I don’t know about 99%, but yes, obviously, the more involved we are militarily, the more chaos, less predictable, and more unintended consequences.
My point is that I’m seeing the same kind of justifications for military involvement now that I was then for Iraq. And this time the leadership is much, much worse. So I’m still having trouble comprehending how people who were around at those times are so comfortable with the same bullshit justifications and much worse leadership.
Yeah. Sure. You got results cheap.
I some that will be of great consolation to the maimed, dead, and survivors on both sides of this conflict.
Probably just as well I’ll never be in a position to make these sorts of decisions. I can’t seem to lose sight of the people on the other side of the conflict as fellow human beings.
Nice, very dishonest quote job there.
The very next words after you cut me off are:
I’m not disputing that the nuclear deal successfully kept Iran a few months from a nuclear bomb perpetually. I’m disputing whether that’sactually a desirable outcome.
If BanquetBear ever ran Israel, he’d immediately dismantle it.
We don’t even know that yet. We may not know the cost for years. For all we know this will set off a chain of events that could kill hundreds or thousands or more, in Israel and beyond. And with US involvement, this could include us. We really have no idea.
Since I’m on the record (going many years into the past) of supporting Israel when other countries threaten it, your accusations of dishonesty are very underwhelming. I’m more in the camp that just like the British did not vote for Churchill after the WWII, so does the warmongering and also the dishonesty of Netanyahu should pay a price.
Netanyahu doesn’t belong in office because of his massive failures that led to Oct 7; his success at dismantling Iran’s proxies and now Iran’s armed forces only call into question, why did he wait so long to do this? Why were we so scared to enter Gaza, or take substantial action against Hezbollah, or directly address Iran at all, until Oct 7 forced our hand? A better man than him would have recognized this on Oct 8 and resigned.
And secondly, he doesn’t belong in office because of the crimes he committed in terms of corruption.
None of that changes the fact that the current operations against Iran are astoundingly effective and absolutely the proper course of action.
It occurred to me that in all the talk of Israel committing genocide no one ever mentions that these various groups seeking the destruction of Israel are literally seeking genocide. They are advertising it proudly as a goal. They may not use that word but that is exactly what they want and would do it in a heartbeat if ever given the chance. It should come as no surprise that Israel works very hard to never give them that chance. Neither would you (general “you”) if you were in their shoes.
Then you’ve missed a ton of discussion, since this gets mentioned all the frickin’ time.
I refer you to the “Hierarchy of Oppression” thread.
The we agree more than we disagree, I would still add that of all that you mentioned, the impression I get is that any chance for peace is bound to be ignored. Because if there is peace, the leader will lose power or even go to jail for what he did.
That goes for both leaders that are against Iran…
I completely missed that thread. I’ll read it later. Thanks.
(I assume you mean this thread: Intersectionality and the Oppression Pyramid )
Yeah. Israel doesn’t specifically come up IIRC, but that’s the dynamic at play here
Do we really have to spell it out? I think the divide within the administration pretty much makes it clear what the dynamics in play are.
Iranians are people, just like Israelis are people. We shouldn’t want anyone’s asses kicked; we should want diplomacy, which was apparently working until both Israel and the United States used a fake negotiations process as a setup for a sneak attack, blatantly violating the UN Charter.
If Israel was so worried about the Iranian state wiping Israel off the map, why did they supply them with weapons in their war with Iraq in the 1980s? Why did Israel once support Hamas? We can’t act like these things never happened because they did.
Israel is the biggest thug in the Middle East. It occurred to me that in all the talk about how Gazans shouldn’t have voted for Hamas, it didn’t amount to shit in the West Bank because Israel has greenlighted violent assaults on Palestinians there so that settlers could expand and take over. Israel is committing genocide - full stop.
So we don’t even know if the attack did serious damage to Iran’s capabilities.
How fucking predictable is this? An idiot in charge makes a decision based on domestic politics (and his own ego-based concerns), with poor intelligence, with only idiots and grifters as advisors, and we have no idea if it even accomplished its goal, and in the meantime Iran will be planning a response that could threaten hundreds or thousands of lives, including American lives.
And some of you fucks are cheering this on? What the fuck is wrong with you?
“Sure, Trump is a blithering idiot who cares about nothing but his own wealth and glorification, chooses advisors and staff based on obsequiosness over skill or experience, and will use any rationalization or justification he can grab to further his own power, but he somehow accidentally stumbled into a long term solution for the Iran nuclear weapons problem.”
How can anyone fucking think like this at all? Who is this fucking stupid?
Slow them down or just let them have nukes in a few months. Hmm…what to do…what to do? 
Says who? Who the fuck are you trusting with this “few months” bullshit that’s been going on for decades?
You know what? Fuck you for spreading Netanyahu’s and Trump’s lies. That’s a choice you’re making. Fuck you for it.
We know Iran is working towards a nuclear weapon. They did not build Fordo waaaay underground because it is a peaceful nuclear facility.
Was Iran close to nukes this time? Maybe not. Were they working diligently towards that goal? Definitely. Someday they would succeed.
Do you support a nuclear armed Iran? If so, fuck you too. Iran has for decades worked to destabilize the region with violence. You think they will become nice guys tomorrow?