[/hijack]
Xeno, the way I see it, I’m the only one NOT whining. Of course I have redeamable qualities and the power of reason, however that doesn’t mean I’m gonna agree with you.
The pussy comment had nothing to do with toughness, please. It was just a snipe of the sort I’ve been receiving from you and others, so I thought i’d return the favor.
And what’s this bullshit about “living with the straights”, seriously…
-Sam
For the record, it was “scaring the straights”, one of the few funny lines from Ghostbusters 2.
BTW, I don’t care if you agree with me; that’s not why I’m posting. Reading the large majority of the other posts, I think I’m not alone in trying to get you to see that you’re being childish as well as churlish in your obstinate refusal to turn the fuckin’ music down. It aint like walkin’ a dog down the street, it’s more like taking your dog onto my porch and letting him shit on my doorstep. Even if you scoop it up and walk away, your dog just shit on my doorstep!
Fair enough.
Dickweed.
(dammit, I’m startin’ to like you now. Stop that.)
You totally missed the point. I asked you to assume that walking a dog was offensive. I didn’t say as a fact that it was.
So pretend with me for a moment. You see a dog being walked. You’re offended. Disgusted. Revolted. You can’t understand why anyone would want to walk their Dog. Frankly, it pisses you off.
It’s not illegal, and they’re doing nothing wrong but not respecting your feelings. Are they infringing upon your rights not to see a dog being walked? Hell no. Are you infringing upon their right by asking them not to walk their dog? By golly, yes you are.
Yes it’s ridiculous, but as I said, it’s simply an analogy.
This analogy is exactly What you all are attempting to impose upon me, or people like me.
If you like Chopin, and someone’s playing it at a level that you consider to be “too loud” by your standards, are you going to roll your windows up in disgust, or are you going to give him the “thumb’s up”?
Probably doesn’t justify my behavior, and I don’t expect you to understand or agree with me, but I think this would be generalization and stereotyping of music types more than anything. Look inside and tell me if it makes a difference whether I’m listening to Puffdaddy or your music of choice.
-Sam
I’m driving my 1958 delivery wagon through heavy traffic on a hot day. Traffic creeps forward and waddaya know, there’s GaWsh sitting there in his over priced slammed Prickmobile with the stereo cranked up to ‘homogenize’. Even with my windows up the noise is astounding. His favorite gansta rap trash sounds like a slow motion train wreck, “GANGSTAS IN THE HOOD POP A CAP IN YO ASS, SMOKE A LITTLE BLUNT, SLAM A LITTLE TAR, GONNA SLAP IT TO A HO AND THEN GO CROOZIN IN MY CAR…” (latest from SnoopHoPimpDawg). My mirrors vibrate, my eyeballs blur, sparrows drop paralyzed from the sky, cracks appear in the bridge ahead.
Traffic creeps forward some more, and now my 3" diameter exhaust is lined up with his open driver’s window. A generous billow of black smoke pumps directly into his face. It’s so thick it sprays a mist of stinking oil onto his way cool shades. He gags, chokes, and frantically rolls up his window. That only helps a little since his air intake is from the base of the windshield. He hacks, wheezes, curses, and flips me off.
What? What? I ask. Hey, the truck just does that, get used to it or get over it like a growed up person. It’s my TRUCK, my RIDE, my PREROGATIVE. Like, the motor’s got over 40 years on it, you’d smoke too. So what if I had to put a day tank on it just to keep oil in the crankcase. It runs fine, it don’t need a rebuild. It’s a classic. Breathe somewhere else if you don’t like it you pussy bastard. I’m just passing through anyway, what’s the hassle? What are you, too lame to handle a little smoke? Wanna kick my ass? Just give it a try. FUCK DA SMOG COPS! Get a set of lungs. Geez, what a weak sister.
Gawd, I can only think at this point that your hearing has been so damaged that you don’t know how uncomfortable loud music, loud anything can be.
