I’ve seen upthread the suggestion that cunt isn’t regarded as being as offensive here in the UK. I assure you it is - and for one simple reason: there is a hierarchy of insults, and cunt is at the top. All insults are used more than they used to be, so they have all lost some of their potency, but if you’re striving for the strongest verbal effect, cunt is still your man. If you see what I mean.
I think that the C-word is offensive in part because it says, in effect, that a woman is only valuable as a means of sexual gratification for males, and that she’s not even really a person.
As for the male equivalent, I’ve heard of men described as dcks and prcks, but it doesn’t seem to be as offensive. Yes, it is offensive, as it suggests that the man in question, and possibly all men, are not thinking beings, but are instead ruled solely by their sexual urges. While this might be true of an individual man (I’ve certainly run across some guys who seem to think only about getting laid), it’s not true of men in general. Or at least, it’s not true of human males who are not in junior high and high school. Even of males in that age range, many are capable of thinking of something OTHER than sex.
I think it reflects hugely on the person saying it. I have never - in 58 years - used the word in anger. In fact, the only times I’ve used it has been in threads here discussing swear words (as above). I’m not saying that makes me better than those who do use it, just that I haven’t felt the need.
I’d like to know why people feel the need. Maybe because it’s short, sharp and pithy. It’s designed to cause offence, but it has a splatter gun effect. It doesn’t target the reason for its use. It’s an expletive used when anger has robbed the person of the ability to use more considered language, or when that person’s sole intention is to use the word as a weapon.
I think the word has been robbed of any real meaning. It is just a blunt weapon.
Lynn Bodoni said:
That is the subtext of the insult. That is why it is seen by many to be at the same level as nigger.
Oddly, I don’t really see those words that way. That may have been the subtext of use, but they have been used so heavily that that subtext is almost completely gone. Those words are just now generic male insult words, like bastard. They all mean “extreme jerk”.
I don’t believe there is a male equivalent to the insult cunt. I think part of the issue is power imbalance. Women have historically had a lack of power men have had, and using cunt as an insult is predicated on that power imbalance. It’s similar to bitch, but has a stronger connotation.
NineToTheSky said:
To a large extent, that applies to most swear-word insults. They’re just weapons against the other party. Some of them carry some inflection of the kind of offence the recipient has committed (i.e. calling a guy a pussy conveys a wimpitude, calling someone a bastard implies a meanness, etc), but mostly they’re just weapons to make the other person feel as hurt as the person using the words.
But cunt doesn’t carry that kind of meaning, it’s just “you’re a woman and I hate you”. In fact, bitch has largely been used that way.
But cunt is said to men as well as women. More often than not, I don’t think it has a specific meaning. It may have started out that way, but now it’s either an extreme expletive, or (as I have said in another thread some time ago) used - actually I’m not sure what its use is. An example: ‘I went to the fucking shops today and I saw this fucking cunt, and you should have fucking seen what he was fucking wearing…’ I hear this in the streets daily. I think it’s used in the same way as ‘y’know’ and ‘innit’; as a meaningless bolster.
Oh C’MON. :rolleyes:
C’mon yourself.
You disagree with the rules? Fine. We accept that.
But to blatantly poke a rule in our face by disregarding and deliberately flaunting it? By posting a banned word 38 times in one post? There’s a point when a decision concerning an individual has to be made. It was. By not one, but many of the moderators.
If that post would have contained any word but one of the banned ones, it might have been funny. But by simply posting that one word over and over, it’s a clear cut decision.
Disagree with me? Fine. But as I said, be civil about it. Don’t roll your eyes. Don’t poke us with a sharp stick. When we make a decision, feel free to question us on it. We do listen to your concerns. If you can show us where we went wrong, we might be able to rectify a mistake. But when the supervisor of this board makes a decision, we simply have to live with it. Like it or not.
“Oh C’mon” with a rolleyes smiley tells me nothing. What, in your opinion, did I do wrong? In SDMB parlance, “Cite?”
You and I have known each other on this board a long time, Guin. However, you can’t simply post a rolleyes smiley and expect me to be able to answer your concerns.
I stand by the decision.
Do you even read and understand the rules you’re supposed to be enforcing?
The word “cunt” is NOT banned. It’s never been banned in the Pit, and nor has it been banned in any other forum.
The rule regarding “cunt” and its variants is as follows:
Bolding mine.
Point conceded, mhendo. However, there is this:
Hate speech. Against gender. I can’t think of any word that would convey more hate against women than “cunt”.
