I am appalled

About This Message Board
281

I’m sorry, you don’t think that this SIX fuckin’-PAGE thread isn’t “real blowback”? Do you mean to say that it’s not “real blowback” unless you can call someone a shit-head? Or tell them to fuck off? It’s not the mods who hold the members in disdain: we assume that our members are literate enough to be able to express themselves in discussion without resorting to personal insults.

I disagree with several of the posters here. The offense was NOT that Twickster made an insulting joke about a poster. The offense was that it was public.

OF COURSE mods occasionally make statements in the mod-loop about individual posters. We discuss the (mis)behaviors of members. Our discussions can include irony, humor, satire and even (gasp!) Pit-like obscenity. Some mods (rightly or wrongly) get frustrated with certain members, and express that frustration in unkind terms. We need to be able to have frank and open discussions (and to have some humor as outlet) to reach consensus on issues about individual members.

If you want an un-moderated board, there are plenty of them around, and feel free to go there.

Anyhow, I repeat: the apology has been made and accepted. That should end the matter. This horse is very, very, very dead.

282

I’ve only been at SDMB a little while, but it’s evident (to your point) that posters have been able to use ATMB to say pretty much what they want about mods.

But wait, upthread someone analogized {offending message board posters} to {spouse beating}. Surely there’s still some life in this thread!?

283

Love it or leave it. Nope, never heard that one before.

By the bye, there are also plenty of moderated boards that allow Pitting mods for their actions. In fact, wasn’t the SDMB one of them till the “bubble” fell?

Grey: a shade between black & white.

If that’s how you feel, you certainly need no authorization from me to go ahead and close it.

Cheers.

284

So the mods need to be open and frank and even use pit language, when frustrated with the posters. But the same courtesy is not extended to the posters, frustrated with the mods? Is that about right?

And she didn’t do anything wrong other than get caught?

If they behave in an unprofessional manner, we are reminded that they volunteer for a thankless job, like it’s all just for shits and giggles. At the same time we are told to tolerate noisy ads, malware etc, because it’s a ‘business’ model and needs to generate a profit. It seems like TPTB want it both ways to me.

By the way, ‘real blowback’ amounts to more than abiding a 6 page thread that’s just a venting jerk circle.

285

This statement speaks volumes—much more than what twickster said.

I agree with you, the offense was that the statement was public—if your primary objective is to cover your asses at all times, and keep the community completely in the dark about what goes on behind the scenes.

If your objective were to run a good message board, and ensure that moderation is performed consistently and fairly, the fact that one of your moderators has a condescending and snotty attitude toward a member who doesn’t deserve it, and toward one of her job functions, should be considerably more concerning than the fact that she let it slip or that it was “leaked,” as it were.

I’m not particularly one to join in mod pile-ons, and I’ve defended the mods against what I felt were niggling complaints and exaggeration in the past, but I don’t think you understand just how shitty you come across when you say things like that.

286

In other words, that she got caught.
mmm

287

Then why did she apologize for it? You can’t apologize for something that you did that was on purpose, in character, and that you intend to repeat in the future. It just doesn’t work like that.

eta: Of course, you can apologize for accidentally cc’ing someone - that makes perfect sense, and was called for, and I absolutely believe Twix when she says that she regrets that that occurred. But your statement shows that the apology for the statement itself was insincere.

288

I just genuinely don’t understand why twickster apparently felt so frustrated and irritated in the first place. Aren’t we supposed to report posts when we see something out of place or whatever? I’m not going to go find all the posts where mods have said “if you see a problem, report the post” but there have got to be dozens, if not hundreds.

I guarantee, by the way, that there are going to be some people who read this thread and then don’t report posts that they otherwise would have, because they don’t want to be annoying to the mods, and even though the mods tell us until they are blue in the face “no really, it’s fine, we want you to report posts!” it won’t matter, because they’ve seen from this thread when the mods talk to each other privately, they bitch and complain about all the post reports they have to read.