It’s not the style of music, it’s the loudness. That’s what this has all been about, kapeesh? I don’t give a rat’s ass what style of music you listen to, but if it’s too damned loud it sounds like shit to me. Take it from someone who has attempted to retain some of the hearing she was born with…loud music is painful. It probably isn’t for you anymore, with your fried-out eardrums and all. But don’t presume to speak for the rest of us. Don’t flippantly tell us to “ignore” it. You obviously have no idea how disruptive and uncomfortable (not to mention asthetically displeasing) loud music is.
But, you know…I’m sure it’s pointless. You refuse to see (or should I say “hear”) this. You just wanna do what you wanna do, screw the rest of us.
What the hell are you drooling about, man?
Is all that come your boyfriend has been pumping up your ass started to affect your brain so much it’s now comin’ out your mouth?
What the fuck is that shit supposed to mean, it’s not but assume it is?
I have a website for ya
http://www.ICANTTALK.com
It’s gotten to the point that you don’t even realize how much of a shmuck you sound like.
What you’re basicall saying is:
“Duh, assume that if I walked up and pissed in your face, and you got mad, but I like to do that, so fuck you, you should ignore it.”
FUUUUCK THAT!
You are still here? Still stamping your foot and insisting that you have a valid point?
Still insisting that it’s okay for your to shove yourself in my face everytime I have the shitty luck to be within 50 feet of you?
When your mom tried to abort you it only killed 92% of your brain right?
That’s the only excuse for the shit you are saying.
If you shut your ass after the part where you said
“I know I am asshole, and I don’t care” then that would be tolerable, I guess.
But you keep on, trying to justify being an asshole, and it only makes you look like something worse…
An ignorant, petulant, self-righteous, pig-headed moron asshole.
Those are the worst. I hope your stereo has some kind of phreak short in it and crisps your balls up good the next time you bump it at a stoplight.
Dick.
Pansy.
Pussy.
Panty-waist.
Douche-bag.
all typos (sic) so fuck off.
Oh hell guys, this is too easy. We’ve beat him to a pulp already. He’s even admitted that he’s wrong.
Face it, no amount of keelhauling will change his habits. Give him awhile to think about it and maybe he’ll grow up.
Let’s throw this one back.
Like I said before, I don’t think the deal here is that GaWd is wrong. This isn’t an issue of right vs. wrong, it is simply an issue of courtesy.
GaWd, you keep harping on the legality of playing your music loudly and the right you have to listen to it. Thats true! You do indeed have the right to play your music, in your car. However, it is a matter of common courtesy to others to turn it down.
What you are basically saying is “Since I have the right to do it I don’t care if it makes you uncomfortable.”
So be it. That’s too bad, it makes me wonder if this is the same GaWd that’s been posting all along in other threads, or if maybe that GaWd is on vacation and got his account hijacked. But barring that, I think it’s time we all agree that this comes down to the fact that we would choose to be courteous, and GaWd doesn’t. Simple as that.
Unfortunate. You said that if everyone was like us and was so sensitive, the world would really be a terrible place. Oh the irony.
-S
Shadenwawa said:
I feel like I’m joining the Confederate Army ten minutes before Appomattox here, but what the heck.
What Shadenwawa said above is probably true: It’s not a matter of law, it’s a matter of courtesy. And maybe I’m being disourteous by not turning down my stereo when I pull up next to you.
But I’m going to postulate two things. One, while discourteous, is it more, less, or equally as discourteous as other things people do?
I really didn’t like people coming home drunk and being loud in my apartment parking lot at 2 o’clock in the morning. More or less discouteous? I’d say more: I don’t play my stereo when most people are asleep, don’t inflict it on them at home, and they don’t have to put up with me for longer than the length of a red light.
I don’t like goofy throbbing mufflers on Harleys. More or less? Probably about the same. Just as loud, just as fleeting.
I don’t like mothers breastfeeding their babies at restaurants. More or less? About the same, only different. It’s less invasive, but lasts longer.
I don’t like children crying on airplanes. More or less?Probably more. It’s invasive, lasts quite a while, and I’m a captive audience. And, what’s more, I paid to be subjected to it.
I don’t like buses idling next to my car. More of less? Probably more. Just like music, the exhaust, as well as the noise, comes into my car. And exhaust can cause me physical damage, as some guy’s stereo probably.
