How worried about the election are you?

I’ve noticed a lot of people are worried about the election. So, how worried are you?

I’m VERY worried.

I’m very worried also. I’m afraid that Trump will win, or if he doesn’t win, he’ll stir up enough violence to make America a living hell.

Really worried. The world needs a strong, democratic America.

Not really that worried. When Trump won in 2016 I was very worried, but he hasn’t been able to be as destructive as he was hoping to be. So I think his second term would be like his first, shitty and embarrassing but it would only roll back democracy, not end it.

America has been through worse. Anytime America becomes more equal and inclusive it results in white nationalists pushing back against both equality and democracy via calls for dictatorship and domestic terrorism. If anything whats happening now is less bad than a hundred years ago when Jim crow and the KKK were running rampant.

I have to admit on a gut level, I keep thinking Trump is going to win, I feel like this is 2016, the redux.

I’m worried about the night itself. I’m having flashbacks about how it went 4 years ago. It was a dark and stormy night. No, really.

I had been on a chat online where a bunch of people were planning their celebration when Hillary won. They were going to drink and smoke cigars for the win.

I was on the phone with someone as the election results were released. I wasn’t really paying much attention, but the results were playing on my computer screen. Every time I passed it, I kept going. . . what?!!! It went like that for hours until the night was over and the election was called.

I watched Colbert. It was a surreal moment. He didn’t know what to say. I sure didn’t.

Then the worrying began.

I don’t want to re-live any of it.

I’m not worried, just curious. I can’t wait to see the election results, just out of sheer curiosity.

I’m pretty sure Biden will win, but also think the margin of victory will be narrower than most expect.

Texas has me scared half to death. They can simply tell 120,000 of us, fuck you, your vote doesn’t count. That is the death-knell of the greatest democracy the world has ever known.

I hear you, man. Can we just hold hands for a while?

That’s just a declaration that you are ignoring how bad things are. The country has not been through worse when wars have killed fewer Americans. As we’ve never had a president go against the concept of democracy itself, saying he won’t accede power if he loses.

I can’t find anyone who predicted Trump’s presidency would be worse, unless you count the small but real risk of a nuclear war. In all other ways, it’s worse than predicted.

The main thing keeping me from panic is how strong his chances are to lose.

Errr…400,000 Americans died in WWII. That’s more than the pandemic thus far.

Also, the Civil War threatened the very fabric of the nation’s unity itself. As bad as Trump has been, there has never been any real threat of secession or civil war.

Wesley Clark is right; America’s been through much worse.

Things are bad, because our standards are high because things are better than they’ve ever been. Get in a time machine and go back to 1890 and ask a black woman from Mississippi if she’d rather live in Jim Crow south or the US in 2020. Its a no brainer which one has more rights.

I guess my point is as I mentioned, anytime society becomes more equal, more diverse, more inclusive, etc it results in people who want to keep society hierarchical (men over women, whites over non-whites, native born over immigrants, etc) engaging in domestic terrorism and authoritarianism. If anything, the indulgences in authoritarianism and domestic terrorism the right is engaging in right now aren’t as bad as they were in the past. A hundred years ago Jim Crow was the law and the KKK acted with impunity.

Sadly this is part of being human. Best we can do is use the courts and voting to limit the damage these people can do.

But we have a ton of progress to do. Gerrymandering, stacked courts, voter suppression, white militia movements, police that ideologically agree with fascism, etc, and in a hundred years our great great grandchildren will look at current times with the same disgust we look at the KKK and Jim crow.

Well, yeah, except if he gets a second term he’ll literally have nothing left to lose. And then what?

I don’t think Congress will be on his side, judging by the polling at this point. But the Senate is more important and more uncertain.

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America’s been through much worse, so far.

Also, “WWII and the Civil War” were worse than Trump is some faint praise. Trump is far and away the closest we’ve come to a fascist takeover. That may not be the Civil War, but it’ll be worse if it comes to pass, and 40% of the country aches for it to happen.

Also, also, the number of dead is expected to hit 400k early next year. So watch out WWII, Trump’s comin’.

Hmm… what is the scale here?

I have obvious preferences, and I feel pretty strongly about them. But I also have a healthier sense of impending doom that was missing in 2016 after the Obama wins in 2008 and 2012.

I also have the hindsight of the last four years that indicates that the only thing stronger than Trump’s malevolence is his incompetence. So maybe the Republic will survive? We survived Andy Johnson and Richard Nixon.

I think the one scenarios that worries me is a close Biden win that is overturned through the courts, or with legitimate grievances regarding vote counting (see: TX drive-through ballots). I think that could lead to real civil unrest, particularly if the popular vote goes for Biden by >5%, which seems very possible.

I really don’t think that Donald Trump would have the right instincts to lead our country through that type of internals strife. If he orders troops to quell the riots, who blinks first? Do some Generals quit? How violent do things get?

Jim crow was a fascist state for huge swaths of the population in the south.

I guess I’m just hoping that its demographics. There are younger people who support Trump, but its mostly older white people who find fascism appealing on a large scale, and as those people die off and are replaced by their grandkids at the polls the damage they can do will be limited.

the big issue is will the legislature, courts, media, labor unions, the left, state governments, city governments, etc be able to push back against the strong desire for fascism coming from 30 million Americans before many of them die of old age?

If Biden wins and it’s overturned by the courts, we’d be in a constitutional crisis. Forget about Trump ordering troops to quell riots. We could see Biden ordering troops to remove Trump.

I’m very worried, not because of the stats but because the stakes are so high. And they ARE high. If Biden doesn’t win and the Dems don’t gain control of the Senate, we’re in deep shit. We’re running out of time to deal with climate change, and the stakes are even higher than the stakes in WWII, the Civil War, or any other “It’s not so bad relative to that” scenario you choose to comfort yourself with.

I guess the way to complacency is to avoid looking at data. 55% of voters 35-49 support Trump. 57% of voters over 65 disapprove of Trump.

Yes, but WWII took around 43~46 months to reach those numbers – we are well past half that in about 9.

Who do you think will win the election?