Anyway, my comment way back on the first page or two of this thread that maybe twickster just isn’t cut out to be a mod was based primarily on the fact that if she’s this upset and frustrated and annoyed by a really simple mod duty that shouldn’t be a big deal (seeing thread reports), well, maybe she’s not cut out for the gig. Her repeated apologies for inappropriate behavior based on having a headache or a bad day or whatever are just icing on the cake. And I say this, by the way, as someone who knows damn well that I’m not cut out to be a mod. I’d go postal on you guys so fast your heads would spin. :stuck_out_tongue:

289

I’m struggling to summon up some sympathy for anyone who doesn’t report a post because he is afraid the mods are going to say mean things about him behind his back. I think this board will survive OK.

290

methinks this thread about being appalled is veering quickly towards recreational outrage

So I had to reread the OP -

Was that supposed to be some awful insult? Is it really so appalling and meanspirited? Really? :confused: :dubious:

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Some people are very, very good at being able to tell which posts are problematic and which are not. Other people mean well, but are very, very bad at determining which posts are violations, and which threads are in the wrong forum. And some people report posts merely because they don’t agree with the post, or the poster.

The people who are good at spotting problem posts, or threads in the wrong forum, are very valuable. However, if one checks one’s email and finds a hundred false positives, mostly from one person, it’s a bit frustrating to check every single report and find that none of the posts are problematic. It’s like a car alarm going off because it’s too sensitive. Should you just ignore that alarm? What if it really IS someone messing with the car this time, instead of a leaf falling on the hood again? Haven’t you ever had this problem?

The reports really are alarms. And while we encourage posters to report, we would appreciate it if posters took just a moment to consider whether their past reports have been valid ones. Remember the little boy who cried wolf.

Early on, I quickly learned who consistently reported things that were not problems…and I simply didn’t bother to check out reports from those people. I figured that if the post really was a problem, then someone else would report it as well. However, my moderation style is quite different from most others’. Most people genuinely do want to help, and we do appreciate it. Sometimes, though, it’s really not helpful to report problems that don’t exist.

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Your analogy was clear - just wrong. You are correct in asserting that it’s possible to get angry at people who are annoying asses yet still treat them with professionalism. The problem in this instance is that (a) frequently twix does let her feelings cloud her modding occasionally and (b) picunurse is NOT that annoying ass of your “analogy”.

(Emphasis mine)
And therein lies the problem.

From Vinyl Turnip’s post:

“If your objective were to run a good message board, and ensure that moderation is performed consistently and fairly, the fact that one of your moderators has a condescending and snotty attitude toward a member who doesn’t deserve it, and toward one of her job functions, should be considerably more concerning than the fact that she let it slip or that it was “leaked,” as it were.”

293

So **picunurse **does report posts needlessly, and you (the mods) wish she didn’t, and would like her to stop?

Perhaps if you published a list of others in that category, then those of us who are time-wasters would know to stop irritating you.

294

I dropped out of this thread a while back because, as i said on the first page, i don’t think that what the mods say about us in the mod loop is a huge deal. It was just one of those things that this private communication accidentally made its way beyond the private sphere.

But Lynn, your paragraph here sounds to me awfully like a description of how many Dopers feel about the constant stream of mediocre decisions and crappy interventions by some moderators. This particular incident is just the latest example of the alarm going off without cause. Each one is not, by itself, a huge deal, but over time that constantly blaring car alarm becomes pretty fucking annoying and probably should be disconnected.

295

I’m not being snarky here. I ask sincerely, are you characterizing ** picunurse** as that kind of poster? I ask because all of the “reported” posts I’ve seen of hers seem legit. Of course there could be the hundreds I don’t see that she reports without adding a public post.

296

Not really – the words weren’t particularly harsh – but denigrating all the same. Picunurse was trying to be helpful and she was ridiculed.

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Why do you think it’s not?

Let me make sure that I understand you clearly. Are you suggesting that - with the apparent exceptions of twix and myself - no one was ever made a disparaging comment about someone else, only to realize that that person overheard? Have you never seen a bad sitcom? “He’s…standing behind me, isn’t he?”

