Ex-Pats: Why and how did you move?

In My Humble Opinion
21

[QUOTE=jjimm]
It is entirely dependent on which country you’re moving from, and which country you’re moving to. E.g. we don’t have rabies over here, so if you brought your animal/s in from the US, we’d impound them at the airport for 3 (or is it 6) months, to guarantee they don’t start frothing at the mouth.

A friend of mine moved from Hong Kong to Singapore with two cats, and they were in quarantine for six months. He visited them every day, bless.
[/QUOTE]
Wouldn’t it be cheaper and easier for everyone just to do a blood test? Or is there no blood test for rabies?

22

I may have moved in the wrong direction for you, since I’m an Australian expat living in te US, but here goes:

[QUOTE=Ender_Will]
First off: Why did you move? I’d imagine that work or relationships, be they romantic or familial, probably are main reasons. Did anyone go just for the hell of it or for an adventure?
[/QUOTE]

Work. In my mid 50s, I’d run out of jobs at the right level for me in Australia, and an ideal one came up in the US that I applied for and got.

[QUOTE=Ender_Will]
Second: From a logistics standpoint, how did you move? Other than my car and furniture, which I can sell or store, I can fit most everything I need into a couple of suitcases. I think. Was there anything that you realized not bringing was a grave oversight?
[/QUOTE]

Part of my logistics was to keep my house in Australia. It was fully paid off, I had enough money to make a down payment on a house in the US, I had two grown-up children still living there, and my wife and I wanted to move back there on retirement. So a lot of stuff simply did not move, and we bought new stuff in the US.

[QUOTE=Ender_Will]
Third: From a mental and social standpoint, how did you move? How long did it take for your new home to feel like home, if that happens at all? Do you miss your home country, and how often do you get back? Do you feel like you fit in with the new culture? Do the locals think you fit in?
[/QUOTE]

The US is not all that much different from Australia, so I didn’t have any culture-shock problems. But I do go back to Australia about once a year, to see family and friends.

[QUOTE=Ender_Will]
Fourth: What are the financial headaches you have to deal with? It looks like the IRS still wants you to file even if you don’t live in the States; how do you handle that? How hard is it getting a bank account, place to live, utilities, etc. with basically no history?
[/QUOTE]

I still file an Australian tax return, but that’s because I still have income in Australia. They don’t want to knw about my US income. But there are still complications in having income in two countries: you need to take advantage of the tax treaties between the US and Australia, so that you don’t pay tax twice on the sae income, and you have to cope with different tax years (Australia is July to June).

At the start, I had some problems with no credit history. So one of the first things I did was get a credit union account and a linked debit card. And it was a bit hard getting a house mortgage, in spite of having about 30% in cash as a down payment, but we used a buyer’s agent to buy a house, and he found a lender for us.

But after a few months with a bank account and a mortgage. the credit hiustory has started and the credit card offers start arriving in the mail.

[QUOTE=Ender_Will]
Lastly: Are you glad you did it?
[/QUOTE]

Yes. I don’t like being away from family and friends, but I have an interesting job, and living here means that I get to see a lot of interesting things. In addition, I’m much closer to Europe, so I’ve made twop visits to England while here, which I probably would not have done from Australia.

23

Ex-ex-pat chiming in here (moved away from 1998-2003) to Budapest from Chicago.

[QUOTE=Ender_Will]

First off: Why did you move? I’d imagine that work or relationships, be they romantic or familial, probably are main reasons. Did anyone go just for the hell of it or for an adventure?

[/quote]

Adventure and work. I just graduated college and I knew I had to live some of my life abroad. I just love travelling and living in new and different places. There happened to be a job opening in Budapest for a photographer at an English-language paper, so I moved there.

I packed one suitcase, that’s it. Just clothes some towels and toiletries to get me started. Anything else I could get there. Oh, and lots of books. Might not be so much a problem for you if you’re moving to Australia, but English language books were a pretty hot commodity in the ex-pat community in Budapest. Everybody had their own personal library with a lot of sharing going on. Not that you couldn’t find English-language books there, I just need my library with me.

I felt at home within six months. I had traveled to Central/Eastern Europe before, my family is Polish, and Poles and Hungarians get along famously, so there really wasn’t much of a culture shock beyond language. Coming back to the US was the difficult part. It took me a full two years or so before I felt completely readjusted. I came back in 2003, and I still sometimes pine away for my adopted home country.

I did not terribly miss Chicago when I was away. I visited once every year. It was always exciting to get back to the States for three weeks, but I was having such a good time and adventure in Europe, that I always wanted to go back.

I felt at home with the culture, although there was no mistaking me for a foreigner, given my rudimentary Hungarian skills. Even after five and a half years, I only have a basic working knowledge of the language.

