Not to nitpick or be divisive, cuz I think the criminal justice system, as a whole, is not equal to all. However I do not necessraily see it along racial lines, but socioeconomic lines. I say that as a white man who grew up in very poor neighborhoods, living as a very poor kid, and all of my very poor friends of various ethnicities every day, and having a similar experience as my friends.
We were all treated differently than say in the more affluent suburbs regardless of race. When I was with my Latino friends or my black friends the police treated us all the same. It was not necessarily good or fair treatment, but they didn’t isolate me and say, “On your way, white boy. We got some minorities to rough up.”
Your cite mentions perception of all black people to be 8-9 out of 10 and 4 of 10 for all whites that the criminal justice system is unequal in its treatment of minorities. It then goes further to break down the white folks along “partisan” lines. 7 in 10 white Democrats believing the system to be unequal (closer to the view of all black people) and 2 of 10 Republicans (closer to all white people).
Did I miss the breakout of the partisan affiliation of the black folks, or was it not mentioned? Would the Alan Keyes of the world be more aligned with their affiliated race or their partisan beliefs? Just wondering, for my viewpoint…
Of course people know whether they’re being racist. They just disagree with you and the others who consider everything bad that happens to a black person to be racism.
I can’t believe that you actually think this is true in all cases. I’ve personally known people who stated that black people were inferior both mentally and morally, and didn’t believe that these assertions were racist.
So, they know exactly what they were stating but disagree with you that it’s racist, then? That’s exactly what I said. That’s not accidental or unintentional racism, their statement was deliberate and intentional.
Your claim is that people can actively discriminate against people based on the colour of their skin without knowing they’re doing it. That’s bullshit. Thinking that such discrimination is acceptable doesn’t make it accidental.
Seriously, do you even think about what you post at all?
When the hell did I say “actively”? And you said that people can’t not know that they’re racist.
What about store owners who unknowingly react differently to black patrons? What about cops who are unconsciously more nervous around black people? What about teachers who are unconsciously less tolerant of misbehavior by black pupils? Do you really think this is impossible?
Very weak. You asserted, ridiculously, that it’s impossible to be unconsciously racist. Remember how this part started? You said “I’m not racist”. I said that doesn’t tell us anything, since many racists don’t think they’re racist. You stated that that was impossible – truly ridiculous. I cited scholarly articles, which you ignored, discussing the very real and significant existence of unconscious racism.
Do you really, honestly believe that no racist on earth thinks that they’re not racist? That’s what you said, but I tend to think that you didn’t think about what you posted at all.
When you said people could be unknowingly racist. Racism is an action, it’s not passive. We’ve had this discussion in the past.
Only the last of those three is relevant, and no, one can’t accidentally give one person a mild talking to and the other a suspension without realising it.
Yes, obviously. How on earth can someone make a choice to discriminate against someone without knowing it? You can’t accidentally choose to only employ white people, or accidentally only stop and search black people.
We’ve had this discussion, and you’ve been wrong. In the English language, “racism” and “racist” can refer to actions, beliefs, statements, people, and more. Not just actions.
All three are relevant.
Are you an alien or something? Have you really never heard of a mother who unconsciously favors one child? A teacher who unconsciously favors one pupil? You really are unable to understand that a teacher might unconsciously treat black students differently than white students?
You can unconsciously assume that a black applicant is less qualified, or less likable, or less of a team player, or whatever, because they’re black. You can unconsciously assume that a black pupil is more of a troublemaker because they’re black. You can unconsciously believe a black driver is less cooperative because they’re black. Human beings are very capable of self-deception. It really is possible to have biases that one is not aware of.
Do you really, honestly think that everyone on earth is aware of all of their biases?
Mind-boggling stuff from Steophan. Unconscious racism is impossible. All racists know that they’re racist (even the ones, apparently, who say “I’m not racist”, I guess, however that works). Weird, wild stuff.
No, but even without being caricaturally, KKK niggerniggernigger racist, there’s a whole bunch of things, great and small, that unconscious prejudice drive us to do or think or believe about persons or groups of people, whether we acknowledge it or not. Scientifically proven. Or, hell, just Google “unconscious racism” or “unconscious bias”.
Refusing to hire someone because you don’t think they’ll be a team player isn’t racism. Refusing to hire them because they’re black is. Expanding the word “racism” to cover any slight to someone who happens to be black is fucking stupid, and counterproductive if you want to actually prevent racism.
It is if you think that being black means you’re less of a team player, or less intelligent, or less skilled, etc. It really is possible for someone to unconsciously apply negative characteristics to black people.
This is almost as stupid as the time you claimed that there was nothing “extremist” about claiming Jews were the descendants of apes and pigs and argue for suicide bombing targeting Bar Mitzvahs.
Obviously some criminals have jobs, but most don’t, unless one broadens the definition of the word to be meaningless.
Anyway, hush now and go sit in the back. The adults are talking now.
At the Museum of Tolerance in Los Angeles, they have a Racism display. To get to the display, you have to choose a door. There are two doors, one for Prejudiced and one for Not Prejudiced. The Not Prejudiced door doesn’t open. The point was that unconscious prejudice was pretty much the norm.
A few posts back, someone mentioned that everyone broke the law at one time or another. If this is so, then it stands to reason that if a black man is five times more likely to be stopped by police(Ferguson, MO), then the crime rate among blacks would be consequentially higher. This pretty much puts to rest the idea that statistics prove that black people are more likely to commit crimes. The only thing it proves is that that black people are more likely to be prosecuted for said crimes.
[INDENT]When Freddie Gray was* 22 months old*, he had a tested blood lead level of 37 micrograms per deciliter. This is an absolutely astronomical amount. Freddie never even had the slightest chance of growing up normally. Lead poisoning doomed him from the start to a life of heightened aggression, poor learning abilities, and weak impulse control. His life was a tragedy set in motion the day he was born. [/INDENT]
[INDENT] It’s this: thanks both to lead paint and leaded gasoline, there were lots of teenagers like Freddie Gray in the 90s. This created a huge and genuinely scary wave of violent crime, and in response we turned many of our urban police forces into occupying armies. …
But here’s the thing: that era is over. Individual tragedies like Freddie Gray are still too common, but overall lead poisoning has plummeted. As a result, our cities are safer because our kids are fundamentally less dangerous. To a large extent, they are now normal teenagers, not lead-poisoned predators.
[/INDENT] Emphasis in original. Chart in original showing decline in crime.
The militarization of our nation’s police forces, three strikes you’re out, etc may or may not have been the best response to our nation’s lead poisoned underclass. Regardless, the underlying situation has shifted: crime has declined for 2 decades now, even during the worst downturn since world war II.
This is patently false; Steophan has many, many black friends, both online and in real life. We know this because if he didn’t, it would mean he made a conscious choice not to befriend any black people, and he has taken great pains to impress upon us that he is not a racist.