I actually have a pretty good outlook on humanity. I believe that most people are fundamentally good. Allow me to refer back to my job. I love my job. Can’t think of another job I’d love nearly as much. That said, do I sometimes bitch because, when I’m at work, I have to do my job more frequently one day versus another.

I’m not sure what you do for a living. Assuming you have a job. You could be a stay-at-home parent or something (and I’m not trying to sound snarky or sarcastic. I’m trying to be genuine, and no offense is intended). Either way, I feel quite confident in saying that there are days when you, me, and just about everyone else have been at work, and have been hoping for a light day. Maybe I’ll only have 2-3 runs one day, and 9-10 the next. As much as I love my job, I’m bitching about that second day, and I’m especially bitchy if that second day involves having to go see some of the people who call 911 for essentially nothing at all on a regular basis (I have a regular patient who calls 911 for absurd reasons. He once called 911 because (and I quote), “my heart is beating.”).

Most days, I wouldn’t really object to having to go see this man. He’s nice enough, and has been kind of lost since his wife died. But if I’m on a shift that is one where there’s no chance to even catch my breath between calls, I may get a little bitchy if I have to go see him.

Isn’t it possible that twix was hoping for an easy day, logged in, saw there were several things that needed attention, and was thinking something like “crap. Here we go already. At least let me get some coffee first?”

My point (and I do have one in here somewhere) is that I’m pretty sure that we’ve all had days where we’ve said something about someone, only too have it get back to them. It could have been that twix was just frustrated, and it boiled over. It may be the case that she said (twix is female, right? I don’t remember) something about a poster that she really didn’t mean, as it was just said out of frustration. And it was compounded by the fact that picunurse happened to be standing behind twix when it was said (like in those shitty sitcoms I mentioned up-post).

It’s just my opinion, but I really think people are making way too big a deal out of this.

298

Well, PlainJain, that may be, or it might not be. I’m not really familiar with picunurse’s posting history, nor of twix’s moderation. As such, I make no judgement about any other instances. I’m referring specifically to the instance that prompted this thread.

And for the record, everyone (not just you here, Jain), I’ve always heard it as “even a blind squirrel finds a nut every once in a while.”

299

Now look what you people have done - you made Vinyl Turnip post seriously. :mad:

300

I am semi-retired, so I don’t get email reports any more, unless someone forwards a report in the mod loop.

I have absolutely no idea whether picunurse reports needlessly or not. Back when I was receiving reports, either she wasn’t even a poster, or she didn’t report on threads in my forum. I don’t remember EVER receiving a report from her. It’s quite possible that she did report things, but that I didn’t find her reports memorable one way or the other. I did receive reports from several people who either didn’t understand what the guidelines were, or who were revenge reporting, that is, they were reporting because they had a grudge. But please don’t put words in my mouth or imply that I said something which I very carefully did not say.

And would you seriously LIKE it if a mod, any mod, POSTED a list of people who were habitual bad reporters? Publicly? Making a bad report isn’t really worth a moderation note, and I can’t think that any good would come of it. I don’t think that I ever even told anyone that their reports were based on a misunderstanding of what was and what was not acceptable in a post. I mean, I remember one woman who used to complain that certain posts were “not child friendly” or “not child safe”. When she finally bitched to me that she didn’t feel comfortable having the SDMB open in the children’s section of the public library, I DID tell her that the SDMB was a site meant for adults, and that we had no intention of making it child safe. And that the Pit was particularly not child safe. She wasn’t happy with this, but hey, she’s a children’s librarian, and surely she has come across the concept of “not appropriate for all ages” before. My point is, she was a constant reporter whose reports were, I thought, false alarms, so I mostly ignored her reports. I DID respond to her when she asked why we constantly let NSFW links and pics on the SDMB.

If you are wondering whether or not you’re a “time waster”, then ask yourself what happens when you report? Is there action taken, ever? If no action is ever taken, then you probably are not being helpful, even though you probably intend to be. If action is even occasionally taken, then you’re probably not a time waster.