My point here is that there are lots of discourteous things that go on around us every day, but we put up with them, because we realize they are a cost of living in the world. Is blasting loud mustic inconsiderate? Sure. Should you put up with it without whining? You bet.
Two, how is my playing loud music any different than some street preacher yelling through a microphone downtown, telling me I’m going to hell? Is it as inconveniencing to have to detour because of a political parade? Sure it is. Do we put up with both of them because we recognize the right of people to spout without being very curtailed? Sure we do. It’s free speech. How do you know the kid in the car next to you isn’t making a political statment by booming some Paris out at you while you’re at a stoplight? With some rap music lyrics, he could be. Is that kind of speech more or less considerate than bumping Cirrus?
And despite many people’s protestations to the contrary, deep down, I suspect it really does depend on the type of music being played. Say you’re a Steppenwolf fan, as illustrated in a previous post. Some guy rolls up next to you with “Born to Be Wild” ripping shit up. Are you going to bop along with him? Most likely, yes. The problem really comes when someone comes with a kind of music you don’t like playing. Why should people change their behavior based on what you like? I’ve heard lots of examples of blasting music here, and I think ninety percent of it has used rap music an example. Why? Because lots of middle-class white folks don’t like it. So they feel the need to get rid of it. But let me tell you, I could be riding along, listening to Beethoven’s Ninth, and some guy will come up next to me booming. And I’ll turn down my music so I can listen to his. Because I appreciate it. If you enjoyed bass-heavy rap, I suspect you wouldn’t complain so much.
So, in conclusion, my three points are thus: It’s just as inconsiderate as other things I don’t hear people complaining about; it could seriously be considered as a First Amendment right; and the only reason, really, we’re having this discussion is because you don’t like rap music.
I think I’ll go slide into that asbestos jumpsuit now…
So you might as well add to the inconsiderateness in the world, right? No use trying to make it better rather than worse?
I hardly think so, or else all noise ordinances would be unconstitutional.
Don’t come in my house with that weak-ass shit. I have been a staunch defender of rap music on this board, in all forums and in various threads. In fact, anytime anyone pipes up with some “rap isn’t music” or “why does anyone listen to Crap?” thread, I am the first one to provide legitimate reasons why rap is as valid as anything else that falls under the definition of music; and to point out the incipient racism that leads people from simply saying “I don’t like rap” to “It isn’t music.” (Have you ever heard anyone say, “I don’t like Beethoven, and it isn’t even real music”?)
So that one, my friend, isn’t going to cut it. Besides, where I live, it’s just as likely to be Skynyrd or KISS or Crue or somesuch coming from those speakers. Rudeness is rudeness, and I don’t much give a rat’s ass what genre it is.
Exactly. And I repeat what I wrote before - it’s the loudness of it that is so offensive.
I have attempted to retain most of my hearing. Oh, I’m sure I have some hearing damage, but not too terrible. And let me tell you, I encounter a lot of people who have far worse hearing than me, because of their music listening habits. So, LOUD music doesn’t bother them. It doesn’t hurt their ears. They are beyond that - it’s too late, their hearing has already been permenantly damaged. But mine hasn’t. And you know what? I’d like to keep it that way.
Let me tell you, no matter whether it’s Beethoven, Sting, or Ice T being played, if it’s TOO LOUD, IT HURTS. IT IS UNCOMFORTABLE. Just because you don’t see what the big deal is (because of your fried-out eardrums) doesn’t mean that the rest of us who still have our hearing don’t have a legitimate reason to complain.
Also, the case can be made that there are many “uncomfortable” things out in the world that we have to contend with. The breastfeeding mother, the stinky bus. But a loud radio needn’t be added to the list. I’m sure no one wants the bus to be stinky, I’m sure if there was some way to NOT make it stinky (without having to spend lots of dough) the owners of the bus wouldn’t make it that way. The breastfeeding mom has gotta feed her kid, somewhere, OK? But the loudness of someone’s radio is purely an voluntary thing. The car will still run if the radio is not loud…you have to go out of your way to turn the damned thing up. And yet you still do that, you out of your way to do something that is going to be annoying, offensive and even uncomfortable to those around you. If that is not selfishness, I don’t know what is.
pldennison said:
I don’t have problem with that. I think we’d all be better off freedom-wise if lots of laws were rendered unconstitutional, including noise-ordinances.
and then said:
Dammit! Lost one of my legs. OK, PL, I’ll concede this point to you. However, I still maintain that for a lot of people, not liking the type of music has more to do with their objections than the volume.
