Fargo S1E10--Final Episode [Open spoilers]

[Sherrerd]

@Charlie_Wayne

Do you remember how she spoke about once being Miss ABC? (where ABC is the name of some county or small city). Do you remember when she pointed to her body as if to say to Lester, “Look how beautiful I am. A normal man just does not step out on a wife as beautiful as I am.”

I suppose I could be wrong. But do you recall those two scenes? If I’m mistaken about those scenes then I guess I’m wrong about her attitude. But I have a pretty clear recollection that is the way she thought about herself. She thought she was just too good for most men because of the way she looked. (but those looks would be gone very quickly and, then what?)

I do remember the character having dialogue to the effect that she could have married anyone (because of a beauty-pageant title). Don’t remember the specifics.

And it was notable how quickly she assumed her husband was guilty of murder. Her assumption came immediately on the news that he was a suspect, if I recall correctly. She didn’t even question the accusation, but just accepted it as fact. That’s not something a loving spouse would do.

So she wasn’t being presented as a saintly person, certainly.

[corkboard]

@Charlie_Wayne

Do you remember how she spoke about once being Miss ABC? (where ABC is the name of some county or small city). Do you remember when she pointed to her body as if to say to Lester, “Look how beautiful I am. A normal man just does not step out on a wife as beautiful as I am.”

I suppose I could be wrong. But do you recall those two scenes? If I’m mistaken about those scenes then I guess I’m wrong about her attitude. But I have a pretty clear recollection that is the way she thought about herself. She thought she was just too good for most men because of the way she looked. (but those looks would be gone very quickly and, then what?)

I guess I had forgotten that dialogue, but I guess I took it as her saying- “let’s face it, Lester- between you and me, can we just acknowledge that I’m no slouch in the looks department, compared to some others in this little podunk town, ya know?” I didn’t take it as her having a shallow attitude or overblown sense of self-image, though. Everything else about her personality was that she was a sweetheart who loved her family.

[The_Second_Stone]

@MaxTheVool

Yes, and then Lester shot him in the leg, then Lester tried to keep shooting him but was out of bullets.

I thought his gun jammed.

[Bryan_Ekers]

Lester’s gun jammed after the first round. I don’t recall that round actually hitting Malvo - the damage from the trap was excessive enough. Yikes, exposed bone and a compound fracture? Malvo, had he lived, would be lucky not to face a below-knee amputation.

[Sherrerd]

@Bryan_Ekers

Lester’s gun jammed after the first round. I don’t recall that round actually hitting Malvo - the damage from the trap was excessive enough. Yikes, exposed bone and a compound fracture? Malvo, had he lived, would be lucky not to face a below-knee amputation.

I expect he’d have gotten one of those machine-gun prostheses.

[C_K_Dexter_Haven]

@Dewey_Finn

… They might even figure out that the personal trainer didn’t commit “suicide by cop”.

I’m assuming that they figured that out when they saw that the trainer was tied to the gun and gagged. I’d think even the Bemidji cops would have figured out that somethin’ wasn’t right about that.

[Sitnam]

@The_Second_Stone

A very mature kid who longed for a mother and knew it and she desperately wanted her Dad to be happy. A teenage girl doesn’t usually like her mother anywhere near as much as she liked Molly.

Gus seemed like a great father, her mother was dead for a long time. She also took to Molly’s dad and for all we know there is no extended family for either Gus or her moms in the picture. We fast forwarded to one year later, it was already established she was perhaps more mature than her age would normally indicate fending for herself with a single dad so it doesn’t seem ridiculous.

[barefootcrazy]

@Sherrerd

And it was notable how quickly she assumed her husband was guilty of murder. Her assumption came immediately on the news that he was a suspect, if I recall correctly. She didn’t even question the accusation, but just accepted it as fact. That’s not something a loving spouse would do.

I think initially her anger was because of Chaz’ gun obsession that her son was now in trouble. The “affair” was secondary was the way I took it.

[Accidental_Martyr]

@C_K_Dexter_Haven

I’m assuming that they figured that out when they saw that the trainer was tied to the gun and gagged. I’d think even the Bemidji cops would have figured out that somethin’ wasn’t right about that.

Yeah, I would hope that being duct taped to the chair and gun would tip them off.

[Charlie_Wayne]

I recall hearing words similar to the following in more than one movie. In particular, I think I heard them in GoodFellas:

The thing the FBI could never figure out was that the Mafia was just a kind of police force for criminals.

