Maybe, but none of the warmongers here said that this was why they supported the war. If that’s what they think, let them come here and defend the idea.
…just to make it clear my intention isn’t to “argue with you” over this. Keep on doing what you are doing. You are fighting the good fight.
I’m just speaking to the larger point. The warmongers have been consistently denying any atrocities from one side for over three years now. And they will ignore evidence, gaslight, and outright lie to your face.
Three years ago I had very little to say about Isreal/Palestine. It was something I knew very little about. Then Hamas committed the October 7th atrocities. And Isreal rightly responded.
But the way they responded didn’t sit right with me. It didn’t take long for some in the international community to see it the same way. South Africa filed their claim with the International Court of Justice in December of 2023. That was just two months after October the 7th.
On January 24th, just three months after Israel started bombing Gaza, the ICJ ordered provisional measures in order to prevent genocide. These orders were ignored. And ever since then the carnage escalated.
This isn’t something that has been revealed in the last few months. The evidence was clear from the beginning. It’s just that most of us were in denial.
We’ve seen the deliberate targeting of journalists, doctors, nurses, paramedics, police, and academics. The wholesale destruction of entire towns and cities. Children being deliberately shot in the head. Deliberate and purposeful famine. The entire population has been ethnically cleansed from almost half of Gaza and much of them are now living in mud-soaked tents surrounded by garbage, by stench, by death.
This is evil.
We don’t talk about it enough. But what Netanyahu’s regime has done to the Palestinian people is evil. And a lot of it comes down to the very same thing that is common to nearly all atrocities and genocides: a belief that the people they are killing are subhuman.
It took me a long time to accept this. I had to wrestle with my own feelings about this first. When I heard the word “Palestinian”, I automatically associated that with suicide-bombings and shootings and terror attacks. I had to ask myself why I felt this. The same with trans people. Years ago, when the “gender critical” movement started to gain critical mass, they argued they were “just protecting women”. Well, who doesn’t want to protect women, right?
So I dived deeper. And now I’m the fiercest defender of trans people. I learnt all the rhetorical tricks and propaganda that the gender-critical movement used to disguise their hatred.
And what you see here, when the warmongers claim that they “support the war because Iran kills its own people” is just more of the same thing. It’s a process of dehumanisation where “they are using human shields” and “they were nuclear scientists, so they were legitimate targets” or “they gave them warning so they are doing everything they can to avoid killing civilians.”
It’s just cover for the hatred. They think Palestinains are subhuman. And by extension, making this “war” about Hezbollah and the IRGC, they get to dehumanise the people of Lebanon and Iran as well.
It’s why we’ve been able to tolerate this live-streamed genocide in Gaza for so long. Everything else IMHO is just noise.
And the thing is…the last polling I looked at suggested that over 70% of Dem supporters agree that what is happening in Gaza is a genocide, and that same percentage agree that the US should stop funding it. The majority of Dems are on the right side of history. They can see what is happening plain as day.
It’s their leadership that is the problem. Along with Republicans (not all of them, of course, but in general). And the media and almost every major public and private institution. Globally. Worldwide we are seeing efforts to suppress pro-Palestinian voices to the extent that people are being arrested for saying words or holding up signs.
This is ultimately something much bigger than the conflict in the Middle East. We are seeing countries around the world cracking down on free speech, increasing Orwellian surveillance tactics, and using the power of the state to suppress and shut down dissent. And it isn’t going to stop with just the protests on Gaza.
And the crackdown sure isn’t going to do anything effective to fight antisemitism, either.
Thanks. This sums up my feelings as well.
And the rest of your post - nice summary.
Yes, very nice post. The sad part is that Babale seems unable to comprehend that anyone’s opinion of Israel might legitimately have changed due to the events of the last few years, and believes that anyone accusing Israel of genocide is either expressing pre-existing anti-semitic attributes, or is a gullible fool persuaded by Hamas propaganda.
I don’t know much about that, but a posture of “Hooray, we won, everyone should renounce violence now” is not entirely free of strategic motive.
…Isreal killed journalist Amal Khalil today.
https://www.trtworld.com/article/454dc62ff66d
She was being sent death threats on her phone. A reporter from Dropsite news texted the number that was sending her threats asking for comment. This was the response:
“These are not innocent people. These journalists are affiliated with Hezbollah, which Israel eliminated, and were also spies for Hezbollah…Send greetings to all journalists affiliated with Hezbollah, for anyone who works for the organisation should know they are destined for death.”
Just like the hundreds of other journalists they have murdered since 2023, this one was no accident. Reports suggest she was part of a convoy of vehicles when one of them was targeted and destroyed. She and fellow journalist took shelter in a nearby house that was also targeted, wounding photographer Zeinab Faraj and killing Amal Khalil.
Paramedics attempted to rescue them again, according to reports, but they were also targeted by Israeli forces.
