.
And lastly, I’m a bit tired of the people who compare this case in any way to the OJ case. There are no similarities whatsoever. Condit has a miniscule motive, at best. A hell of an alibi (he was with the VP!) and there is not one shred of evidence to link him to this, as of yet, non-exsistent crime. Thats a far cry from OJ.
I feel no sympathy for Condit. He has made so many bad moves. I don’t know if he’s guilty of hurting Chandra, but he’s either incredibly stupid, or arrogant (probably both) and deserves every bit of grief he currently is suffering.
Hours before the cops were to look at his apartment, he drives out somewhere and stuffs a watch case (a gift from another lover) in the trash. Hiding potential evidence hours before the apartment is to be searched? How dumb can he be?
And the polygraph test? Please. What a joke. He would have done better to never have done one, since (as has been mentioned before) he was not legally obligated to do one. But he does one, under very controlled circumstances (his circumstances) and then has his lawyer proclaim - “He passed the test! He passed the test!” But the police say the test is “a sham” and not useful to them at all. But will Condit do another test? He must think they have value, and he’s already done one - why not do another? But will he? Oh no. Because it won’t be under his restrictive rules. He was so stupid to even go the lie detector route in the first place. He just opened that door, and now it just makes him look REALLY bad when he won’t go through it “properly” (i.e. do a test that isn’t considered a “sham”).
No sympathy for him, none at all.
And now he is worried about his pathetic career. He has been silent for all these months, won’t publicly express any concern for Chandra, nothing. But when the Modesto Bee asks for his resignation - oh yeah - then he can speak. He fires back at the Modesto Bee. He can respond to that. When he feels his precious career is being directly attacked, then he can speak. But can he bestir himself to say anything about Chandra? Can he apologize to the Levys for lying to them? Oh no. But he can talk to the Modesto Bee.
All he has done for the last few months is grin at the camera. What a sleaze.
First, I’m not assuming anything. The issue is whether the Levys are wrong in pressuring Condit. I’m not accusing Condit of anything. Second, the issue isn’t whether the relationship is ‘highly relevant’ to her disappearance it’s whether, due to their relationship, he has information that can help in the investigation.
I’m sure Billy Martin has considered all of this. The issue isn’t who’s being the biggest jerk. The issue is whether the Levys are wrong for pressuring Condit.
But, again, the issue isn’t whether he has direct knowledge of the disappearance. Assume he doesn’t. If you were the Levys would you trust Condit’s omniscience in this issue? Any information about Chandra Levy could have been helpful early in the investigation. Even general background about what she liked to do in town or liked to eat. He might not have the answer but he might have had some pieces to the puzzle.
But that explanation isn’t plausible in the face of the second request to come clean. Even assuming he believed he had no relevant information, that belief was shattered by the second interview request. So the Levys are faced with some people who won’t talk and a guy who has been misleading. They can’t beat the apartment dwellers and get them to talk so they are focusing on the guy who wouldn’t come clean for a long time. Will they eventually be proven right? Who knows? But their decisions do make some sense.
But the police seem to think he has important information, notwithstanding politically astute claims as to Condit’s status. The Levys are pursuing that angle.
And, as a sidenote, the fact that the Levys say the “believe Condit is involved” is not bordering on slander. It’s not on the same continent as slander. As I’m sure Billy Martin has told them.
The Levys want to find their daughter or find out what happened to them. The strongest lead is a guy who hasn’t been cooperative. I simply don’t see how it’s wrong or irrational for them to pursue it. Are the Levys being cynical? Perhaps. Are their views of Condit skewed by their grief or anger over his evasiveness? Maybe. But the police have seemed to think Condit’s information is important. And we don’t know what else the police are doing. You’re assuming that they are ignoring good leads to track down the watch box but I’ve heard of no other strong leads.
Look, “passing” the polygraph means nothing. Many people can pass a polygraph test when they are lying. So he orders a polygraph test for himself. If he passes it goes to the cops. If it fails it goes in the shredder. No way for him to lose.
And anyway, polygraphs are pretty much useless. Well, they do have uses. Cops can use them as devices for interrogation. “The machine says you’re lying, Fat Tony. So why don’t you tell us where the body is hidden?” If the suspect believes that polygraphs are accurate he might confess.
And why do the cops say that Condit isn’t a suspect? Because there is no evidence a crime was commited. Without a crime there are no suspects. By definition Condit isn’t a suspect. That doesn’t mean that the cops don’t think Condit doesn’t have her head in a freezer somewhere.
Anyway, I have no opinion of Condit’s guilt or innocence. Just thought I’d clear a few things up.
I don’t think he is under any obligation to discuss any of this with anyone but the authorities and his family.
The parents have done nothing but accuse him every chance they get. The media has done the same. This is a witch hunt. The parents are IMHO doing more harm to the case than good. They are insisting that this guy get raked over the coals without even considering that the police should be focusing on other leads. If Condit “is the strongest lead they have”, then they have nothing.
Don’t get me wrong, I can only imagine the pain that they are going through. They obviously love their daughter very much. But people don’t always act rationally when they are going through something like this.
It seems to me that the affair is the real reason why everyone is against him, regardless of whether there is a missing intern or not.
Personally, I think there is still a chance that she will show up alive.