I am really supposed to LIKE being married?

In My Humble Opinion
21

Marriage isn’t a thing that is a certain way. Marriage is the way two people live together. You can’t not like your marriage because it’s not a real thing, it’s just the way you choose to live. So change what you don’t like.

Get a hobby. Stop living in each other’s pockets. Marriage means spending your lives together, but it doesn’t mean spending every minute of every day together. You are allowed to go off and do things on your own, and if your wife has a problem with that, then you need to have a serious talk with her. Sometimes the best way to stay together is to spend some time apart.

I find that statement vaguely unsettling. You don’t say that you can’t imagine life without her, just that life would be the same with someone else. You say you love your wife, and you describe all the reasons why you should be happy with her, but I’m seeing “wealthy family, beautiful, great cook”, and not “sweet, funny, lights up a room, soulmate”. You’ve given us the description that I consider describes why you’ve chosen to date someone, not why you’ve decided to spend your life with them.

22

I agree with cazzle about that statement. I think you’re married to the wrong person. Or maybe you shouldn’t be married at all.

You remind me of a friend of mine. He would describe his wife the same way, and their relationship was similar. No kids, thank goodness. They divorced a few years ago, and now he is very happily living with a very nice woman who shares his interests.

Go find yourself a woman who doesn’t care so much about “decor.”

I have been very happily married for 3 years. I’m sure you know that “the life of ecstacy portrayed in romance novels” isn’t going to happen every day. But, damn if we don’t sit around and smooch just 'cause we like each other. We just like being together.

23

Yeah, sounds like you shouldn’t be married. Waitaminute, maybe I’m saying that too soon. You are supposed to like it. If you don’t, then there’s something wrong. You say you love your wife. If you really love her, then you would want to work this out, work SOMETHING out to remain married to her and make it a satisfying relationship for you both.

Don’t get me wrong, I’m not saying you’re a bad person, and I’m not judging you. I think when people see a problem in their lives, especially in a marriage, they need to do something fast so you can BOTH get on with what you want in life, whether it’s working it out and remaining in a lovefilled marriage, deciding to divorce and become single people again, or deciding to divorce so you can both pursue other interests and/or other people you are better suited to and who will love you unconditionally no matter what. If you are unhappy in your marriage and no longer love your wife, why should you suffer by remaining with a person you no longer love, and why should she suffer by remaining with a person who no longer loves her?

I don’t know how “trial separations” fit into my little above scheme of things. Seems like separations are putting off the inevitable. But I’ve thankfully not been in that situation, so what the hell do I know?

I hope you decide you truly love your wife (not just her beauty, her money, her glamour, etc, but HER), and can work things out to be happy. Do something about it now so neither of you waste more time in your lives.

Lorie

24

Gotta admit, as a sometime road warrior, this is nirvana.

Heck, the only time I watch The Sopranos is on road trips.

25

It’s a sad fact of life that you can’t have it all: there are pleasures that are simply mutually exclusive. Some of this comes into play when you are making the single/couplehood choice. The fact is, when you are commited to someone, you do give up some autonomy–and no amount of arranging personal time or being understanding is ever going to totally eliminate the fact that you now have to take someone else’s needs/desires into account (of course, there are infinitly many diffrent levels and ways of doing so). However, this is the exact same downside to having parents, or friends, or children.

So nothing can be done about the fact that some compromises are going to have to be made somewhere. However, considerable flexibility exisits regarding which areas have to be compromised (I know people that don’t go to the in-laws for Christmas, I know people that keep thier money totally and completely seperate, I know people who will call thier spouse and say “please be late tonight!”) However, the only way to negotiate changing some of the things you are complaining about is to go talk to your wife, not us. And I would suggest horse-barganing here: “I will let you take over decorating hte whole house, I will never say a word about anything, if you will give me the Den to be totally mine, you don’t even go in there with out asking, and if I am in there in the evenings assume I want to be alone.”

If your objection to marrige is more theorectical that specific, if it isn’t any actual thing that happens that bothers you, but the idea of being responsible for anothre person’s needs/wants-and it really really bohters you, like you think about it three or four times a week, not just once a year), then get divorced. And never, ever, EVER, have children. Because that is the nature of all relationships.

26

Oh, I take all this for granted. It’s a truly abominable institution (IMHO, of course), unnecessary, unerotic, and inappropriate for the care and feeding of a good love relationship.

I don’t do possessiveness, fidelity, monogamy, perpetuity, or exclusivity promises, nor do I accept them from other people. Being in love is inherently risky, emotionally, and to whatever extent you protect your feelings from the possibility of being hurt by imposing such promises, you kill what it is you were trying to preserve because then you are no longer two free people courting each other.

