How to get through to someone who gives a *** about their health?

Hello dear people of the Dope,

this is going to be a very long post, partly because I need to vent a bit, and partly because I am at a total loss what to do.

My mother is a bit over 60, significantly overweight, was diagnosed with COPD a few years back after several decades of being a heavy smoker, and is doing her best to shorten her already decreased life expectancy even more.

While she did quit smoking actual cigarettes and now is only vaping all day long, this is pretty much the only change for the better that she managed. Everything else she does seems to be like going through a list of unhealthy lifestyle choices and checking off all the points. And she has excuses over excuses as to why she can’t do anything to improve her health.

She barely leaves the house at all, and most of her days are spent playing Facebook games, watching TV and sleeping at random times. She grazes on food all day long but rarely ever cooks actual meals, so her main diet is sweets, snacks and things like cheese and sausage with a disturbing amount of extra salt added on top of everything. And all this is washed down with huge bottles of coke or energy drinks.

She is treating her COPD with cortisone pretty much all the time now, even though I think this was actually supposed to be a spray just for emergencies only originally.

She has severe lymphedema on both legs and has been blatantly ignoring that problem for so long that her legs now have cracked skin and oozing blisters all over. Her only attempt at solving this particular problem was to take twice as many diuretica every day as before, because even just applying cream to moisturize and repair the skin barrier is too much work and she “doesn’t like creams because it’s so messy”.

A few months ago her lung specialist told her he can’t do an X-ray of her lungs anymore because the chair in the X-ray room is only for a maximum of 130kg and she is over that now. Mind you, she didn’t tell me that story because she was shocked and angry, but because she thought it was funny. And then as an afterthought she added, “and by the way, the doctor is overweight too”, as if that would prove some point.

I could go on and on, but basically it comes down to her living a very unhealthy life and always having a reason and an excuse. She can’t go for walks because it’s too hot, too cold, too rainy, too much pollen in the air, she is too sleepy. She can’t drink mineral water instead of coke because it makes her mouth feel dry and it has no flavour. And so forth.

Right now she is in hospital because she fell off some furniture while trying to hang up her curtains. Miraculously she didn’t break anything, but she has a huge gash on her leg that isn’t healing properly, which is why they have been keeping her there all week and may even have to perform surgery on it if more tissue keeps dying off.

So half of my phonecalls at the moment are my mother complaining that there isn’t even sausage or other cold cuts for breakfast at the hospital, and talking about how she is trying to convince the doctors to release her early. The other half of the phonecalls are my brother being very angry at my mother for not taking care of her health at all.

It’s honestly starting to wear me down, even though at this point I’m mostly doing the “open ear” thing and letting them both talk until they’ve said all they need to say.

But how do you get through to someone who is actively avoiding trying to make good and reasonable changes to their life? Being angry at her obviously isn’t useful. I tried the gently encouraging approach for many years, even with some very subtle guilt-tripping, but I think she just ignores that. Directly addressing the issues just makes her react angry and hostile, or she will crack bad jokes about it and laugh it off - anything but actually take it seriously.

So any ideas, insights, … would be very welcome. :frowning:

At the end of the day she is an adult and she’s made her choices, if she is content with her lifestyle there’s really nothing you can do about it. Has she acted in any way that she wants to change, at this point in the game it doesn’t sound like she will or even wants to change.

This can be a form of controlling behavior and emotional blackmail - you are trying to invest yourself and as with any investment it can be hard to recognise further investment into this situation is not going to produce results and might even make things worse - certainly for yourself.

I would try not to discuss health issues with her at all, or keep it to the absolute minimum and concentrate on the other things that matter to you both - at least make whatever time you have free from anxiety and stress.

You mention “flavour” and kg so I am guessing you’re not in the USA. There’s a popular (?) TV program here called “My 600 lb life” where the doctor works with, yes, people weighing 600 lbs plus. If my math is right your mother is only about halfway there. In any case, a couple of usual elements that are brought up: 1) Everybody needs to stop enabling her. Don’t drive to the store to buy unhealthy food for her, for instance. 2) Get her into psychotherapy to talk about what’s driving her behavior. A lot of folks on the program were abused as kids Another program here is “Intervention” where they try to get people off drugs by getting together and using “tough love” to get them treatment. Basically it’s an ultimatum: a lot of times it’s get help because I won’t give you more money or watch you die.

Some video available here (in case you don’t get it in your area). Good luck!

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=my+600+lb+life&page=&utm_source=opensearch
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Intervention+A%26E+weight

All your encouraging and judging hasn’t produced any results as yet, it’s time to change course. Much like an alcoholic slowly killing themselves with booze, you can’t force change on anyone. Stop trying. It’s hard, but accept these are her choices to make.