Then, yosemitebabe said:
Do you never go to concerts? Do you never drive by a jackhammer? Or have to walk across the tarmac at an airport? There are lots of things louder than a normal car stereo. But you pay to go see concerts, right? So you pay to be hurt? I’m probably not making an effective point here, but it’s this: Hurting because of loud sound is OK, but only if you want it to be, right? Or are you one of those who wish concerts were quieter?
Look, I realize that I’m working from a neigh-indefensible position here. I told my office roomate what I was going to do (get into it on GaWd’s side in this discussion), and he looked at me askance and asked, “How are you going to do that?”
Anyway, I also got to thinking about the characteristics of the people who complain, wondering if there was some connection there. I went to an inner city high school back in the day, and never once heard someone complain about a loud car. All the people I hear complain about it are middle-aged or older white people. They may very well not be true, but in my experience it is.
Then I thought, maybe people do it to get back at a society that’s been “keeping them down.” Which may be. But that’s not why I do it.
Why do I do it? I like my music loud. Normally I keep my car windows rolled up, which deadens the sound quite a bit. But when it’s hot, I like to roll with the windows down. I guess I’m just not convinced that living in this so-called free society I should always do things that accommodate others. There is definitely a strong current of “I’ll do what I want, so fuck you” running through American society. We allow people to do what they want, to an extent, because they’re really not hurting anybody, right (disregarding the mega-stereos yosemitebabe is talking about, which seem to me to be exceedingly rare). Politeness is important, but it’s not the most important thing in the world. If I want to paint my house bright orange and purple, I’m gonna do it, and to hell with what the neighbors thing, because it’s my house. They may not like it, but that’s why I don’t live, nor would want to live, in a covenent controlled community. It’s probably the same thing with a car stereo. It’s my stereo, so too bad.
So, I concede your points. Is it inconsiderate? Yes. Do I have a right to do it? Probably. Will I stop doing it? Probably not. Does it mean that I hate you as a person? Of course not.
And then GaWd said:
Oh, I see how it is…
The Hollywood Bowl doesn’t play music that is so loud it hurts, thankyouverymuch. I have attended Bowl concerts since I was a teen - never had a problem. I don’t pay to have my eardrums blasted out, anywhere. If I find myself in a place where the sound is too loud, you’ll see me plugging my ears with my fingers. It hurts. And I’m not the only one who feels that way.
I really think the problem here is that some people are so accustomed to loud sounds - loud concerts, their walkmans played at full volume, their extremely loud car stereo, that they don’t know how uncomfortable it can be for the rest of us. These people already have significant hearing loss. So they think that those of us that are complaining about these loud noises are just being picky and anal. (“What’s the big deal? Doesn’t sound that bad to me!”) When in fact, we are complaining because we simply are not DEAF yet, so these sounds bother still us. But hey, extremely loud sounds aren’t uncomfortable when you already are half-deaf, right?
Yewch! Nothing like massive thunderstorms to knock out communications! (SLC has been bombarded with storms. It’s not that I’m ignoring anyone, I just couldn’t get on-line… anyway)
Friendly nitpicking is always fun.
It’s your fucking music! Okay, you said it, it’s your FUCKING MUSIC!
Anyway, honey, don’t call me spineless! I’m spineless because I don’t want to bother others or infringe on their personal rights? To you, that is spineless??? No. That is respect. I have no need to assert my dominance by noise. And how can I assert my “right” to ignore you if you are doing this in my front yard?
You ARE forcing me to listen! How can I escape? This is going on in front of my home and within a block of my home… how can I NOT listen? It’s so loud that I cannot get away from it. Doors and windows closed it still booms into my home. Sometimes so distorted that it knocks pictures off the walls. How do you propose I ignore it? Uh, I almost hate to do this but a “growed-up person”… a what? Growed up? You mean a grown up? I was hoping you would be one of those!