I don’t see any reason child-raising co-partnerships should necessarily have a damn thing to do with who you are currently bonded with as love-mates (or just plain screwing for the short-term sake of pleasant frictions for that matter). It’s a different set of ideal parameters you look for in an ideal partner. Why try to find them in the same person?

27

I would just add that these feelings of not wanting to be married aren’t going to get better if ignored. You love your wife. You’d better talk to her about all of this before you get to the point that you can’t talk about it. Trust me, she is likely to be feeling the same way. The hardest thing is to find yourself a few more years down the road, loving each other tremendously, but having a hard time being in the same room together. It’s a lot harder to come back from that than to build from where you are now. I’m not particularly into revealing a tremendous amount about my personal life, but let’s just say, I’ve felt the way you do and didn’t do the work I should have then. I’m paying dearly for it now. Marriage is not easy, but it has the potential to be one of the most wonderful things you’ll ever do. Sorry for getting so heavy, but this is a pretty charged issue for me right now, and I wish someone could have convinced me years ago to do the self-exploration and marriage exploration that I ought to have do. Best of luck.

28

AHunter3, two things:

One, I hope you understand that even if you do not like the idea of monogamy, that dosen’t mean that everyone who does choose it is some sort of mindless drone buying into a millenia-old farce. Different strokes for different folks, and all that.

Two, I think one good reason people look to combine their co-parent and their romantic partner is that there is a finite number of relationships any given person can handle at any one time. Relationships take time: you have to meet a person somewhere, you have to spend time establishing that you have grounds for a relationship, once that relationship is established you have to spend time deciding on the exact definition, and even once you’ve done that you have to constintly revisit the concept of “relationship” and renegotiate things. Furhtermore, you have to contribute large amounts of time towards what ever purpose that relationship was founded to accomplish (raising the children, entertaining each other with conversation, getting each other off, writing a proposal for a grant . . .) Me, I find I can handle three, maybe four close relationships at any given time–and I am talking about close friendships, working relationships, and romantic relationships all mixed together. I have neither the time or the emotional energy for more. I have to have one of those slots open up before I can even have the time/emotional energy to dedicate to the first step, of finding and screening potential relationship-partners. Now, I suspect that I, myself, require a higher-than-average amnount of time by myself (reading and Doping time), and that the average “maximum number of concurrant relationships” that other people have may be higher, but I think it is still finite, and that many of those slots are taken up by parents children, long term friends, etc. With that dilemna, it makes sense to try and double or triple up roles, and have your sex-partner and your co-parent and your close long term friend all be the same person. But if you have a knack for juggling many, many close relationships, there is no reason it has to be done this way. The joy of modern communication is that now you have a chance of finding other people with the same knack, and the same desire. Back on the farm you would have been screwed.

(On a final note, there is also the inescapeable fact that the decision to be “co-parents” is often not a decision at all, but the result of failed or inexpertly applied technology. In which case, you are co-parented with someone who you selected not for their strenghs as a co-parent, but for a different reason (any of several different reasons).

29

Yeah, those who are single wish they were married…I wish sometimes I had a roommate but those I know with roommates wished they didn’t have one…lonliness is the price of independence.

Shagnasty, your situation reminds me of an old quote " I don’t believe in marriage as an institution because I don’t believe in marrying an institution" I forgot who said it, perhaps Ms. West?

30

Shagnasty, just a quick note that I haven’t seen mentioned yet.

Are you suffering from depression? Your description of life in general seems that way to me…I don’t see any high points or mention of what things seem good or joyful. Of course, you may well have those moments, but if life seems flat and mundane ALL the time, you might look at options for dealing with your depression. That may help you deal with your marital issues as well.

That being said, I cannot say enough about the worth of a good, competent marriage counselor. It would be great for you to get a chance to talk this over with someone (besides us, the sympathetic yet brillian TM). Marriage counseling truly saved my marriage, and it can help make a tolerable (or barely-tolerable) relationship a very happy one. It sure sounds like you and your wife need to work on communication, establishing boundaries, becoming independent within your marriage–all issues that a good counselor could help immeasurably with. Please consider it, it certainly can’t hurt.

Best wishes, you deserve to have a happy life.

~karol

31

Bodypoet has a point: your outlook is actually a warning sign of depression.

I would caution my other Dopers to not put too much stock in some of your choices of words and lack of enthusiasm about your mate. I think it’s normal, when a relationship is in the doldrums, to focus in on the blah and not say the right, socially-acceptable, and genuinely true things you feel about your mate. It might very well be that once you solve some of the problems of not having time for yourself (and maybe seeing about this depression thing) you’ll be back in the swing of things.

