Are you forgetting the part when they fly over the counter to presumably beat his ass?
I maintain, anyone batshit crazy enough to slap you in your face for doing your job AND then leap over the counter is probably playing for keeps. So, you want to let them carve your face, gouge your eye out, kick you into oblivion and leave you in a vegetative state? The McDonald’s guy had no way of knowing what was on the minds of these hellions. They probably didn’t either. But that shit ain’t normal.
I’ve worked in retail. I’ve had people yell at me. I’ve been in fights, and had people come at me to do me harm. This was more like the latter, and in this day and age people don’t do fisticuffs. They like to kick the shit out of you and stomp on your head. Trust me, when someone comes at you like that, you’re better served responding with brute force to ensure you survive. It would suck to die or be seriously injured because you waited to see what these miscreants were going to do.
You choose to escalate the situation to that level? Survival mode kicks in for the victim and you just might lose. As these two idiots found out.
Now, ‘meme’ is something passed on culturally, from the word memory…I’m using the term as in a literary meme. That’s fair usage…look it up.
Now, what was I trying to say?
Well, much of what billfish said. WTH are you clucking about my fantasizing? Did you take a course in psychology, and are now some Psychological profile expert? Fantasizing about what part of it? Are you quite mad? What sort of nonsensical rambling is this? ‘Because you fantasize about it a lot?’
Part 2 of your diagnosis has me and **billfish **going around busting our buttons because we are brave. UHHHHHH…correct me, but, why on earth did you say this? WHY ON EARTH?
Next, you start clucking about what it would take to make you vicious. That was what the bulk of my post was about. I don’t know how your viciousness vis a vis your bravery/lack thereof relates to what I said. I don’t think the word bravery even showed up on the thread till you conjured it up. I said the woman got about 1/2 of what she deserved. Next thing I know, you are having me and **bill **strutting around talking about what a bunch of macho dudes we are, and you have me fantasising about the video.
You really have me at a disadvantage when you read stuff in my post that I cannot see.
And, in re fallacies: isn’t your little stunt attacking the two of us a straw man fallacy? (It’s been over 30 years since I studied logic, and I could be wrong on that.)
hh
Again, the slap was all the ladies managed to achieve. I didn’t omit anything. What you described as “running, jumping and going after him”, I described as “ruckus, noise and clamor”. What you repeatedly and conveniently describe as the “guy retreating” (as if he’s trying to diffuse the situation), I describe as the “guy racing to get his bitch mower”.
I see from some followup stories that Rayon has been fired. He’s been charged with felony assault and “criminal possession of a weapon”. Perhaps a lawyer will show up and provide a little detail on what exactly that means. I wonder if Rayon picked up something that would normally be there to use as a weapon, or stashed the rod there to use as a weapon if needed.
The women have been charged with menacing, criminal trespass and disorderly conduct.
Some other stories note that a defense fund is being set up for Rayon somewhere on Facebook.
That’s awfully convenient, isn’t it? Because terr is providing an accurate description of what occurred on the video. Your description is awfully vague and minimizes what actually happened. I’ve been around people shouting and talking shit in a store or on the street - that’s “ruckus, noise, and clamor.” Someone trespassing and invading your private work area ain’t that, not by a long shot.
I’ve seen this scenario in convenience store surveillance videos. People coming over the counter are not typically coming to give you a hug.
This is patently ridiculous. Nobody came to the McD’s guy’s aid. Two people are trespassing with the intent to attack him. Two vs. one. I don’t care what their gender is, they are able-bodied and intend to do him harm - and he has no idea if they have weapon(s). There really aren’t any ideal places to fight in a fast food kitchen, but there is lots of sharp edges, metal, hot appliances, and the like. He has a split second decision to make. I have great empathy for this guy who was only doing his job and has to go through all this.
We can’t see what the two women were doing - he’s clearly telling them to stay down. I suspect they were trying to get up.