And you’re missing the main point. Namely, the poking with a sharp stick.
I’m a very reasonable person. You can sway me with good arguments. But you can’t sit and poke at me - 38 times in one post - and then stand up and cry that I fouled you. Won’t fly.
Keep changing your argument, Rico, it just makes you look worse and worse for flying off the handle. You edited your original post from “I’m tired of it.” (or something similar, I didn’t think you’d be so dishonest as to change your justification so I didn’t make particular note of it at the time) to “Suspensions in the past, warnings, nothing works, apparently.” too.
Be honest, did you ban first, and then make sure you had backup?
Just how many times do you need to move the goalposts in order to justify yourself?
While i concede that the word “cunt” has its origins in a certain kind of misogyny, it’s simply not “hate speech” in the way that words like “nigger” or “faggot” are hate speech. For one thing, as others have already pointed out in this thread, despite the gendered origins of the term, it is far more frequently applied to men than to women.
Second, the fact is that even words universally agreed to be hate speech, like “nigger” and “faggot,” are not banned here if used in certain contexts. You can’t call someone a faggot, or talk about how “the niggers moved into the neighborhood,” but you can talk about the historical use of the words, or the ways in which they are used by particular subcultures.
A search of the boards shows 750 threads containing the word “nigger” in the last 4 years alone. That’s threads. I didn’t count individual posts. There are 719 threads in total containing the word “faggot.”
It was a goddamn joke. Jesus H. Fucking Christ. It was a bit lame, but if that’s what passes for a banning offense around here, i really don’t know what we’ve come to.
All indications to the contrary notwithstanding?
The original post was:
I for one hope that in future the mods continue to take a hard line with posters who want to push the rules as far as they can.
Fuck justifying every single little thing, fuck rules lawyers dissecting every line of every post to make some self-righteous point. Fuck them all, if posters seemingly want to step right up to the line and prod at the mods, then ban their asses.
Speaking of people who “push the rules,” it seems to me that saying “fuck them all” about a group of posters, when you are clearly referring to people in this very thread, could easily be construed as “pushing the rules” of ATMB.
But i guess the rules are different for you, right?
I was just posting that Garfield was right. It originally said exactly what mhendo just posted. I was heading back to find out my exact words and post them myself, but you beat me to it.
No. I had the consensus before I banned. I was injecting personal feelings into my reasoning, thought better of it, and changed it around.
It all comes down to this: Can you listen to the moderators here? Can you abide by decisions that are made, even if you don’t agree with them? Or do you have to sit in the middle of the room, with your sharp stick out, holding it a fraction of an inch from a moderator’s arm, saying, “I’m not touching you. Look, I’m not touching you. Mom, I’m not touching him!” 38 times in one post? That’s the main story here. Not the use of the word “cunt.”
This is childish. A decision was made. It was done properly. End of story. Drop it. I am.
If you question the decision further, please take it up the ladder to the administrators. My decision stands, pending any review from the administrators.
Grow up
Heh-I just did a google search of the SDMB. From March 1, 2000 to March 31, 2009 (roughly when this idiotic “naughty words” policy was put in place) there were 52 threads that mentioned the word “cunt”.
From March 31, 2009 to today? There were 51 threads–drop the “c-bomb” in two more threads and it’ll appear in more threads this year than in the entire history of the board prior to that rule.
Congrats folks, as a result of this stupid, nannyistic policy, you’ve increased the number of threads where the word “cunt” appears from roughly 9 threads a year to one thread per week. Boy, prohibition is effective, isn’t it? :rolleyes:
And yeah, I think it was a bullshit banning too. The rule is very clear that you can’t call another poster a “cunt” not that you can’t use the word. Calling it “hate-speech” is indefensible*–if he used it at a poster? Absolutely: ban him. But just to repeat the word over and over isn’t “hate-speech”. You don’t like what Xploder did? Great–change the rule to reflect what you want and ban the word outright. No rules were broken. He wasn’t even doing the “I’m not touching you” since he wasn’t defying a rule–or even dancing around it
*If using the word “cunt” without applying it to a poster is the new standard for hate-speech, I look forward to Der Trihs being banned for calling all conservatives child-rapists, racists and murderers.
Okay, this is getting to be more about people yelling at one another than accomplishing anything useful.
If you want to yell at one another, there’s the Pit.
If you want to have reasonable discourse on a subject, open another thread in the appropriate area.