I’m not just arguing with you for the sake of argument. This isn’t the Monty Python argument clinic. I’m just giving you the flip side. If you want to give up, fine. I’m not telling you that your feelings are wrong. I’m telling you that you need to wake up to the global perspective. And what the hell are you trying to do with the D.E.D horse thing? Do you mean Q.E.D.? Quod Erat Demonstrandum? (Which was to be demonstrated or we have proved the proposition we set out to prove)?
I got real lame? Who, boy! The pot calling the kettle and all.
P.S. pldennison – please refrain from such posts in the future. I don’t like spitting water all over my keyboard! speakeasy – thank you for referring to some vital stats. (You wanker, I was GONNA do that but NOOOOO, you had to beat me to it!) kinoons – thank you. I don’t mind anyone “doing their thing” but it sounds like you have respect for those around you. Thank you.
Sorry, I was going to end but dog walking and this? And you bitched about the drug thing? I do walk my dog. If she happens to take a shit on a neighbor’s lawn I bag it. Again, common courtesy I think “curb” your dogs springs to mind. But my dog taking a dump on your lawn doesn’t (even IF she ate chilli dogs the night before) involve extended periods of bass. I doubt her farts could so much as rattle your key chains let alone your windows. And you thought MY comparison was silly!
Well, between SDMB being up and down these last 2 days(it still took 20 minutes to load this page on a T1), and the fact that my words would fall on deaf ears anyways, I’m pretty much ignoring this thread.
I agree with Necros, of course. I don’t feel that my rights are “violated” when I’m on the plane with a kid who wails for 4 hours, and I don’t ask them to hang out on the wing when they do it. I find it at LEAST as annoying, if not more annoying than a frigging stereo!
So, get off of your high-horses and remember that I don’t want to hear your dog bark all night, your Harley’s exhaust, your whining child, or your domestic disputes. Those are all loud, disturbing, annoying(in Yosemite’s perspective, it hurts me so bad).
Just because you have a dog, a child, ride a bike, argue with your SO, doesn’t mean I want to hear it, and you don’t have the right to force them on me, it’s discourteous to me, and I don’t appreciate it as much as you don’t appreciate my stereo.
So shut the dog up, stuff a sock in the child’s mouth, put a SuperTrapp on your Harley exhaust, and keep your arguments with your SO inside and under raps.
-Sam
P.S.-- Keep it up Necros
You aren’t even trying to get it. You’re going out of your way to not get it, the way you go out of your way to turn your radio up.
But I understand, since you are half-deaf already, no sound, no matter how loud, hurts your ears any more. Your dead eardrums can’t register pain anymore. So it doesn’t occur to you that loud sounds (like a radio that is so loud it’s making the walls vibrate) actually does cause pain to the ears of people who still have semi-normal hearing. But hey - since you are obviously half-deaf, who cares about those whiners with their good hearing? Screw them, right? Let’s all be deaf together. Right?
My ears are perfectly good, thank you very much.
And,BTW, I think you’re going WAYYYY out of your way not to see mine and Necros’ point, thank you very much, Because the above points you decided to quote are VERY valid as the EXACT fucking type of annoyance/PITA that a loud stereo is.
A car stereo hurts yo widdow ears? Gimme a fucking break. I’m sure there are some “Mega-systems” that would deafen a person, but I’ve only run into one, maybe two that could do any true harm(and that’s when some moron has his treble turned WAY up), or cause pain.
If my stereo hurts your ears, then you’ve never been to a real concert, and you don’t live in any proximity to an airport. They are both many times louder than my stereos have ever been, so get off of it.