What’s telling is everybody else is essentially panicking. That’s how most of us would respond, and why most of us if we were the McDonald’s guy would be in the ICU.
Of course. I’m sure they were loudly climbing over the counter so that they could shake hands with the guy and apologize for the misunderstanding.:rolleyes:
Why isnt at least one of them charged with assault? You slap somebody and come after them that sure as hell is assault. Unless menacing covers that but that sounds rather more like misdomenor shenanigans.
I found a definition of for “criminal possession of a weapon” which is almost certainly another felony charge. There is a “4th degree” misdemeanor, but the exact same thing is escalated to a 3rd degree felony if the person already has a criminal record. I suppose, though, that a prosecutor might have some discretion about this.
Here’s what I find the most interesting part of the definition: “… He possesses any dagger, dangerous knife, dirk, razor, stiletto, imitation pistol, or any other dangerous or deadly instrument or weapon with intent to use the same unlawfully against another.”
My non-lawyerly interpretation of this is that he could not be charged for picking up a metal rod and using it for self-defense. So the authorities have decided that Rayon had criminal intent in repeatedly hitting these women. I guess that’s not a big surprise given the felony assault charge.
Allow me to be the first to predict that if this gets to a jury trial, he will walk out a free man. I think he is very lucky somebody videotaped it, because the tape will support him.
I’m not sure what it says about human nature that others will be equally convinced that the video will support nothing but a conviction. It’s interesting to compare this to the Rodney King video. I was (and still am) one of those who believes it shows the cops crossed a line from subduing him to simply beating him, though I couldn’t pick a specific moment on the tape when that happened. I don’t feel that way about this tape, and perhaps it’s at least in part because it’s so short. From the first hit to the last is maybe 20 seconds. Of course there may have been more hits after the recording stopped – we don’t yet know that. But personally, I believe he clearly started out defending himself, and I don’t believe there was enough time for his intent to change – I don’t think he was doing much in the way of mental gymnastics during that time span.
I’m even tempted to go back and look at the King story again, perhaps with a more sympathetic eye toward the cops. But I’d rather maintain my moral outrage about that.
There is some loco reasoning going on in this thread. Yes the employee was provoked, and slapped and yelled at etc etc. But under no circumstances is it okay (legal) to retaliate like that with a metal rod! If the girl with the head fracture should die he will be charged with manslaughter.
By my reading the only applicable definition is for the 3rd degree misdemeanor, which specifically is not inclusive of a physical assault. It is all about instilling a state of fear regardless of any physical contact.
It appears to me that unless further charges are added, these women are not facing any criminal consequences for hitting Rayon. Personally, I find that pretty appalling, given that it was one of them who instigated the physical altercation in the first place.
It was not “retaliation” It was defending himself while being attacked. If you want to argue that during the last ten seconds on the incident he was retaliating for being attacked during the first ten seconds, that is your right. As I noted before, I don’t think he had the time or inclination to change his state of mind over the course of a few seconds.
Dude. If you and I get into an argument in the street and you push me do you think it is within my rights to whip out a baseball bat (or metal rod) and start pummeling you with it?
You’re certainly entitled to your opinion but if that is your opinion your opinion is wrong.
Come on, be realistic. If you are in the street, that means there are no other people right near by (most likely) to attempt to intervene if and when you pushed him. He’s well within his rights to unholster his .9mm and fire the entire clip into your aggressive, askin’ for it ass.
If you hit me and chase after me, I would feel absolutely within my rights to pick up a stick and crack you in the head with it. And keep hitting you until I was sure you couldn’t hit me any more.
I used a weapon in a fight once. It was a tennis racket, and I split the guy’s scalp open and sent him to the ER. Then he took it away from me and used it on me. I ended up with more than 60 stitches. The moral of the story is, don’t point a tennis racket at somebody unless you are willing to kill them with it.
BTW, except for the moral part, it is an entirely true story.
