I pit...life! (whiny)

The BBQ Pit
1

I am unhappy with my current living arrangements.

I keep telling myself, “I’m going to move out, I’m going to move out!” but it never happens. My mom always talks me out of it, saying its better to stay where I am and concentrate on school than to do something rash and regret it later. And all along, I have caved and stayed where I was. Don’t get me wrong, I am very thankful she allows me to live with her in order to focus on finishing school, so that I can start out with a clean slate- an education and zero debts. That I am not ungrateful for. But just the same, I am unhappy about it. I have had talks with her about the issue, but I can never really get her to understand how I feel about the situation. She always takes it personally, like I am accusing her of being a bad mother. She can’t fathom why I would want to move far away from her. Sometimes I feel ashamed that I still live with my mom at 24, even though I am going to school and more or less support myself in every way aside from lodgings. Its an irrational emotion, and I feel frustrated and very conflicted. My mom, like many moms, can use guilt as a weapon. Its the guilt I feel about making her feel bad, after all the terrible things my father did to her, that turn my frustration toward her into self-loathing. Ultimately, it all comes down to me not being able to take the initiative. Me not doing anything about being more independent, even though I’m dying to move out. Me being too scared to take big risks, because I was raised to associate risk with fear, and that I should always always always take the safest choice else regret the decision later :mad:

Having my brother visit for the weekend has brought these feelings to a head. The fact that I am almost done wtih school right now is also no coincedence, because I am very close to being in a position where I can do what I’ve always dreamed- live my life independent of anyone else’s influences or guilt. My brother and I actually get along with each other much better now that he has gotten older (17). My brother is much more impulsive than I am; in fact we are like polar opposites. While he has made a lot of stupid mistakes- more than I had at his age, he’s also more confident in his decisions. He doesn’t get the same kind of guilt or self-doubt I had when my parents were opposed to something. I always tried to comprimise, to not make waves. He blazes his own trail and gains confidence along the way. Despite his errors, I really admire and envy my younger brother for being the kind of person I could not. But at the same time, I feel very frustrated with myself, the feeling that I haven’t accomplished enough…perhaps I am working 3 part-time jobs and going to school full-time is not that I need to on some practical level, but because it satisfies that insecurity I have about not accomplishing enough at my age. I work with kids who look up to me as a role model, coworkers who respect my wisdom and experience, and classmates impressed with my understanding of the material. And yet it never feels like enough; no matter how much I have going for me I still feel that because I still let my parents have such a strong influence on me, I’m trapped within some kind of shell.

And so I wrestle with conflicting emotions- why bother being so hell-bent on hurling myself into the unknown when I’ll be done with school soon enough? Why feel so convinced my mom is a guilt-tripping control freak when I say scarcely 10 words to her each day on average and maybe fight once a month? And what if I do everything I wanted- live far away, influenced by no one, and still feel unhappy? What would the point of everything up until then be?

:frowning:

2

There is a difference between taking a risk and taking a “reasonable” or “intelligent” risk.

If you crunch some numbers and decide you cannot reasonably survive on your own, then moving out would be an unreasonable risk. If you can find a way to make ends meet, even though it may be a struggle, it sounds like you should move.

Aspects of being young, IMHO, include self-discovery and taking risk. Without taking risk, you will have a much harder time finding yourself and your limits. You sound smart, so take some intelligent risk now, before you get stuck in a job you “cannot” leave, or in a relationship that will cause pain if you leave… before you get too tied down in a place you don’t really like. Then, you may be filled with regret.

As you age, these risks will be potentially more costly because you will likely have more to lose. Now, what do you really have to lose?

My mother has not been comfortable or completely understanding of risks I have taken in life, but she accepts them and accepts me all the same.

I for one, do not want to go to my grave thinking “if only I had…”

3

I’m sorry you’re feeling so down today.

I think you are doing and have done just about everything right- school, job,… and getting out on your own. You could do it now or a year from now and it probably wouldn’t make all that much difference in the long run. You sound like you have about the right amount of fear and excitement about living on your own for the first time. You should consider developing a plan (area, job, finances, furniture, etc.)to do so in your spare time (like you have any of that). A roomate might make it seem safer and less scary, but roomies present their own set of problems, too.

