In a way he did, because he allowed Qatari money to enter the strip, when he had the power to prevent this.
About to the same extent that Obama funded Iran by unlocking their frozen funds - yes, there are controls on what they can do with the money, but money is also fungible.
Netanyahu said publicly that Hamas needs to be kept strong in order to be a counterweight to other Palestinian organizations - he thought that would help prevent a two state solution.
Netanyahu has definitely and publicly been a long time ally of Hamas against two states.
FWIW…a quick Google search found this:
Netanyahu wants violence from Palestinians, so he can politically justify the ongoing oppression, land grabs and slow genocide. So he’ll prop up Hamas and sabotage anyone opposing them, because Hamas gives him what he wants. Every dead Israeli is a victory for Netanyahu. And Hamas too, but mostly for Netanyahu.
If the people guarding the aid station distributing food to starving people keeps killing those same starving people they’re doing it wrong whether they’re Hamas or the IDF. So both sides are fuck-ups in that regard, even if the motivation for killing people is allegedly different.
So they kill the people they’re supposed to be helping instead? What the actual fuck? That’s nonsensical.
You know, other countries have managed to feed hostile populations without murdering the starving on a daily basis. Israel is doing it wrong.
Maybe they should fucking stop making perfect the enemy of the good and accept that some aid will be diverted, but what the hell, people might actually be able to eat. I don’t have an answer. Sure as hell the Israeli government doesn’t, either.
So what is Israel planning to offer and/or give up in return to get that result?
I just want to note that we two ARE in agreement about everything in that paragraph. Even if we’re at odds about other things.
I’m sure @Babale will correct me if I have this wrong, but I believe at the time Hamas was the government of Gaza so… aid to Gaza was sent to the government of Gaza which was supposed to be acting on behalf of Gazans rather than spending it on bombs and mayhem. Which did not work out at all well for anyone in or near Gaza, as we have seen.
I don’t know if you were paying attention, but Israel won. What Israel gives up is round 2.
Yes, except that I’m not sure what you mean by “at the time” since Hamas is still the government of Gaza.
There’s a lot of space between ‘literal genocide’ and acting according to international norms, with due care and attention for the lives of civilians. Civilians who at best represent a massive inconvenience to Netanyahu.
Do you really think the Israeli government, under a PM who is admittedly a bad guy, are doing the latter? The evidence seems pretty compelling by now that that they are not. They could do a better job distributing aid and are choosing not to, either because they don’t care, or they actively prefer it that way.
…more fact checking:
Aid workers ARE being killed in Gaza. Mostly by the IDF.
Killing of health workers in the Gaza war - Wikipedia.
The total number is 224 humanitarian aid workers so far.
That number includes the seven killed in the World Food Kitchen attack. It includes the 15 Palestinian Red Crescent workers who were executed in cold blood.
Once again, Babale’s cite lacks verification. Hamas usually claims responsibility when they undertake a successful attack. They haven’t as far as I can tell, done so here. This fits more in the pattern of how the Israeli backed gangs have been operating than something that Hamas would do. I’m not discounting the possibility that Hamas were responsible: but once again, all we have are claims from Israel and the GHF. And neither of them have any credibility.
The reporting from the OPT is much more measured:
These killings were an atrocity. But they didn’t happen at any of the GHF sites, they happened in transit. It points to obvious failings in the GHF’s and the IDF’s protection plan. Over 80% of Gaza are militarised zones under control of the IDF. They only have FOUR aid distribution sites. They reportedly knew of credible threats.
But they couldn’t protect these men. Babale wants us to think the IDF are massacring Palestinians daily in self-defence. But they can’t even set up a safe corridor. Or put a few soldiers on each of the buses.
In reality, the real threat to aid workers are the IDF. In order to facilitate aid distribution in Gaza, I’m sure everyone would agree the best strategy is for the IDF to leave.
I don’t know how much of Hamas is left and/or if it is even capable of functioning as a government at this time. And by “I don’t know” I mean I don’t know, I haven’t looked into the matter in detail. So I am hedging my bets by saying “at the time” because at the time Netanyahu let the money flow to Gaza and Hamas that was the case for certain. Is that the case today? I don’t know, you tell me.
I don’t understand how you can draw that conclusion. What did the Ottomans ever do? The trouble didn’t begin until after the British had kicked them out.
Are you high off your ass? Do you want a list of Ottoman massacres of Jews? Not to mention Christians and other minorities?
The Ottoman Empire was just as imperialist and colonialist as the British (if significantly less successful). I don’t know why you’re giving them a pass. (Or rather, I suspect I do, but I hope I’m wrong because it would be incredibly silly).
At some times, the Ottoman Empire was very friendly to Jews. At some times. It all depended on the whims of the current monarch.
Well for one thing they had a sprawling, centuries-long empire that didn’t give democratic rights to its subjects. And one it collapsed, many societies made up by the subjects descended into internal strife.
For another, they decided to get involved in a war against the British and French and lost.
@Johanna noted that they showed up in 1516. By 1517, there were two major attacks on Jews by Ottoman troops, in Safed and in Hebron.
They probably weren’t as bad as the Crusaders. That’s about the best you can give Ottoman rule overall.
Yeah, there were some better times - one of the things that does make them slightly better.
Are aid workers being targeted and killed by the IDF?
Or is this the consequence of living in a war zone?
I think there is a distinction there to be made.
…I think it’s a genocide Whack-a-Mole.
I’ve provided the opinions of multiple humanitarian agencies and genocide scholars that support my opinion.
The South African case presented to the International Court of Justice, which I’ve cited over and over again in this and other threads, lays out, in detail, the evidence of deliberate targeting of civilian infrastructure, of academics, journalists, government workers, AND aid workers.
The number of aid workers killed in Gaza is the highest in UN history.
We know that Israel have the technology to be able to pinpoint murder Iranian scientists hundreds of miles away. They can sabotage supply chains to blow up the pagers of Hezbollah operatives (along with some children and healthcare workers.)
But you think the most aid workers killed in UN history was somehow just all a big accident? Or that Hamas were hiding under all those ambulances or aid distribution sites?
Because there is no evidence of that at all. Either the IDF are incompetent or they were directly targeted. I’m open to both.
Then make it.
Hamas is known to squat in hospitals.
If you hang out where Hamas is you will be targeted. Don’t hang out with the people they are after.
…paywalled.
And no: there is no evidence that Hamas were using Al Shifa as a command and control bunker.
And hospitals are an entirely separate war crime to the targeting of aid workers, which is what we are discussing.
This is complete and utter bullshit.
We know the names of every single aid worker that has been killed. We know where they were killed and when they were killed.
If they were “hanging out” with Hamas then you would be able to make that case. Not point to a generic NY Times article that isn’t even related to the subject of aid workers.
So lets start with Yusuf al-Zeino and Ahmed al-Madhoun. When they were killed, what Hamas people were they hanging out with?
I’ve got hundreds of other names on the list. Let’s do them one-by-one.
On what planet do you think living in a war zone is “safe” because you are an aid worker?
Put another way, are you telling us Israel is targeting aid workers and trying to kill them? It is a goal for Israel to kill aid workers?
…strawman.
Yes.
It’s a genocide Whack-a-Mole.
From the genocide convention:
From the South African submission:
And more:
Yes: I think it’s deliberate. Because the IDF are capable of pinpoint accuracy. The killing of Refaat Alareer happened in his sisters apartment. He knew he was being targeted because they called him to tell him. He was an academic. In no way a threat. And he was taken out with precision.
So I’ll ask you that question again.
Yusuf al-Zeino and Ahmed al-Madhoun. When they were killed, what Hamas people were they hanging out with?