I kept my American bank. The embassy will provide you with tax forms should you need them. I had work help me with getting a place to live. It was all cash-based, under-the-table arrangements. Utilities were in the name of the flat owner. Monthly rent included utilities.

Are you kidding?! Best experience of my life, and, in my ideal life, I’d be split between the US and someplace else. So many things happened to me there that would not have happened in the US. I traveled all over the place, found myself on assignments in Kosovo, Moscow, Uzbekistan, and South Africa, played keyboards in an indie rock band that toured Germany, France, Hungary, Czech Republic, Slovenia, and Croatia (the album recorded right after my departure debuted at #1 on the German college radio charts), met some of the oddest personalities there, hob-knobbed with Hungarian pop stars, etc. It was simply an amazing experience. I wouldn’t trade it for all the money in the world.

If you have the opportunity and personality to do it, I would whole-heartedly recommend it while you can.

24

First off: Why did you move? I’d imagine that work or relationships, be they romantic or familial, probably are main reasons. Did anyone go just for the hell of it or for an adventure?
Moved from Canada to the US because I married an American guy.

Second: From a logistics standpoint, how did you move? Other than my car and furniture, which I can sell or store, I can fit most everything I need into a couple of suitcases. I think. Was there anything that you realized not bringing was a grave oversight?

I shipped a bunch of things before hand, some of which were returned because they werent itemized enough. Other than that I entered the US with 2 suitcases and a personal carry on. There was nothing I left behind that I couldnt retrieve later as I was leaving it all at my parents home.

Third: From a mental and social standpoint, how did you move? How long did it take for your new home to feel like home, if that happens at all? Do you miss your home country, and how often do you get back? Do you feel like you fit in with the new culture? Do the locals think you fit in?
I like it here enough, but home is relative, as long as I am with my husband I am happy and have that homey feeling but San Diego doesnt really feel like home like Toronto or my parents home does. I visit Canada often in fact I was just there. I have come to accept that I will be living in the US, and I hope to sponsor the rest of my family to come live here too. I don’t feel like I fit into SoCal culture all that much and it is hard to adjust but slowly things are getting to be okay.

Fourth: What are the financial headaches you have to deal with? It looks like the IRS still wants you to file even if you don’t live in the States; how do you handle that? How hard is it getting a bank account, place to live, utilities, etc. with basically no history?

Financial headaches were minimal, I already had a SS card from previous employment in the US and all I did was add my name to my husband account. Everything else is easy.
Lastly: Are you glad you did it?

Yes, I have a love hate feeling about living here. I love it but I miss my family ALOT. I wish there were easy quick solutions but the INS grinds very slowly. And I’m super excited about being married and happy in that respect. Since I travel a lot for work, my husband is my home and he feels the same way. As we speak I’m typing from a hotel.

25

First off: Why did you move? I’d imagine that work or relationships, be they romantic or familial, probably are main reasons. Did anyone go just for the hell of it or for an adventure?

I’m living in Korea though I’m a Korean American and was born in the U.S. and lived there for most of my life. I did it because whenever I visited Korea, I liked it more and more each time and never wanted to leave.

Second: From a logistics standpoint, how did you move? Other than my car and furniture, which I can sell or store, I can fit most everything I need into a couple of suitcases. I think. Was there anything that you realized not bringing was a grave oversight?

By plane. I prepared pretty well so there were no oversights.

Third: From a mental and social standpoint, how did you move? How long did it take for your new home to feel like home, if that happens at all? Do you miss your home country, and how often do you get back? Do you feel like you fit in with the new culture? Do the locals think you fit in?

Since I have grandparents, aunts, uncles, cousins, that probably made it much easier. I do miss the U.S. once in a while, but I still visit as often as I can which is a couple times a year. It took me a while to adjust because on the inside I still felt different. The first two years had difficult moments, but I feel more comfortable now. Because I’m Korean, the locals don’t treat me all that different.

Fourth: What are the financial headaches you have to deal with? It looks like the IRS still wants you to file even if you don’t live in the States; how do you handle that? How hard is it getting a bank account, place to live, utilities, etc. with basically no history?

My relatives who live here helped me with most of the above, and for about half a year I lived with an aunt and uncle until I got my own apartment.

Lastly: Are you glad you did it?

Very.

26

[QUOTE=Agent Foxtrot]
Wouldn’t it be cheaper and easier for everyone just to do a blood test? Or is there no blood test for rabies?
[/QUOTE]
Possibly, but them’s the rules. It might not just apply to rabies - there are lots of other animal diseases too. Bio-security is a big deal, so this applies to a lot of countries, so do check. The animal boarding fees at the airports are quite high, IIRC, and they’re non-negotiable.

27

[QUOTE=Agent Foxtrot]
Future expat here, hopefully. I have a question.