Good Luck!

4

Thanks for the reassuring feeling. Part of this upset feeling is from Thanksgiving. Now normally I’m the kind of person who has a happy time with family- I don’t normally associate it with drama and tension. But just talking to relatives, asking me “You’re still going to do _______ like we suggested, right Incubus?” and responding with, “Well, no, I’m not sure I’m going to do that. In fact I don’t know what I’m going to do- I was planning on just playing it by ear for a while” and seeing their face have a mixture of disapproval and disappointment made me kind of feel that either I’m upsetting and disappointing everone, or I’m letting myself down by following their suggestions just so I don’t feel guilty.

Also, several family members just recently discovered my brother joined the National Guard. While I would not have made the same decision, I really admire his convictions and ability to go through with it without second thoughts or guilt. My grandfather about hit the roof when he found out (albeit after several glasses of Scotch :stuck_out_tongue: ) and my brother didn’t give one inch of ground- didn’t suggest in the slightest that he might change his mind about it. I really respected him for standing up for something he believed in, even if it wasn’t the most popular choice in the world with my mom’s family. And the fact that he could do that so easily and I couldn’t really bothered me!

5

Well, you could learn how do do stuff like that too,(with practice)! :slight_smile:

6

I was like your brother as a teen and young 20something. “DAMN the torpedoes, full speed ahead!!”

And, I wished, for a long, long time in my life, that I had been a person like you. And who is to say that what you’re doing, even if unpleasant for NOW, isn’t being “decisive”? Just because it’s slower coming than your brother’s escapades, doesn’t mean that you’ve not made a strong or confident decision.

You’re almost done, hang in there. It’ll be worth it. In the meantime, can you take some little “mini-vacations” somehow? Stay with a friend for the weekend so that you can party, and run around in your underwear if you want (not saying you WOULD, just an example of being able to be more of a free single guy), or maybe even find a cheapie hotel for a night or two every now and then? Do you get spring or Christmas break? Maybe you could work an Xmas job to save up for a week of madness on Spring break or something.

Best wishes. Stick to your guns, don’t let some young, appears to be having more fun, brother make you doubt yourself.

7

I feel for you.

I turn twenty-four in a month, and I’m making minimum wage.

I’ve got a college degree, but I keep managing not to move somewhere where it could be useful. I want to go to grad school, but I havn’t the foggiest idea what I’d want to study, so I keep not applying. I keep not moving. I keep not pushing myself. And I’m stuck in this same stupid situation, not having any fun and being broke off my ass, day after day. My whole life, I’ve done the right thing, and everything has turned out great. But somehow that path just stopped, and I don’t know what to do next, and I’m stuck here treading the same ground, wondering if they made a mistake telling me I was going to be great and I was meant for a crappy existance in a faceless apartment scraping by for the reast of my life all along.

I keep taking the big risks- majoring in a dream subject adn working hard at it, going on crazy trips, talking big about how I’m going to make it one day. But the reality is that I’m twenty four and I all I’m doing with my life is working the lamest, deadendiest, lowest paid job imaginable. I thought by now I’d be in New York working for some trendy ad agency, or making movies on the streets of San Francisco with my hipster friends, or studying in Paris, or building schools in Africa. It all seemed so clear in school. But now everything- even the basic idea of making more money than I spend- seems hopeless and out of reach. I’m pounded by the regret of missed oppertunities. I’m starting to get embarrased to apply to grad school (even if I had any ideas about what to do there) because I’d have to let my old teachers know that I’ve wasted two years doing nothing.

It’s a tough age. Just now we are realizing that the path for us isn’t going to be easy and glamorous. And we don’t have any easy way of knowing where to go next. You sound just as lost as I do. I don’t have any answers, but you arn’t alone.

8

Also, I also worked three jobs for a while because I felt like if I was going to be a minimum wage slave, I might as well be a “hardcore” one. I felt like if I wasn’t doing something extraordinary- even if it’s just being a cashier, waitress and clerk at the same job- my life wasn’t really justified and something horrible was happening. Just know your not alone, k?