It won’t change a single thing that’s she’s doing, much like all your encouraging and good advice, but it will really help you. Again, like an alcoholic that won’t quit, no one can know whatever dark thing it is, that is driving this behaviour. Focus on having compassion for whatever that deep and dark pain is, and leave it at that.

She’s leaving you no choice but to just be present. So try your best to accept you don’t understand, and strive to manifest compassion for how much pain she must be trying to escape from.

Good Luck!

It sucks, but get very cuddly with the phrase “not my circus, not my monkeys.” When a person is on a self destructive path and won’t stop charging full speed down it, and you’ve made it clear that you hate what they’re doing but they do it anyway then you have to internalize that you didn’t cause their problem so you also can’t fix it.

That being said, it’s absolutely valid for you to protect yourself from the sadness and exhaustion she’s causing you. It’s okay to meet her complaints with “Yeah that sucks, but you chose this course and need to suck it up and deal–or change your course.” Be brutally honest about the situation, tell her you have no intention of assisting her in her slow suicide and won’t be enabling her behavior. Tell her point blank you don’t want to hear her complaints about problems she’s causing herself but you WILL listen and support any complaints she has about the difficulties of overcoming her problems so long as she’s actually trying to do that.

My best friend in the world is a therapist and she brings me up short on the regular–I’ll be complaining about some situation or another and she’ll just lay it down that she’s been listening to me bitch about this problem for X years without doing anything to fix it and she’s done hearing about it. Which tends to bring me up right short and forces me to find a different way to cope–which often turns out to be telling the person who’s causing the problem that I’m done dealing with their shit. Which cascades and if it doesn’t FIX the problem, it certainly changes the parameters and dynamics and that alone can lead to a better way of dealing with it.

I’m sorry you’re going through this, though, it’s maddening to be around someone with such an awful approach to life.

OP, I have a morbidly obese sister whose weight is literally crippling her. It’s very upsetting to have a loved one like your mother and my sister: we want them to be with us in the years to come, yet they continue the habit that will kill them. Yes, it’s their lives, but the helplessness and frustration we feel can be overwhelming. I’m still sad and upset about my sister, but I’ve learned some things that have made letting go easier.

First, recognize that the odds of a morbidly obese person taking and keeping off the weight with diet and exercise are miniscule. My sister, for example, lost over 100 pounds (45 kg.) and kept it off for several years before regaining all of it. That’s typical. Almost all the contestants on The Biggest Loser regain the weight, too. There’s a good reason for this:

I urge you to read the article. It’s fairly short and very interesting.

That doesn’t mean your mother can’t lose the weight permanently. Bariatric surgery is much more effective than diet and exercise, and most patients keep off most of the weight. However, the patient has to be ready for a huge lifestyle change. The pleasure of eating, now a constant for your mother, would entail mere minutes a day. Your mother would need to find a way to replace that pleasure, hopefully one that doesn’t involve tobacco. And many surgeons require patients lose some weight before the surgery.

So even surgery requires a massive commitment, one that your mother, addicted as she is, may not be willing or psychologically able to make, no matter how badly you and your brother want her to.

Ask to speak to a bariatric specialist. He (or she) won’t be able to comment on your mother’s case but should be a good source of information. A therapist might be helpful, too–for you and your brother, if not for your mother.

I hope this helps.

Look at ‘enabling’.

If she “barely leaves the house at all”, how are all those sweets, salty snacks, huge bottles of coke, etc. getting into the house?

Cut off her ‘supplier’ of all this stuff, and maybe you will see some positive change. Maybe.

How?? Because of this pandemic and having asthma, I haven’t gone grocery shopping since March. Between Amazon and Walmart deliveries I’m pretty well stocked for food regardless. This isn’t 1995 when the only way to get food was to shop for it yourself or have someone you know go and shop for you.

Sandwood, I am so, so sorry. This is your mother, and your very existence is because of her. Your very first relationship was with her. She’s probably been the most important relationship throughout your life. Being faced with her mortality is terrifying!

With that in mind, I have to echo what others have said. You cannot make her do anything.

She probably has justificatons for her behavior. With COPD and morbid obesity, she may figure she’s going to die anyway, so she might as well do whatever she wants. Dieting, exercise, quitting nicotine all are miserable things. I bet she is quite depressed. Removing her only sources of comfort seems cruel to her.

All I can do is suggest you and your brother have a very frank discussion about her final wishes. Find all the critical paperwork, ascertain her monetary situation, and see if she has any preference for distributing her belongings.

After that, you can plan visits with her, and go through all the photos, and try to figure out when they were taken, and who those people are!

Use your phone or some other recording device, and ask her about her childhood. Get as much family tree information that you can. Have her tell all the funny or sad family stories.