Is it impossible to move overseas with pets? I’ve been wanting to live abroad ever since I was a teenager, but now I have two cats that I simply wouldn’t be able to give up. How difficult are the logistics of relocating pets overseas? How hard is it on the animals themselves?

Thanks.
[/QUOTE]

Agent

It isn’t that hard to do although the paperwork is a PITA. It also depends on where you’re going. The UK is really bitchy about rabies and demands a 6 month quarantine. Cyprus also demands a 6 month quarantine BUT, if you offer to pay the bills up front, in cash, with no receipt, (nudge-nudge-wink-wink) they allow you to take your dog home and tell you to keep it on a leash. Most other countries aren’t that bad. You can bring dogs, cats, and birds into Saudi with few problems. If you have a pot-bellied pig it might be an issue. :stuck_out_tongue:
For international travel you are probably going to need an ID chip implanted in your beast and a raft of papers.
As far as the beast itself, British Airways has a good reputation for taking care of animals. I’ve heard some horror stories over the years, but not really all that many.

Regards

Testy

28

So is there anyone here who has moved overseas and now wishes they’d never done it?

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First off: Why did you move? – From a very young age, I wanted to EXPLORE, see the world, I wanted to live in a foreign country. When I got thru college, I looked for opportunities. I found this Star Wars thing on Kwajalein. It wasn’t exactly a complete expat experience, as it was a US Army base in the Marshall Islands, so we had an American culture and food, etc. But I jumped all over it.

Twenty years later, I got the same opportunity. THIS time, it was a chance to get away from living on an airplane and come home to my sweet wifey every night, plus get her out of a very bad family situation at home. Again, I jumped all over it.

Second: From a logistics standpoint, how did you move? – In our case, my employer took care of all the logistics. We just told the movers what was to go into long term storage and what was to be shipped to the island. I’m glossing over a lot of minor stuff, obviously, but the company paid for it and coordinated it with local movers & sotrage facilities.

Third: From a mental and social standpoint, how did you move? How long did it take for your new home to feel like home, if that happens at all? Do you miss your home country, and how often do you get back? Do you feel like you fit in with the new culture? Do the locals think you fit in? – Since it is about 50% Americans here, 40& Marshallese, and 10 of others like those delightful Aussies, it’s not much different from living back home. Fitting in is not a cultural thing, but more of a lifestyle thing. We get paid trips back home every year for all family members, so that is not an expense. We fit right in, and no, I really don’t miss a dang thing except the extreme isolation–but again, this trip at least, it’s not a bad thing.

Fourth: What are the financial headaches you have to deal with? It looks like the IRS still wants you to file even if you don’t live in the States; how do you handle that? How hard is it getting a bank account, place to live, utilities, etc. with basically no history?–Not applicable in our case. We kept all our accounts & credit cards, and just do bill paying/banking over the internet. Utilities and housing are free here. Yes, we have to file for our federal tax exemptions, but we do get the first (I think) $80,000 of income tax-free. Against that, we do get Social Security still taken out, as well as a flat-rate 5% Marshallese income tax. But it is not about what you make here, it’s what you save:

NO CAR–Privately owned vehicles are not allowed here. We bike to work. So we save the car payments, gas tires & oil, and insurance.
NO HOUSE PAYMENT–We rent out our Florida house. Housing is free, courtesy of the Army
TAXES–Even with the SS and 5% Marshallese income tax, we save on taxes.
UTILITIES–No garbage, water, sewer, electricity, etc.
TRAVEL–It’s cheaper to go to Bali or Australia from her ethan it is to go back to the states. The travel money is yours to do with as you wish. You buy cheap tickets, the rest of the money can pay for most or all of your vacation.

Lastly: Are you glad you did it? YES YES YES YES–Then, and now!

30

Ender

Your OP got me thinking about why I moved. In 1982 I had gotten out of the Navy, got an entry-level job with good potential, was married, and in general was a pretty average guy.
I was sitting at my desk one day and chatting with my cubicle neighbors who’d been there for 10 or 12 years, both of them fat, old men and it struck me that in a decade I was going to be just like that.
All the future seemed to hold was getting a mortgage, having a couple of kids, working to put them through school and then spending a few years living in retirement before dropping dead. I can’t describe the chill that gave me.
There was so much left out of that. There was a whole world available to me and I was going to trade it all for security; a two-car garage, PTA meetings, and two weeks of annual vacation where I’d sit on a beach somewhere and try to act like I was happy.

Robert Heinlein said it best in Glory Road

“I wanted the hurtling moons of Barsoom. I wanted Storisende and Poictesme, and Holmes shaking me awake to tell me, “The game’s afoot!” I wanted to float down the Mississippi on a raft and elude a mob in company with the Duke of Bilgewater and the Lost Dauphin.
I wanted Prester John, and Excalibur held by a moon-white arm out of a silent lake. I wanted to sail with Ulysses and with Tros of Samothrace and eat the lotus in a land that seemed always afternoon. I wanted the feeling of romance and the sense of wonder I had known as a kid. I wanted the world to be what they had promised me it was going to be–.”