9

Thanks for the kind words, even sven. I have read your posts, about how you had to work on Thanksgiving :frowning: and the challenges with your job situation. Both you and I are in rather different situations, but it is interesting how both of us share the same degree of dissatisfaction with life.

Yesterday I spent the night over at my friend’s apartment. Because of school, I haven’t visited my friend much lately. But it felt nice to be away from my family, if even for only 12 hours.

One comfort I have, and that you might want to try to embrace as well is the fact that things can get better. I know that I’m a little worried about finding a full-time job this January because its been years since I worked full time, and I have been very lucky in my job selection up until now (relatively cushy jobs hours/energy-wise, nice coworkers, decent pay) and when I look for a full-time job I am going to have to roll the dice and hope my job-finding luck holds out. :wink:

10

You know, being gutsy (or, pigheaded, depending on your perspective) in the short term is a heck of a lot easier than making a commitment to a long term goal and sticking with it in the face of discouragement and angst.

Understand that your mom is guilting you for reasons of her own - maybe she’s scared of being lonely, maybe she doesn’t know who she is if she’s not your mom, maybe she doesn’t think she can run the household without you right there. However, she is a grownup, and it’s her responisibility to deal with her reasons on her own. You owe her, at a bare minimum, civility. Hopefully, you two have a good enough relationship (and it sounds like that) that you can also jot down love, respect, trust, and friendship to the list. No matter how long that list is, though, you do NOT owe her your adult life.

Hang in there until you’re out of school. Make your goal. You wouldn’t believe how good that will make you feel. Then, be ready to go start your life on your own.

In the meantime, spend more time with your friends, if you can. Find a place away from home where you can kick back and relax - maybe a Starbucks or a bookstore.

11

I feel your pain - I’m 24 with a newly-minted masters’ degree and I live at home, because I can’t get a full time job. Of course, if I had to I could get something that didn’t use my degree or help my resume that would allow me to move out, but that’s cutting off my nose to spite my face. It’s awfully hard to live at home as an adult, I know, especially if you went away for school at any point - I came home for grad school and it was tough, and my folks don’t understand what my problem is with it. So of course I feel like ungrateful swine. (Oink, oink.) “Is it so bad here?” Well no I just… argh. So I know that isn’t helpful but you’re not alone in your situation - I think a lot of people are stuck like that in this “boomerang generation” thing.

12

Incubus at least you have the Hitler Twins to amuse yourself with…wait that came out wrong.
Nothing to see here.

13

But you haven’t done nothing. If anything, you’ve grown older and probably wiser. You’ve got new experiences under your belt.

I know you’re really really busy, but can you fit in some volunteer work somewhere? Like, licking envelopes or making phone calls at a non-profit, tutoring children, or picking up trash with a local save-the-watershed group? Not only do you meet people doing stuff like this (and get new skills, sometimes), but it gives you something to say you’ve done besides your regular job(s).

It may also give you some ideas for grad school. Whenever there’s a thread about poor people, you are always the first to chime in with a great perspective. Do you think you’d like to study social work? It’s a very tough job, but it’s something that it’s in high demand (and you wouldn’t have to work with the government. Non-profits hire social workers too).

Are you interested in environmental issues? See if you there are any opportunities with the Nature Conservancy near you (in Cali, I’m sure there are). Environmental studies is a very interdisciplinary field. There’s the science angle, but there’s also the communication, administrative, policy, etc. stuff that humanities people are well-suited for.

Don’t be afraid to take classes as a non-matriculated student (they don’t go towards a degree). If you want to study something but you don’t have the necessary coursework under your belt, don’t let that be a barrier. I know someone who majored in math as an undergrad, worked as a computer geek for awhile, and then decided to go back to school to study environmental science. She had to take the pre-requisite undergrad biology and chemistry courses, but she did it. And now she has her Ph.D in environmental science.

I know how it would be embarrassing to go back and ask for letters of recommendation, but embarrassment fades pretty fast, I’ve found.

