Those things represented a lifetime of collecting, not a buying binge.
Okay, but as I asked earlier, how much did they really enrich your life?
Yeah, so do I, and so does nearly every American. The fact that I own more than one pair of shoes is evidence that I didn’t put that money toward unemployment or my retirement. I own stuff I should never have bought, and there’s always going to be someone, somewhere, who lived like a miser in order to build up a massive savings and who then keeled over dead before spending any of it.
I’m glad that you turned the corner, lissener. You seem to have found the perfect job.
Rilchiam has given you some excellent advice. I hope that you take it in the spirit that it was intended and learn from it.
Living within your means and having some savings in case of emergency is not equivalent to being a miser with no possessions.
Let me just tell you, Rilchiam, that your assumptions are wrong. My personal fortunes have undergone some huge fluctuations in the last couple decades. I have only enumerated the few nice things I had left. I stopped buying “unnecessary” stuff quite some time ago. Furthermore I didn’t see the need to preemptively defend myself against your uncharitable assumptions by including a comprehensive catalog of all the many, many such things that I have sold over the past few years. And yes, if you knew me you’d know that every single bit of that music, to address one example, was specifically important to me.
I’m not going to stoop to defend the itemized list you gave, but probably aside from the ceramics collection (which was small and mostly leftovers; I sold most of it when I moved out here), I did in fact use the things I bought. Living in a climate that requires a hat, I’ve bought exactly one hat in seven years. It was a good one and I took care of it. I used the scarf, I wore the ties. Even so, they were all already on the chopping block in my mind. Well, besides the hat; that I would always need.
But anyway, let me know when you’re ready to sell your hindsight goggles, and I’ll come up with the cash somehow.
Wow. Seriously? Howbout first you convince a bunch of strangers on a message board that that the little things you enjoy in life are all practical necessities. OK? You go first. WTF? Do YOU live on bread and water?
Rilchiam has given me some ill-considered advice based on some wildly incorrect assumptions. Neither one of you knows the details of my personal financial history or what kind of savings I’ve had and used.
Even so, what the screaming bloody fuck? Do you actually think I don’t keep myself up nights rethinking what I could’ve done differently? Regretting choices? Making promises to myself of future changes?
How does it enrich YOUR life to have to be the guys who come into this thread with the sole intention of saying, “Just wanted to be sure you wallowed in the bottomless pit of eternal despair of the knowledge that this was all your own fault. Make sure you focus on that, K? It would make my day a lot brighter to know you haven’t escaped without a little self loathing. Glad Rilch and I could keep you down on your face in the mud where you’ve put yourself.”
I never said they were equivalent. But unless you go the miser route, there’s always gonna be someone who says you aren’t being wise with your spending.
Just because someone has some expensive things doesn’t mean they were complete idiots with their money. And just because bad things happened to lissener doesn’t mean he had it coming or was a complete idiot with his money. People’s fortunes rise and fall. Jobs are lost. Bad things happen. He might have made different choices knowing what he does now, or he might have made similar ones.
This is like that woman in the Pit who thinks no one should be allowed to have children unless they can guarantee they will be rich.
Then why didn’t you have backups?
THanks, jsg, that helped. I still own two pair of chopsticks; I guess that puts me on a par with one of those welfare queens of the eighties.
This thread as devolved to, well, where I’d hoped it wouldn’t but knew it would. I think I’m gonna try to stay out of it for a while because it’s come to feel like it’s just adding to the burden I’m trying to get out from underneath.
To the self-righteous: you’re lying to yourselves if you think your only agenda was to help: your agenda was to make sure I didn’t come away unpunished. If you have to justify your sadism by masking it as advice, that’s more to your own harm than mine. You know as well as I do that there’s nothing you’ve said, nothing you CAN say, that hasn’t already kept me awake nights spiralling around my head. Making sure the thread maintains a “blame” focus–because support is harmful–says a great deal more about you than it does about me.
Thanks, others, for the support. It has a practical effect in this kind of situation where I can provide all the self-blame and self-loathing I need all on my own, but must seek positive support elsewhere.
Now I’ll go and make sure I never make any kind of mistake again ever in my life, including paying too much for a pair of shoes, because at some future point in my life, beyond any number of unpredictable occurrences and triumphs and obstacles and tragedies and celebrations and whatever, that extra few dollars I spent on a nicer coat than I really *need *will come back to bite me on the ass on a fucking message board, due to the heroic intervention of *helpful *people.
lissener, this is what I’m basing my comments and questions on.