I re-watched Episode 9 in which Malvo shoots those 3 people and then tells Lester that he just lost a $100K bounty. When he said the word “bounty”, it suddenly occured to me.

Is it possible that Malvo is a kind of bounty hunter for the mob? Could that org that gave him his marching orders and told him what to do was a kind of offshoot of organized crime that did bounty hunting that had to be done outside the law?

If he was just a bounty hunter and never had any ties to Satan or any other kinds of spiritual elements, would that explain some of the outstanding mysteries about this show?

[C_K_Dexter_Haven]

@Charlie_Wayne

Is it possible that Malvo is a kind of bounty hunter for the mob? Could that org that gave him his marching orders and told him what to do was a kind of offshoot of organized crime that did bounty hunting that had to be done outside the law?

I thought it was clear from episode 1 that he was a hit man (bounty hunter, if you prefer) for some gangster organization. And there are at least two such organizations – the one that employs him, and the one that employed Hess. He went to Bemidji originally to kill the guy that he pulled out of the office and stuffed naked in the trunk of his car; the guy ran off the road, the guy escaped (and froze to death) and Malvo went to the hospital and met Lester by accident.

The gangster organization that Hess worked for sent the two guys to avenge Hess. They didn’t know who they were going after, initially.

We later learn that Malvo has a nasty, malicious streak that enjoys doing evil, disrupting people’s lives, just for the helluvit. He’s worse than just a professional hitman, he’s a professional hitman who loves playing nasty pranks.

[Charlie_Wayne]

@C_K_Dexter_Haven

I thought it was clear from episode 1 that he was a hit man (bounty hunter, if you prefer) for some gangster organization. And there are at least two such organizations – the one that employs him, and the one that employed Hess. He went to Bemidji originally to kill the guy that he pulled out of the office and stuffed naked in the trunk of his car; the guy ran off the road, the guy escaped (and froze to death) and Malvo went to the hospital and met Lester by accident.

The gangster organization that Hess worked for sent the two guys to avenge Hess. They didn’t know who they were going after, initially.

We later learn that Malvo has a nasty, malicious streak that enjoys doing evil, disrupting people’s lives, just for the helluvit. He’s worse than just a professional hitman, he’s a professional hitman who loves playing nasty pranks.

You are certainly correct about his love for doing evil. I remember one scene from Episode 9 just after Malvo shot and killed those 3 people. He turned to Lester and said something like this: “Did you see the look on that guy’s face when I pulled my gun? It was absolutely classic!” He had a big smile on his face and it seemed very clear that he just loved the thought of the look on his victim’s face.

No matter what else you might have to say about Malvo, he certainly did manage to find the right line of work for himself. He was a man who was def satisfied by his work.

[crucible]

I think there is a lot of misidentified locations here – Fargo for Duluth, Duluth for Bemidji, Bemidji for Fargo, etc…but I don’t think it really interferes with enjoying the flow.

I wonder if the FBI even has an office of any significance in Fargo. I doubt there is any sort of criminal enterprise in Fargo or the whole of the Dakotas that would justify a criminal office building with at least 22 employees. Just sayin’.

to me, one weak point for the whole story is Malvo’s desire to punish Lester for fleeing from the elevator shootings. Maybe it was just that Lester seemed ready to complete his contract for selling his soul and then backed out? Punish the apostate?

Lester certainly did sell his soul. No one goes from being a wimpy unsuccessful insurance salesman in one year to the ‘salesman of the year’ nationally, with his own modern office, a new wife, women wetting their panties when they see him, a new house, etc. without the help of some devilish force. Not after killing your wife, framing your brother for murder, etc. etc.

Lester was becoming, though, not Malvo’s acolyte, but a force equal to Malvo. He outsmarted Malvo at the end, caused his death in a way…and got away with it for a time before the cops caught up to him. I don’t think Malvo completely understood that, but I think his motive in trying to kill Lester was as much to eliminate competition as to protect himself. He knew that Lester was in as much danger from him as he was from Lester, so far as flipping to the cops.

In the last episode, Malvo is no longer causing havoc just for the Hell of it. He isn’t getting one trucker’s son to shoot the other one with a crossbow, or any other ‘Loki’ style mischief – he is focused on eliminating Lester; Lester must be a very big threat to him.

