bashere, you raise some excellent points. There are quite a few conditions that can be improved or eliminated with proper weight management.
Unfortunately, most doctors approach the weight aspect as the patient’s problem, which it partly is. I say partly because obesity has a significant psychological component. It’s a vicious circle. Low self-esteem can bring on overeating, which in turn, brings on more low self-esteem, in addition to the cruelty of others. Try being an overweight child in a classroom and a family that values thinness. It’s not fun. For that matter, try listening to a lover who tells you that you would be more attractive if only you weren’t so heavy.
Most insurance companies will not cover obesity treatment of any kind at all because it’s considered a “cosmetic” problem. This means that psychological, medical, and nutritional support are not available to a large portion of the population. My own insurance company, Medica (based in the upper Midwest), will cover certain treatments IF there is an underlying medical condition that will be significantly improved with weight management. Fine. But tell that to a doctor who has never been overweight, and who tells you just to watch what you eat. It’s not that simple.
Those of us who are overweight have enough of a burden to carry without having to listen to others cluck their tongues at us in judgment.
RE: the portion sizes in the US are huge. Is there a particular part of the US you refer to? I mean, it’s a big (pardon the pun) country, and I’ve found portion sizes vary from region to region. For instance, here in Seattle a Taco Salad is about six inches across and four inches deep. In Montana (only two states away), it’s twice and maybe even three times that size. So don’t judge the entire country by one region.
As to the fat question, yes I am, yes I’m coming to terms with it, (thankfully my husband not only likes me fat he LOVES my huge boobs!) and while I agree it doesn’t make sense for people to bemoan their condition without trying to change, my $0.02 on the subject is that sometimes it’s easier to bemoan THAN to change, especially if you’re changing for all the wrong reasons (to look more “acceptable”, to be prettier, to make my family jealous, etc.) Right now, I’m working to lose weight for my HEALTH, but even if I don’t lose a pound I’m still pretty healthy. (LOW blood pressure, I do exercise daily for 20-30 min walking, eating the right things in the right portion sizes, etc.)
I only hope you understand that sometimes a person’s actions might not be motivated by what you think they are: Being fat hurts more emotionally than physically. I know.
I hate to chime in and agree with what everyone else has said, but what the hell.
Webmstr, if you read the “Fat. vs. Thin Debate” thread, you’ll get a pretty good idea about how I feel toward your OP.
I really can’t see your OP as anything more that a thinly disguised rant against fat people in general. Oh, sure you have problems with the relative healthiness of Americans. Whatever. Basically you are saying that unless you are thin, you are disgusting and repulsive. That’s a fine attitude to take.
I weight about 160; I wear a size 12-14. When I was young and my parents divorced, I turned to Oreo’s for comfort. And man, did I eat a lot of Oreo’s. I was fat (size 20) for most of high school, until I finally decided to lose weight. I dieted down to a size 8, and looked pretty good. My first semester of college, I put on a little weight, made it up to a 12, dieted down to a 8, and now I’m back up there again. So I can say honestly that I know what I’m talking about when I say that being fat or thin doesn’t affect anything about me as a person. I have just as much self-esteem either way. I am the same person, have the same personality. When I was a size 8, I got hit on a lot more, but after the delusional rush of hormones, I realized that the men hitting on me were not men I wanted to date. I realized that how others percieved as a person didn’t change. Some people might not find my body sexy or beautiful or whatever; those people can kiss my big ol’ ass. Some guys might not want to date me because I’m not a size 6, but I don’t really want to date anyone like that either.
I work out three-four times a week at the YMCA. Tomorrow I’m planning on a particularly grueling 7-mile hike that will no doubt kick my ass, but I’m up for it. I eat a low-fat diet when I can; sometimes between work, family and everything else I can only manage the McD’s Drive-Thru. And hey, I LOVE TacoBell. The only way I can lose weight is to essentially starve myself. I know; I’ve done it. No breakfast, tuna and crackers for lunch, a salad for dinner, and water all the goddamn time. I did it for two years. I was hungry for two years. If I wanted to, I could start this diet tomorrow and be a size eight in two months. But I’m not particularly interested. Does this shock and horrify you?
I don’t know if I would disgust you or not. I don’t really care, as your whole attitude disgusts me. If you’re capable of looking at me and seeing nothing but a fat ass, than that’s your perogative. But it’s never that easy. People can never be summed up so easily. I am not sloppy, I am not lazy. I am a healthy person. I have high self-esteem. And I would feel the same exact way if I was a size twenty. I’ve worked extremely hard to reach a point where body image didn’t matter to me, and your ignorance to such a sensitive subject doesn’t hurt me or enrage me; it just saddens me. There are plenty of wonderful, kind, generous, beautiful people out there in not-so-perfect bodies, but I doubt you’ll ever be able to see that because you’re so caught up on the size they wear.
That’s just pathetic, IMHO. It’s sad and it’s lame.
You seem to be assuming that the overweight people you know (and the ones you see in America) have never tried to lose weight. In fact, almost every overweight person I have ever met has tried to lose weight. Most have tried more than once. Many have tried dozens, or even hundreds of times. Many have lost weight over, and over, and over again, and then gained it back.