32

Yes, I understand that Shagnasty may not feel comfortable gushing about all the reasons he loves Mrs Shagnasty on these boards - we all have different comfort levels when it comes to revealing our private lives to strangers on a message board.

I think Shagnasty has allowed this situation to develop our of fear - it’s easier to be mildly unhappy about the way things are going than to speak out and risk losing everything. Still, he needs to speak to Mrs Shagnasty, and he needs to start having fun with her again. There must have been a time when they enjoyed being together. Now, before they have children, they need to spend some time together and like it! Not just sitting on the same couch watching tv and talking about taking the garbage out, but doing something fun (and maybe a little bit silly) so they laugh together. Shagnasty, when was the last time the two of you had a really good laugh?

33

Hey, Bricker, you and I must be kindred souls. I’ve been married 19 years, and you’ve only been married one year, but we share an identical philosophy regarding marriage.

Tell me this, my friend, have you and your wife separately decided and tacitly agreed that divorce isn’t even an option? Because that’s what Mrs. Dave-Guy and I did, without discussion or fanfare. We didn’t even realize it until it came up in a conversation unrelated to our marriage.

Shagnasty marriage is something you have to approach with a certain attitude. If you think it’s going to suck, it’s going to suck. At the same time, if you expect it to be a fairy tale story, you’re going to be disappointed.

If you realize that it’s something you grow into and continually adjust to, then that’s what you do, and that’s what it is.

But I agree with Bricker. I wear the ball and chain, it’s true. But I placed it there myself, and I voluntarily threw away the key.

34

Yeah, yeah, so I’m just repeating points already made earlier but they’re so good they deserve repeating. One, sit down and talk to your wife about this. You loved each other enough to marry so you both have a vested interest in taking an honest shot at making it work. You may have just hit the doldrums, she may have no idea you even feel this way, she may be feeling blah too, compromises may be possible…but you won’t KNOW until you try.

Second, do NOT have children while feeling this way. Adults can make compromises on degrees of togetherness, responsiblity, etc. Children can’t. They need–not want, NEED–a huge, constant investment of time, attention and love. They’ll repay it many times over if given a fair shot but it’s truly a labor of love, and not one to be undertaken without recognizing the depth and breadth of commitment needed.

Good luck–to both of you. And don’t beat yourself for feeling the way you do. You DO, so there it is. You just need to decide how to handle it.

Veb

35

Don’t like being married, huh? I don’t like others being married, so I guess it works out :slight_smile:

I think friendship is to marriage as compromise is to change. Married people change. Marriage isn’t about compromise, even though so many often say it is. I have lived with five different people over time, not including my stint in the Navy, and never, eveer felt pressured to change myself. When I have a girlfriend for a week and it seems like, were I to seriously consider staying with her, that I would actually have to change who I am. (understand, of course, that I won’t date girls without knowing them for some time first, so it isn’t like I just plop into a relationship and start thinking long-term)

Perhaps that just mean I haven’t found that proverbial “right one” yet. Hell, I don’t really care. My experience from observation has not demonstrated that marriage is anything to get excited about, testament here notwithstanding. I’ve heard all sorts of fabulous stuff about marriage; I just have yet to see it.

36

I’ve been married for six and a half years to the lovely lady I first laid eyes on seven years ago tonight. I cherish every moment I get to spend with her, and, when I was recently offered the chance to telecommute on a permanent basis (I’d been doing it temporarily since the WTC went down, but my office building has been cleared for re-occupation), I jumped at it. Why, don’t I need some time to myself? From the very beginning, I went into marriage with the thought that this would be a union of souls that can help one another grow, an entity which is greater than the sum of its parts. Not some “societal institution” that I go along with for no benefit to myself. I’ll admit that the religious perspective of marriage that I was brought up with enters into this a lot. However, when all is said and done, the issue remains: is marriage something you did because you saw a concrete benefit in being married to her, or is it something you “just did”? The answer for me, from what I wrote above, is obvious. After all this time, we understand one another better and better every day, and while I still can’t understand just what keeps her with me I can state clearly that the more I see of her, the better I appreciate her. Being with her makes me happy, and the two of us work toward a mutual goal of furthering one another’s happiness, and handing that feeling over to the next generation (4 so far). And I find that making decisions together, even minor ones like the decor of a room, end up getting us something we both are happy with, not something neither of us want, as in your experience. Understanding is the key.

That said, Shagnasty, the first thing you should do is go out and buy a little book called Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus. You may have heard of it, it was a best-seller for years. And it addresses exactly what you’re going through.