-Sam
Gosh, I just love folks who say they are ignoring a thread. That is a much better excuse than mine of having a life and the computer being down due to thunder and lightening. Yeah, you are just so much “tough” because you just “don’t give a shit.” Wish I could just say that to neighborhood concerns. But, shit, I live here. And I do care. And I give a shit. I might not be the most frequent poster but I care a lot. Anyway…
Hi honey, it’s me again. You know, that rational poster that you argue with occasionally. So riddle me this Batman. I said I have a dog. Yes, I do. About 50 pounds of mutt (German Shepard, Australian Shepard and God only knows what else was in the neighborhood that day she was conceived)
She is the cutest thing you ever saw! Really! She is so fucking cute that her face gives me cavities because she is so sweet! But she is also a very well trained dog. She knows sit, stay, shake, stand, roll… You see, she is trained. Also, for your information, she isn’t confined to the yard. She is a valid part of my home. She is my child. I know, I can just see you going, “And so who gives a fuck, bitch?”
Well, she sleeps inside on my bed. She is my cuddle-muffin. She is my hairy-bowlegged-child. She doesn’t bark up and down the neighborhood at night. In fact, if and WHEN she does bark (as she has been trained) it means there is something wrong. Trust me, if my dog is barking and you live next to me, it’s something you want to know about. Because she has been trained. She doesn’t bark at nothing. She barks when someone is in the yard. She barks when an intruder is within our territory.
My dog, unlike most in my neighborhood, knows the difference between a child riding his bike along the sidewalk and an unknown man “casing” the joint. She knows who lives here and who is “wrong”. Other folks have dogs. Yep. They do. They have dogs that bark at every fart in the wind. Why? They were not trained. They are not bad dogs; they are dogs with irresponsible owners. This is a problem where I live. Yes, it is. Dogs without control, barking without reason.
We also have domestic disputes. Folks who fight like children because they don’t know any better. They generate a lot of noise with their problems and sometimes gun fire. I call the cops. Again, as I’ve said to you, it falls under that noise ordinance. You know, the one you said you didn’t have. The one that if you had didn’t apply to you.
My neighbor’s constantly barking dog, their loud angry fights, their son’s loud stereo… it’s noise, it’s a problem. It’s not okay. They have no right to inflict this “noise pollution” on me. Or you. I really, really hate to say this but you really proved my point.
You don’t want to listen to screaming babies, barking dogs, loud bikes or fighting neighbors. You have the right not to. It falls under the noise ordnance. It comes back to the same thing I’ve said to you time and time again:
Your rights end where my privacy begins.
Your neighbor’s loud dogs, wailing children, domestic disputes. Those are just as loud and obnoxious as your “choice of music” at a stop light. There is no “ignoring” it. There is no getting away from it. It must be stopped.
Get it now?
It’s called respect. It’s called taking responsibility for yourself, your animals, your equipment. It’s all about respect. Do YOU have any?
Have you had your hearing checked recently? Unless you have, I really would not be convinced of that. And even if your hearing isn’t shot yet, it will be soon. Music that is loud enough to disturb others (the way we are discussing) does cause hearing loss.
See, if you crank your stereo up all the time, you get used to it, your ears become numb to it, and it stops hurting. Just because you think it couldn’t, or shouldn’t hurt, doesn’t mean it won’t hurt someone else. I know you refuse to believe this. But it doesn’t make it not so. And even if you belittle it and make fun of the concept, it still doesn’t make it not so.
When people protect their hearing, (so it’s like…still normal) these loud sounds are uncomfortable. I’ve been in many a situation where I had to ask someone to turn it down a bit (or I had to politely cover my ears) because it was just TOO DAMNED LOUD! And the person just couldn’t figure out what the big deal was, because, of course, they’d gotten used that noise level, they were already starting to lose their hearing, and it didn’t hurt them anymore. But I’ll say it again…just because your ears are numb to the deafening noise, doesn’t mean that there are plenty of people that would be made quite uncomfortable by it. Don’t presume to speak for the rest of us.
The Hollywood Bowl does hold REAL concerts, and I’ve attended countless Hwd. Bowl concerts. What constitutes a “real” concert to you, anyway? Who gets to define what a “real” concert is?
No, I don’t live that near an airport, but I sure have flown enough, and yes, the sound can get uncomfortable. And yes, I’ve been known to cover my ears. But I don’t see why I should have to cover my ears in traffic because some SEMI-DEAF BASTARD next to me has to crank it up in their car.