So are these people all just lazy? Well not if you look at the rest of their lives. They are somehow able to do the hard work to succeed at incredibly demanding jobs, to raise families, to build lives for themselves…and yet, somehow, they can’t seem to lose weight. So what is a person to do if he or she has tried and tried, and lost countless pounds (which always came back), and spent enormous amounts of money, and devoted hundreds of hours to a state of emotional turmoil, only to find himself or herself right back where he or she started?
If you think it’s easy to just “eat right and exercise”, then I suggest you try life for six months in the body and mind of one of the people you are denigrating. Not only is it not easy for many overweight people, in the final analysis it is impossible. Which leaves them with two choices – be miserable, or accept themselves as they are.
Oh, and if fat people bother you so much, your eyes and your brain are probably defective. I suggest you try wearing a blindfold. Sure, it might be difficult at first – you might have trouble getting around or doing your job, and you won’t be able to drive, but I’m sure if you really put your mind to it you can do it. All it takes is a little willpower. And it will make life so much nicer for the rest of us.
The U.S. went from the Depression to wartime rationing. After the war the U.S. was untouched by the devastation that ravaged Europe and Asia. The result was that there were Americans who lived through the lean times of the Depression and war, and then had a surplus of food that the other countries didn’t have. So there was the psychological desire to stock up to avoid going hungry again, plus the availability of food. Motive plus opportunity equals a lot of people who are overweight. Much of the farmland was destroyed in the war, and the machines of modern farming were scarce. Petrol was also scarce. IMO, the people of Europe had the desire to fill their pantries, but the infrastructure to provide the foodstuffs was not in a condition to provide for them.
Biggirl, as I pointed out, I don’t give a rat’s ass if someone eats themselves silly so long as it doesn’t impact me personally. (Eat all my food, then I’ll get pissed.) As I explicity said, it annoys me when people repeatedly say what they want to do and don’t do anything to accomplish it. Eating fattening foods while complaining about being fat is one example of that. Sitting in a bar complaining about having too much homework to do (I live in a college town) is another. You have lots of homework and an exam tomorrow that you’re worried about? Go home and study, or tell funny stories and drink your beer. I don’t care if you’d rather party than study so long as you pick one.
Did I or anyone else say that all fat people do this? Did I say that it annoyed me to see anyone not rail-thin eat? Nope. I said that it annoyed me when people (and I wil restrict this to people around me-I can’t see the others so they don’t annoy me) repeatedly say to me that they want something and then don’t do anything to accomplish that goal. I also, you may notice, listed several other things along this line that pissed me off. I have a couple of people and relatives in my life who do this, whether about food or about something else. And yes, I reserve the right to be disgusted with someone who talks about how he’d look so good if he only lost 40lbs while shoving another dip-slathered Ritz cracker into his maw. On repeated occasions.
If this behavior doesn’t annoy you, then congratulations: you’re more tolerant than I and will no doubt live a happier life.
I have been lived in and traveled in the US extensively. I have at least visited and eaten in every state (and thus, by extension, every region). No, I have not sampled portions at every type of restaurant or dinery, or normal household, in every region. But pretty close. And the only difference I see in the size of portions are ‘huge’ ‘really huge’ and ‘ridiculously huge’.
"So what is a person to do if he or she has tried and tried, and lost countless pounds (which always came back), and spent enormous amounts of money, and devoted hundreds of hours to a state of emotional turmoil, only to find himself or herself right back where he or she started?
If you think it’s easy to just “eat right and exercise”, then I suggest you try life for six months in the body and mind of one of the people you are denigrating. Not only is it not easy for many overweight people, in the final analysis it is impossible. Which leaves them with two choices – be miserable, or accept themselves as they are."
Amen. That’s exactly it. I would be willing to bet that I have spent far more time and energy trying to lose weight and be fit than most of you who are of normal weight. Weight is not a simple matter of calories. I have tried, damn it, and I am still trying, but don’t you dare tell me it would be easy to lose weight until you have lived in a body like mine. It might be easy for you, but it is not for me and not for psychological reasons, either. Bodies are different, you idiot.
What exactly are you trying to say? That severe calorie restriction or other dietary changes, combined with consistent, vigorous exercise, for months, even years on end, is the same thing as taking a bath? Is that how you view what fat people are facing, as nothing more complex, difficult, challenging or relentless than taking a shower? Would that be what you are trying to convey here?
And I’m even more stumped about the threadbare clothing and nudists…what kind of comparison are you drawing there? I’m utterly in the dark on those…
stoid
just looking for some clarity…
You’ve missed the point of my post. Everyone complains and some people do it excessively and excessive complaining about anything will get on anyone’s nerves. This does not mean that you should then go and make a stereotypical, nasty and mean statement so that everyone could “Yup, couldnta said it better myself.”
I didn’t take long for someone to come along and do just that.
You are comparing fat people to vomit covered people. Are fat people that much an assault on your senses? The only one being harmed by fat people not taking proper care of themselves is fat people.