I’ve had financial difficulties. I’ve been in debt. I’ve learned to carefully consider my purchases, and to weigh future benefit against momentary pleasure. If you understand all that too, then okay. But, one of the ways I got out of my financial difficulties was to supplement my income by working as a maid. I had private clients: the family with four kids, the agoraphobic woman, the disabled man, the recently widowed (widowered?) man. And occasional one-off clients who were moving, had just moved, or had decided to dig out from under a pile of accumulated crap.
I know; I know. You are not them; I don’t know you; just because I cleaned up after other people doesn’t give me any insight into your specific situation. But I did see the same thing over and over: people keeping stuff for the sake of keeping it. The agorophobic woman, for instance, didn’t have an eBay or Amazon.com phobia. I could tell you about all the thing that were delivered to the house that she never used, or in some cases, never opened, but of course, that doesn’t apply to you. And the family with four kids, and all their jigsaw puzzles and building-brick sets, that they seemed to have soley for the purpose of throwing the bits about, not assembling the puzzles or building anything with the bricks. And every week, it seemed there was new junk for me to pick up, and I had to reassemble the rooms all over again. It got to where I knew where the half-eaten apple would be, and I knew the dresser drawers would be empty before I walked in. I know, I know: I never commented on their situation, so I shouldn’t comment on yours. But they paid me and you didn’t. ;
And the guy whose wife had died. Now, that was an interesting case. He hired me because it had been almost a year and he was ready to start dating again…but he felt he couldn’t bring a woman to the house, the state it was in. Now he was eager to take any and all suggestions about what he needed and didn’t need. Got his stuff pared down quite a bit. I know, I know: you didn’t ask for my suggestions. But, uh, you did share your story. So I commented.
I honestly was not trying to put you down. I was honestly trying to help. This is the experience I bring, though: this is what I thought of when I read your story and the update. I’ve seen a lot of people in your situation, and I’m sorry if it doesn’t sound like sympathy. But I really have heard it all before.
I bet money that for every miser out there, there are 10 hoarders and 100 buys too much shit that they dont really need, use or actually even enjoy havings.
Opps, quoted the wrong poster…but the point still stands.
How DARE you offer good, honest, advice to the lissener, instead of holding his virtual hand and assuring him that everything bad that has ever happened to him is someone (anyone) else’s fault instead of possibly his own!!!
(Seriously, IMHO, good advice is wasted on lissener—He is seemingly incapable of honest introspection, and I am sure that in 10 years from now will be dealing with the same kind of self-made drama)
Musta been a two for one sale on the slippery slope argument store today…
Lissener. I am sorry you lost your stuff, whether it was “needed” or not. I am also glad things are turning around as well.
But as an observer I see a few things. You do like to accumulate stuff. You take this accumulation seriously. You may or may not spend too much on this stuff. Dealing with all this stuff (or just life in general) can overwhelm you to the point you can’t take care of it properly. You do not deal well emotionally with the loss of this stuff.
IMO that is a baaaaddd combination. You either need to “fix” a few of these things or tone them all down a good bit.
Sure, you shouldnt beat yourself up over past mistakes. But on the other hand, if nothing changes its just gonna happen again.
Just a random stranger’s opinion.
take care
I just want to say that threads like this are not entirely about the OP. They also serve as a cautionary tale for the rest of us. One of the things that makes us human is that we gather around the campfire, share stories, and learn from each others misfortune.
True. Of course, the way one learns is to listen, lissener. In answer to the OP, dawn is guaranteed to him who seeks the Light. He who revels in darkness already has his reward and those who choose to enable him have theirs as well.
Carry on.
man I know exactly where you are coming from,
but inertia has that other aspect–an object in motion tends to remain in motion
I was helped by getting into motion–any kind–pointless, treadmill motion–really anything at all–it doesn’t have to be cleaning or working–walk–run–push ups-jumping jacks–see how much motion you can get going for its own sake
plus, later a doc’s help with meds
man, I feel for you, and it can get better
good luck
I’ve avoided this thread because I’m right there too and have a couple of friends along the same path. (Of dire financial and emotional difficulties)
One of those friends spent two days Institutionalized this last week, then went back to work only to be fired for “filling out his time sheet incorrectly” (on a management job). Not exactly a forthcoming explanation of why they were firing him.
As I said to him: Sometimes you think you’re hitting bottom, only to find that what you were sure was solid concrete coming at you fast wasn’t really there at all. You just keep falling right past that illusionary floor.
Not entirely the best thing to say, perhaps. But sometimes the only thing you can do is endure. A bit of advice I got from the I Ching the other day was Hexagram 51, six in the sixth place. It basically says that at the peak of shock, we lose all ability to think clearly and act appropriately. This is entirely Human. In these situations, the best thing we can do is to keep still and wait for clarity and calm to return before making decisions. The World may tumble and fall, and those around us may think us mad, but to act in a state of panic is only to make things worse.