This, of course, all happened during the alleged “ceasefire”. Inevitably the people that have been ethnically cleansed from Southern Lebanon and that are being targeted in Southern Lebanon will decide enough is enough and start trying to hit back. And when they do, despite the fact that Israel never respects ceasefires, they just use them to continue targeted assassinations and the demolition of villages and use them as opportunities to rearm and regroup; the people hitting back will get the blame for breaking the ceasefire. Just watch.
This is all an extension of the very same tactics and strategy developed in Gaza, where the limits of the Geneva Conventions and International Humanitarian Law were pushed to see what the international community would do…and they did largely nothing. America’s “biggest ally” has become one of the world’s biggest war criminals, and they do it with impunity.
This is what the warmongers amongst us support. They were positively gleeful when Isreal used terrorist tactics to sabotage the supply chain and used cellphones to kill people, including innocents. They cheered when IDF soldiers disguised themselves as doctors and nurses and carried out extrajudicial killings in a hospital. They are silent as settlers rage across the West Bank. They killed a 14-year-old boy yesterday. Babale started a thread about the “pogrom” in Amsterdam in 2024. But the ongoing pogroms in the West Bank? Nothing.
I’m sorry for continuing to rant here. But what makes this different to all of the other atrocities going on around the world right now is that our governments and our taxes are loudly supporting this. This is on us. This isn’t a “Trump” thing. Biden and most of the Dem leadership were all in on this.
And while I’m glad that most people here seem to have turned around, I still don’t understand why it took so long. As I said above, South Africa bought the case for genocide to the international courts back in 2023. The evidence was overwhelming back then. You can read it for yourself.
One last thing I want the American posters here to consider:
https://www.axios.com/2026/02/22/dnc-2024-autopsy-harris-gaza
The impact of Gaza was largely dismissed by the pundits, the consultants, and the strategists at the last election. But the thing is, their role really isn’t to listen, understand, and tell the truth as they see it. Their role is to shape the narrative. I used to like Biden. But what he was responsible for here is unconscionable. The absolute worst things that happened to Gaza happened on his watch. Every day on my Twitter feed, people from Gaza were sharing livestreams of them being genocided. Decapitated babies. Grieving parents. Multiple times per day for the last two years of Biden’s presidency.
There is no way that didn’t have an impact.
And if the Democratic nominee isn’t someone like Mamdani, who is smart, charismatic, appeals across party lines AND is 100% opposed to the genocide in Gaza, then just like last time I think they risk losing again.
The next Dem primary is going to be a very, very, nasty affair. But I don’t think you can allow the pundits and the consultants and the strategists to set the narrative. In the UK the frontrunners aren’t the traditional foes, the Conservatives vs Labour. It’s between the far-right and the progressive left, Farage (Reform) and Polanski (Greens). The party affiliation here is less important than the policies they represent: Farage represents MAGA in the UK, anti-immigration and tougher laws, while Polanski represents the broader, progressive ideals of trans rights, pro-immigration and anti-genocide.
Both call it like they see it. There is no filter because they both clearly articulate and fight for positions they believe. And in America, Trump is clearly cast from the same mould. His supporters see him as someone who just calls it as he sees it. And the Dems need the same. I think Harris failed because ultimately she didn’t stand for anything. She didn’t give voters anything to vote for. The Democratic establishment doesn’t believe they need to fight for votes; they think they deserve it. And so the fact that 70% of Dem supporters believe it’s a genocide and want to stop funding Isreal’s military doesn’t matter to them.
I’ve ranted enough, sorry. I’ve largely stopped posting on the dope because certain posters have made my time here a misery. I’m actually glad that they have actually stopped posting in this thread. Which is probably why I jumped on iiandyiiii for trying to bait them back, LOL. Sorry about that.
Just wanted to drop in and let you know how much I appreciate your posting. And I say that as someone who has loved ones who live in Israel. They moved there from Ukraine after the Soviet Union collapsed, and I really wish they had a place where they felt both welcome and safe. Israel pretends to be that, but it’s not.
Piece of shit warmonger @Babale is desperate to find some sort of justification for why attacking Iran is righteous and wise despite the obvious incompetence of the leaders in charge, and the utter failure to accomplish anything substantive (in fact, Iran, in directly controlling the Straight of Hormuz now, is probably more powerful and influential than before, as well as having much more world sympathy behind it). This time, by way of a ridiculous argument that North Korea’s nukes have nothing to do with why they haven’t been attacked:
Newsflash to idiot piece of shit warmongers – warmongering, like this attack on Iran, makes countries more likely, not less likely, to try and obtain nukes, as a deterrent to future piece of shit warmongers attacking them. Face it, dumbass – Iran is now more likely to get nukes than before, and it’s because of this pathetic failure of a war. Great job trusting Trump and Hegseth, you giant fucking stupid piece of shit.