But just like smelly people, who make working around them so hard by stinking up the place, fat people should lose weight so that everyone around them doesn’t have to look at a fat person? This analogy stinks to high heaven.
I think it may be very hard to lose enough weight to become a Randy Moss (er, sorry) Kate Moss look-alike, or star in a Calvin Klein advert. No one expects that.
If you try, I think it would be very hard NOT to lose enought weight that gets you below the ‘obese’ stage. Um, this is where things get tricky, because the definition of obese sounds pretty fluid, and figuring out just what our ideal body weight is and all apparently is all but impossible. OK. I personally think that the modern life style has probably raised the normal/average body weight and, as I say for about the third time, ***I have no problem with people ‘overweight’ ***. Those last 5-15lbs. are probably a real pain in the ass, and given modern lifestyles of long hours in front of a PC, or at a desk, or in a car, there is probably not much to do about that.
I am strictly talking about people well over ‘merely overweight’. And I think we all know what we mean. Given all the posts, and evidence presented so far, I still do not believe that someone more than 50lbs. overweight would find it ‘really difficult’ to bring that down to a more managable 15-20lbs.
Maybe you and I have been going to different restaurants . . . I’m fairly skinny (5’10" and 155 lbs) and I have never found portions in restaurants to be large enough for me. This past semester I somewhat-regularly went to Denny’s, IHOP, etc. I never left those restaurants feeling filled.
As for lots of fat people chiming in here . . . if you title an OP “X kind of person”, don’t be surprised if more of them open the thread and respond the way they have here. Most of the people who haven’t responded, IMO, feel that the people here have things under control. Or they don’t even feel you’re worthy of a response.
[hijack]N4S, please, dear, don’t go on a diet. You look fabulous as-is.
Wanna bet? Weight Watchers now has an intermediate goal, wherein you are supposed to lose 10% of your body weight. For me, that is around 26 lbs. At an intelligent rate of 2 lbs per week, I’d spend 13 weeks just making that first goal. It is very discouraging.
In a controlled environment (for example, in a hospital or camp setting), losing weight is not that hard. The food is pre-planned, pre-measured, pre-cooked, and you don’t have access to any other food. Additionally, there is exercise time, and time spent in group counseling and meal-planning classes, and possibly additional psychiatric help and medication.
In the real world, things are different. I don’t have time to prepare three nutritious meals per day. I eat what I can when I can. And I’m in a profession where junk food is available more than it should be.
I know I’m dangerously overweight. Telling me to my face to lose it isn’t going to work. Sorry.
I shouldn’t be surprised (for reasons that I stated in my last post) that people are trying to twist my analogy in this way. Perhaps I was not clear on this touchy subject. And the vomit imagery was just a colorful metaphor; you know, just like the ones people on this very thread are lobbing against rail-thin people.
Please let me restate: I’m not comparing taking a bath to losing weight. The comparison was of the choice to be a certain way (overweight, scantily clad, smelly, etc.). To wit: if you (whether IRL or hypothetically) are overweight, are you as open-minded about others’ choices in dress, hygiene, etc.? I’m not pointing fingers, defaming overweight people (nobody in my family is at an ideal weight, and why are you so quick to assume I’m not overweight myself??), or trying to pick a fight. I’m just posing a topic that, if it was an OP, would probably be over in GD.
I’m just trying to gauge how we see other choices (again, I’m only referring to people who choose to be fat and stay that way) and the people behind them. Kindly leave me out of your cross-hairs, and excuse my sloppy analogy if it doesn’t hold water.
Actually, I agree with the “it’s bad for me and if I had a brain in my head I’d lose weight” argument. About the only bright spot to being as fat as I am is that I know what will kill me.
What we haven’t gotten into is the social cost of being fat. I consume somewhat, though not as much as the OP might think, more food than a thin person. I pay for the extra, but in a world with as many hungry people as this one that is socially irresponsible. I feel more comfortable in a larger car. (Quoting a friend, “You had a little Dodge Colt? I’d PAY to see you getting in and out of one of those!”) The added mass of the larger car and larger driver require more gasoline to drag around. Again, I pay for the extra, but the social blah-blah-blah. Ditto for my larger clothes.
I will probably die relatively young. There is a social upside to this, in that I don’t expect to see ANY of my Social Security contribution. You skinny folks can thank us fatties for helping to pay for your retirement. On the other hand, if my fatal disease does not manage to kill me outright I may be a burden on my family, my health insurance company, and the State.
There are a lot of reasons I’m fat. None of them are very good reasons. But that still doesn’t mean I have to put up with any shit from some skinny-assed Canuck.
Am I allowed to say, “yeah, it pisses me off when the people in my life do the same thing?” when someone refers to a specfic person’s behavior? (And yes, in fact, big chicken dinners can be part of that. But not Popeye’s. There isn’t a Popeye’s in town. So the stereotype wasn’t 100% accurate.) That’s what I meant, Biggirl. If that’s not what you understood, then I respectfully suggest that you missed the point of my original (and second) post. At this point, the question would be whether I was unclear or you were anxious to find personal insult where none was meant. Either seems possible.
Hopefully, that clears that up. Care for some home-made fried potatoes (my personal vice)?