Read it, underline or highlight passages you deem relevant, and have your wife read it, do the same and hand it back to you for re-reading. It’s normal for men to want some time alone; it’s normal for men to want trust and autonomy. It’s also normal for women to want to see their input desired and respected, and for women to want to spend all time together. It will help you two come to a better understanding of the differences between your viewpoints of life that are completely natural, and to reach a compromise between those needs of yours which are mutually contradictory without one or the other of you feeling slighted.

Oh, and one more thing: them romance novels ain’t a “picture of ecstasy” that they seem to be. The duration of your average romance story is what, a few months tops? You’ve already got a ten-year relationship going. No doubt you’ve had several-month periods like the books. But that’s unsustainable. What you want is long-term happiness. Don’t look for it in the Romance section, look for it in the humor section. Laughing at little differences and little idiosyncracies is a big part of letting them lift you up rather than drag you down.

37

DUDE, DUDE, DUDE! I know exactly what you talking about!
I’ll give you some good advice that my old man gave me. Take up some hobbies that don’t include her. A preferably a hobby that will include other men like bowling, golfing, fishing, hunting… You get the idea. My wife laughs at me becuase every year some of my friends go deer hunting we’ve done this for about seven years now, and in that seven years we’ve caught like two deer! What my wife does’t understand is that we mainly go their to vent and talk shit about our wives or girlfriends. Then when its all over we go home and bow down to our SO’s.

Trust me hunting and fishing wouldn’t be nearly as popular if it were not for marriage.:smiley:

38

The list of your wife’s desirable traits contain things that could be said of many women. There wasn’t anything unique; nothing on that list that you see in just her that made you fall for her. Sometimes it’s the cleft in her chin and how she loves pugs, but whatever it is, only she has that certain magic, and it’s not in being conventionally beautiful or having money. I would say that you are not in love with her. So, don’t assume it would be the same with someone else. However, I don’t recommend divorce and then running around looking for that elusive someone. If you decide to divorce, live your own life more fully. Live your dreams and chances are in doing that you might find that unique, special person. Nothing wrong or irreversible in marrying for the wrong reasons, but don’t hurt her and yourself by continuing in a relationship that isn’t fulfilling for both of you. I find that when someone is too much into things like decor, they are trying to fill up the holes in their life with things. Maybe the two of you need to get brutally honest before you have children. If you think you have pain now, try having to see the children you love more than life itself every other weekend, and having to watch them with their “other” daddy. When it comes right down to it, maybe she feels as trapped as you do. I’m divorced, for years. And I found out that I’m better off and happier by myself. I just like it better. People are different and don’t always belong in pairs.

39

'nuff said. :smiley:

40

Did you get married because you wanted to or because you felt that was what you were supposed to do? Yes, it does feel crushing at times to both parties involved. That feeling is a sign that you need to make some changes - but not necessarily divorce.

You don’t have to do the “family thing” every holiday. After all, you two just by yourselves are a family. My husband and I always spend Christmas to New Year’s by ourselves, as a couple.

Then don’t be constantly together. Once or twice a year send her off on a trip by herself. Then six months later you go take a trip solo. You’ll both have some “me time” at home and away. Back when I did business trips it was good for both the husband and me - we got out of each other’s way for awhile. He occasionally goes off to visit his relatives by himself for a week, allowing me to recapture the strange food choices of my bachelor days without an “EEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEW! Gross!” comment.

Now, is she insisting she be involved in all such decisions, or do you feel some other, external compulsion that this is the way it “should” be done? If the former - stake out a room as completely yours and yours alone. If the latter - maybe she’s just as annoyed by this as you are.

Romance novels are fiction. NO ONE lives like that.

Anyhow - it’s possible you just aren’t suited to marriage. I think it’s worth trying to make a few changes. You’ve only been married 3 years. As someone who’s been hitched for 11 I can say that the relationship does change over time. There were rough times for us when we did consider divorce. There were times when things were getting far too dull and routine. Other times when we are wonderously happy. It isn’t going to wonderful all the time.

If you’re falling into a rut and things are getting too mundane do something about it! I’m not going to regurgitate the phrase “work on the relationship” because a marriage isn’t an art project. It’s a partnership. Sometimes you have to sit down and renegotiate. “Negotiate” does not mean “constantly yield”, either - there are some things you do not compromise on (I won’t mention the Toothbrush Incident in my marriage, but I’m sure you can imagine). If someone has a need that isn’t being fulfilled then they need to speak up for themselves.

Get a hobby for just yourself. Or go out “with the boys” once or twice a week. You two should have social relationships outside of each other. Men need to spend time with men. Women need to spend time with women. Ask for a “I’m going to sit in front of the TV and veg night” once in awhile.