Um, Incubus? It takes initiative to juggle all those classes and jobs you have. And based on what you’ve told us in the past, it seems like you’re doing pretty well.

Some people put independence above financial security, but that doesn’t make them better or smarter. When I was job hunting, it would have been in my best interest to pack up and move in with my folks right after graduation. But noooo. I burned through four months of savings just so that I could continue to live in expensive northern NJ, go into NYC whenever I wanted, and be “free”. So when I did get a job and I had to move down to Miami, I was broke. I have several thousand dollars worth of credit card debt racked up. If the transmission on my Chevy Corsica goes out tomorrow (please God, don’t let that happen!) I will have to use my bike for my primary transportation. I can’t afford health insurance. I’m sitting in this hot apartment just so I can save on my energy bill. I’m “free”, yes, but I’m not exactly something to admire. As is probably the case with your brother, but he just does a good job hiding it.

Soon–very soon–your life will go from one of complete independence and you will stop comparing yourself to him so much. Keep in there and don’t worry!

14

even sven, you talk frequently here about how dirt-poor you are, even though you have a degree–in fine arts, IIRC. I know that a BFA doesn’t translate into instant employability, but is there not some type of job you could get that would give you better wages and benefits? Something in advertising perhaps? Or any place where artistic creativity is valued? You don’t have to have a business or technology degree to get a good job. I’ve worked almost my entire career as a programmer and my degrees are in German literature and library science. I’m only sayin’ … because I think you’d have a better shot at being able to manage grad school if you could make your financial situation a bit easier.

15

sven: * I’m starting to get embarrased to apply to grad school (even if I had any ideas about what to do there) because I’d have to let my old teachers know that I’ve wasted two years doing nothing. *

As someone who started grad school at the age of nearly 26 (after graduating from college at 21), and who has now written a few grad school recommendations for students of my own, I just wanted to pick up on this one point: DO NOT fall into the trap of thinking that your opportunities are somehow “over” because you’re twenty-freaking-four.

Your professors understand the impact that things like a slow economy, depression, uncertainty, etc., can have on someone’s progress. Speaking for myself and every other professor I’ve talked to about these subjects, what we are most interested in in potential grad students is not a whiz-kid record of unbroken success, but motivation and dedication about their chosen course of study and a demonstrated ability to handle hard work. If you get to the point where you do know what you want to do with grad school, please don’t let illusory fears about having “wasted your opportunities” deter you from doing it.

I think most of us go through some kind of disillusionment period after college, except for those who have already chosen a definite career path and embarked on it right away. For the rest of us, it’s kind of a letdown to realize that the “career” we’ve been so good at for so many years—academic success—is now over, at least temporarily, and we have to start a different undertaking and work our way up in it. In a sense, we’ve been “laid off” from being students, and if we were good students and enjoyed our studies, we tend to take it hard. There’s a feeling that somehow it must be our fault that things are more difficult now, and that we just weren’t good enough to continue succeeding. Not true. It’s just that the pre-mapped-out phase of going to school and going to college has come to an end, and you have to wander in the wilderness a while to discover what you want the next phase to be.

monstro: *I know how it would be embarrassing to go back and ask for letters of recommendation, but embarrassment fades pretty fast, I’ve found. *

No embarrassment required a-tall. It’s part of a professor’s job to write grad school recommendations, and any professor with an ounce of concern for the future of his/her field knows how important it is. There is absolutely no reason to hesitate about asking for recommendations ten years down the road, as long as the professor might remember you.

What’s more, there’s no reason to feel called upon to explain to the professor what you’ve been doing with yourself since graduation. Their task is to recommend you on the basis of the work you did for them, and no doubt they’ll also be pleased if you’re enthusiastic and well-informed and full of good ideas about the work you’re planning to do in grad school. All you have to say about the time in between is “I’ve been doing other things”.

It does help to have a recommendation from a recent teacher, though, so I’d strongly suggest that when you have a better grasp of your plans, start out by taking a continuing-education or adult-education college-level class in the field you want to enter, and try to persuade that prof to recommend you as well. Worked for me.