If you and your brother can set aside her complete disregard for her health concerns, and just visit to spend time with HER, maybe she can discover her own motivation for taking better care of herself.

But even if she does not, the two of you will have precious memories to hold once she is gone.
~VOW

Thank you all for your thoughts and input.

I live several hundred kilometers away. My brother lives a bit closer to her home, but he is abroad a lot. None of us have ever gone grocery shopping for our mother, because we both are of the opinion that she can jolly well do it herself if the mall is a 15 minute walk away. She does however have a bunch of friends and acquaintances that do her shopping for her or drive her around, and while I am grateful that she has that kind of neighbourhood help available to her, I can’t control these people because I don’t even know them except for their names.

It’s not been that long that we’ve had three deaths in the family. Within barely more than a year and a half, first her partner of 20 years died, then my father, and then my grandmother (her mother). I think that may well have added to the fact that she doesn’t even try and make any effort whatsoever anymore. She’s already brought up her own funeral wishes too, we didn’t even have to ask.

I honestly wouldn’t be surprised if she were depressed, but emotions have never really been her thing, so it’s hard to tell what is going on and if there even is anything going on at all. I think she would very much benefit from psychotherapeutic work, but she is one of those people who think that’s for crazies and mentally defective people only. No way I’d get her to even consider the idea.

It’s what I’ve been thinking too. She’s never had many joys in life, so may as well do what she likes to do.

But at the end of this path is the fact that she’s hurrying along any health problems she already has, and that she will very much regret not taking care of herself once she’ll reach the point where the physical repercussions will be seriously debiliating and crippling. I shudder to think of her life being that way then, because I wouldn’t wish it on anyone no matter if it’s their own fault a thousand times over.

Here’s the thing–time does pass. 22 years ago my mom lost my stepdad to brain cancer. She took it badly, and spent some years basically sitting on the couch, chain smoking, reading bad novels and eating dreadfully bad food. We honestly thought she was just going to smoke herself to death. Then she decided to move, got out of the overly crowded Bay Area and up into the Sierra Nevada foothills, got a dog, started taking better care of herself (she was inching right up to the line of Type 2 diabetes and her weight was…not good) and started taking more of an interest in life without her much beloved husband. Now she’s 83, her weight is in a normal range, her blood sugar is controlled, she’s cut WAY down on her tobacco intake and she gets out and about on her own and interacts with the world around her. Well, not as much right NOW because of quarantine but she just grumps a bit that she can’t go take her dog to the local Starbucks for her customary latte.

My point being that it’s not outside the realm of all possibility that your mum could do the same at some point. I’m sure she’s feeling depressed as all get out, and abandoned, and hopeless but time is a healer and she could turn it around. I sure never thought my mom would do it, but here we are and that old woman is doing really well, especially considering her age. Hell, they had a week long power outage during a snowstorm this winter and she sailed right through that with candles, gas stove, plenty of layers and moxie. She did concede that it would be a good idea to get a cell phone finally after that and she mostly even keeps it charged! Miracles, they sometimes happen. Here’s hoping your mum gets the same kick in the pants my mom did–dunno what happened but she sure turned a corner and she did it on her own.

There is a good chance she is depressed. Perhaps she would be willing to talk to someone or try medication. She might benefit from the company of other people with health concerns and would certainly benefit from any exercise, even walking, which would help with the edema. Ideally, she might get a dog. However, caregiver stress is real and one must accept both limitations and the fact advice isn’t always valued (though, of course, advice is not always relevant, meant well or practical). Perhaps you could borrow a dog and walk it together, see how she reacts?

We’ve mentioned this option to her a few times already, especially since she’s normally very interested in stuff that sounds like it may make health problems go away magically and without any actual hard work involved. Oddly she never seemed to be too interested in it. She has COPD and that’s an anaesthesia risk factor, of course, so I get that it’s a scary thing if the pros outweigh the cons.

Realistically, I wouldn’t expect her to ever lose more than a few kilos by more natural means, because weight loss can be a tough struggle even for completely healthy and young people. But I would love for her to get more physically active and make other beneficial changes to her everyday life for obvious health reasons. Being sessile is only a good lifestyle if you’re a sponge.

For reasons that I won’t go into, I moved out to a different city when I was 18 and then had nearly no contact to any of my family members for many, many years. It’s only the last two years or so that this has changed again, but I’ve been keeping a close eye on my own emotional investment in this because I don’t want to get sucked into something that ultimately may be bad for my mental health.

It’s what I’ve been doing mostly, as well as being available to her only when I choose to be available. But with the current hospital situation, things have been unexpectedly difficult, so I’ve been questioning whether there really is nothing else I could do or try.