I think the idea there is an organization to which organized crime turns when they need to find someone they want to punish or prevent from squealing on them is a good one. The ‘last resort’ option. Malvo screwed up when he knocked off Hess for Lester. His sense of right and wrong led him to ultimately create the scenario where he was killed. He shoulda, coulda, laughed at Lester’s problems, but he decided to get involved. He wanted to see if Lester could be turned into ‘Malvo-II’, I suppose, after the sheriff began to suspect that Lester had some unexpected help with Hess, and Lester surprised Malvo by being able to take charge of his life by killling his wife…

[crucible]

For that matter, I’m not convinced that there is any convincing evidence that Lester killed his wife, not Chaz. Any clear alibi would have kept Chaz off the hook in the first place, or at trial. Absent Lester stepping up and admitting his guilt, I don’t see what gets Chaz released.

He was convicted (presumably) on the evidence available by a jury of his peers. Overturning that is not as easy as Molly telling the DA she suspects Lester was the one who killed his wife and Chaz was framed. What proof does she really have?

[Bryan_Ekers]

The recorded phone call, even if admissible, may not be probitive. Lester says his wife is dead in the basement and says the word “hammer”, I don’t recall him actually confessing to anything. He just fails to mention, one could argue, that his brother is there and did the hammering. Arguably, he was calling Malvo over for advice or help. Then the chief showed up, Chaz shot him, and Malvo was never there.

[Charlie_Wayne]

I just re-watched the finale and it occurred to me that there is sometimes some significance between once scene in which we see a character and the very next scene in which that character appears - even if the two scenes are separated by a fair amount of time.

For example. We see Molly tell Lester the parable of the man who loses one glove when running for a train. But he doesn’t notice his glove is missing until the train begins to pull out from the station - at which time he decides to drop his other glove out of the train window so that someone may be able to get a pair of gloves. The one glove didn’t do him any good. By dropping it, he figured it may do some other person some good.

The next scene in which we see Molly is when she tells the recepionist/cop that she is going to Lester’s house and the receptionist asks her, “Do you think it’s safe?” I figured she was asking if Molly would be safe by doing that and I’d guess that almost everyone else thought that is what she meant as well. But, no! What she really meant was would she (the receptionist) be safe. She didn’t care anything about pregnant Molly or her baby’s safety. It was understandable. She was very frightened. But it sure made her appear to be of questionable character.

And there (it could be argued) is the meaning of the glove parable. The receptionist/cop is not your “drop the other glove” type of person. She is your “**keep **the other glove” type of person and it reveals to us about her character.

I have noticed a similar kind of occurrence elsewhere in this show. In my post #45 (of the Episode 9 thread) I discuss how Gus saw Malvo in one scene and then the very next time we saw Gus (which I mistakenly thought was the very next scene - but it wasn’t) the relationship between the two scenes carried a large significance.

I wonder if this sort of thing has happened in other parts of this story. If so, it would be a kind of “wink” from the writer to the audience and I think it would make for an awful lot of fun.

[Charlie_Wayne]

Oops. I meant my post #148 of the Episode 9 thread.

Fargo S1E9 [Open spoilers]

[PastTense]

@crucible

He was convicted (presumably) on the evidence available by a jury of his peers. Overturning that is not as easy as Molly telling the DA she suspects Lester was the one who killed his wife and Chaz was framed. What proof does she really have?

We never saw the trial so we don’t know exactly what the evidence was. But to me the only evidence I see is the hammer and other stuff in Chaz’ gun cabinet and whatever Lester has to say about the relationship. Does anyone else see any other? So if doubt is cast on this evidence there is no longer proof beyond a reasonable doubt.

[The_Second_Stone]

Chaz’ conviction is based largely on Lester’s testimony. Chaz’ lawyer could certainly ask for a new trial based on the Malvo tape and Lester’s behavior. Lester had plenty of opportunities to plant the evidence prior to being in the hospital.

[MsJinx]

The whole Supermarket King thing seemed designed to employ some of the original Fargo story about the buried money, and reinforce the background of Malvo’s job as hitman (first the accountant in Minneapolis, then find Stavros’ blackmailer)- as well as show his pleasure in creating novel ways to torment Stavros, manipulate the blackmailer, and get away with everything, as well as the different location bringing in another LE officer for Molly to confer with. The Hess widow and thug sons story was just for fun, with no tie in to the main story, except to show Lester evolving (or de-volving, since he wasn’t becoming a better person).

I’m glad there wasn’t an effort to tie it into the rest of the story, which would have appeared too forced. There were plenty of other Fargo movie references which were great, but I’m glad the money part was set apart and didn’t figure into the main Molly/Lester/Gus story.