Well, I never got all of that but I got a hell of a lot more than I would have sitting in a cubicle somewhere. I still am.

Regards

Testy

31

I keep hoping Charlie Gogolak will post in this thread.

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[QUOTE=Agent Foxtrot]
Is it impossible to move overseas with pets? I’ve been wanting to live abroad ever since I was a teenager, but now I have two cats that I simply wouldn’t be able to give up. How difficult are the logistics of relocating pets overseas? How hard is it on the animals themselves?

[/QUOTE]

To bring them into Spain you’d have to bring a certificate from their vet indicating that their vaccinations are up to date; the certificate should include the specific list of dates for vaccinations.

From what I hear, cats don’t much like moving (how dare you change their house without their permission?) but I’ve never heard of special problems due to the move being international.

33

Why did you move?

I moved for a girl almost all the story over here
From a logistics standpoint, how did you move?

Put my laptop, a few clothes a few cherished CDs, a magazine and a box with two indoor free flight planes on a backpack and a medium size briefcase; all my other posessions I left them behind.
I had about 900 bucks on my pocket and 400 on a debit card.

From a mental and social standpoint, how did you move?

I jumped blindfolded off a plane hoping that the bundle I grasped was a parachute!

Fourth: What are the financial headaches you have to deal with?

Well, it was rather unsetting, about one month after arriving when I woke up with 200 baht in my wallet (about 7 dollars), that was all the money I had.
On the up side I got a payment from freelance work the next day so I avoided starvation.
I had a contact with a studio before coming here, but no guaranteed stable job. I also started working free lance shortly before quiting my previous job and moving, that was my life boat in case the job didn´t pan out.
I started working for the studio about 5 weeks after arriving, super nice people which took care of setting things up for me with immigration and banking stuff.

Are you glad you did it?

Very much indeed! :smiley:
Distance from friends and family hurts like the dickens some times, specially when a situation goes bad and I can´t be there to be of any help. Specially considering that, while I have a decent job the cost of a round trip to my country (Uruguay) its very high, at most I could do it once a year, but this first year I´ll have to skip it since there are other things to invest on.
The place is very good if you manage to accept/overlook some things, one of the things I like the most is that I can leave on a weekend and in a few hours I´m sitting under a coconut tree on some lovingly tropical island, pure bliss I tell you.

34

We have made 6 international moves with pets. It is probably not that big a deal unless you move to a former British colony or anywhere else that has extreme quarantine regs (such as an island). It could be bad news if your pet is elderly/nervous and can’t handle the stress of a long quarantine.

It is now possible to verify with virtual certainty that a pet does not have rabies, so the lengthy quarantine is not strictly necessary. However, it can take bureaucracies a long time to catch up with science, especially where caution prevails and/or livelihoods depend on the status quo (a large quarantine facility employs a lot of people).

Other than that, the biggest problem is corrupt/incompetent/regulation-crazed bureaucracy. This is most likely to be encountered in developing countries. If you can afford it, this is VERY easy to deal with. Pay an agent and they will take care of everything for you.

We have spent as much as $400/animal all in, for air shipping, agent fees, vet bills, etc. But it has been worth it.

I can’t speak to dogs, but cats are amazingly resilient. The worst was when I had a 15-year-old cat I had to move. She was in good health and probably had a few more good years before her, but I hated to make her go through the stress of the move. Indeed, it was awful. She went from Mozambique to Indonesia and, upon arrival, was soaked in her own urine, bewildered and hungry. The Indonesian officials would not release her until various admin was completed, but at least they let me see her and pet her through her cage. It broke my heart to see her covered in pee and terrified. However, she was fine again a few days later and did indeed live for 3 more well-loved years.

35

On my way home I thought of one issue that causes concern for many ex-pats: medical care. Of course it’s a major concern for just about everyone, but add in foreign languages, arcane insurance systems, doubts about the quality of local service, and the nagging fear that you could die from a miscommunication, and the concern can grow into paranoia quite easily.

I’ve been lucky in this regard: I have ex-pat insurance, which is fairly cheap and offers pretty good and relatively hassle-free coverage. We have doctor friends we can check with about bureaucratic and cultural questions, plus the doctors at the local clinics know me and my whole family, which takes a lot of worry off as well. Still, a lot of people (mostly Japanese) were surprised that when I needed surgery I chose to stay in Japan. I figured (in addition to my wife, home and job being here) that since I was going to need long-term follow-up care, it was better to stick with one hospital and one doctor instead of transferring records back-and-forth overseas and hoping everything gets translated correctly. I have to say, though, that few things send up a Not Good flag like hearing the doctor say, “I assume you’ll be making arrangements to fly home for this.”