I saw Rocky for the first time last night--color me unimpressed.

Cafe Society
1

I saw it last night at a free outdoor showing at a park. I hadn’t seen it before, though I had seen the ending–from “cut me” to the closing credits.

I was pretty unimpressed. The beginning seemed incredibly slow, though the sound was really bad and I had a hard time hearing some of the dialog. I know it’s supposed to be an underdog, lovable loser type of story. But Rocky didn’t seem that lovable to me. He’s kinda dumb (okay, he can’t really help that, though I’m sure extra hits to the head don’t help), he’s an enforcer for a loan shark (if that sort of thing happened today, how fast would the press find that out!), and his courtship of Adrian, especially their first date, seemed really creepy to me. The only time I really liked him was when he walked that neighborhood girl home and was trying to teach her a lesson, but even then I thought he came off the wrong way.

When he was in the meat locker, and especially after the TV interview, I kept expecting the USDA to swoop down on Paulie. Mickey’s decision to train Rocky didn’t seem like he was being generous or anything. I got the impression that he was trying to live vicariously through Rocky, and also saw Rocky as his meal ticket–the best chance he’d have to coach someone in such a big match.

When Apollo Creed first decides to fight an underdog, I was liking his character a lot more than Rocky’s. He seemed more intelligent and articulate than Rocky did. And although I know his decision was largely to put on a “good show,” but I still liked his reasoning. One of the things about the film that I liked was that Rocky did NOT win the fight.

It was fun to watch in that setting, as the crowd was really digging it. There was all sorts of applause and shouts of “Philadelphia!” during his triumphant run up the stairs, and at the end. But I just didn’t feel it. This movie won Best Picture and has tons of fans, but I didn’t think it was so great. Is there something I’m missing? Was it also the underdog story as to how the film was made? The Zeitgeist of the mid-70s? Some key piece of dialog in the beginning that I couldn’t hear? A guy thing? Or is it not so great, after all?

2

It might be because so many films after it were so similar (particularly the next 4 rocky movies) I mean, we’re all pretty immune to the “Rocky” format now.
but remember at the time it came out it was pretty unique.

And the fact that he took his shot, gave it his all, win or lose.

(confession- Adrian’s speech to him on the beach in Rocky III gets me misty eyed every time)

Kinda like citizen kane, to watch it now, it’s not that impressive but given the context from which it came, given that it defined alot of the cinematic language with which in which we are all now fluent (at least on a subconscious level), it was pretty revolutionary.

3

I think the underdog story pretty much sums it up, that and the big Bicentennial zeitgeist of the time, which I believe played into Apollo Creed’s selection of opponent.

And a little more info:

Stallone was present during one of Muhammad Ali’s lesser fights, against Chuck “The Bayonne Bleeder” Wepner. Wepner’s previous claim to fame was being the last opponent of Sonny Liston’s career, which Wepner lost.

Wepner was a liquor salesman, and was expected to be an easy match for Ali. Wepner not only nearly went the distance with Ali before being knocked out late in the fight–*but also decked Ali for only the (fourth?) time in his career. This was the inspiration for the story of the bum (Rocky) who makes what was supposed to be an easy victory a much tougher fight for his flamboyant opponent.

*Well, that’s what everyone thought at the time. Later photos showed that it was not a knockdown. Wepner had stepped on Ali’s foot as he (Ali) was moving backward, and Ali had fallen. Not unusual in boxing. I’ve even seen one fight where it happend to both opponents.

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Also, at the time there was the real underdog story of Stallone himself. He had written the script and was offered a nice sum of cash for it. He refused as he wanted to star in the film as well but the studios wanted to use a “name” actor. He was again offered more money for just the script but still refused until he was finally able to star in the movie.
It was the “Big Fat Italian Fight Movie” of its day. Made for very little money and made a fortune.

Stallone is an obnoxious, idiot, asshole (and I say that from personal first hand experience), but he stuck to his guns and got his movie made, and became a blockbuster movie star as well.

He is now hinting about making yet another Rocky film…just what the world needs. That and Gigli II.

5

Well and Rambo 4 which is in the works. Rambo takes on the Taliban. No, I’m not making this up btw.

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Why does a boxer nicknamed “The Bayonne Bleeder” inspire no confidence in me?

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I personally was really surprised at how much I liked Rocky. I had seen II-V first, and was pretty disenchanted by the boxing thing. They made the Karate Kid look deep by comparison.

But it was on late one night, so I sat through it.

I really liked Rocky.

I liked the awkward dialogue, the creepy feel it gave you when he’s talking to Adrian. I liked Creed as the antagonist, who’s not hated, but simply antagonistic. I like that Rocky is so pitiful. I like the way the two boxers bond by the end of the fight.

I really think it did deserve the Academy Award.

8

I saw it for the first time a few weeks ago (although I too had seen the fight at the end), and I really liked it, much more than I thought I would. I didn’t expect it to be sweet! The first half or so had such an earthy, realistic feel to it - I mean, you really felt this guy talked that way, and understood when he was trying to be sweet and came off kind of creepy, all that. It had a lot of life in it.

In contrast, any scene with Creed in it was dead, dead, dead. Yeech.

9

I really like Rocky a lot. I can see how you might consider it a bit slow, especially since, as greck pointed out, the “Rocky formula” has become pretty much a standard formula by this point, so you may have been expecting something it’s really not. The first film was much more a character piece than a boxing film, and that formula really didn’t become a cliche until the sequels. As far as Rocky, the character, not being as smart or articulate as Apollo, well, that was one of the main themes. Remember the conversation he and Adrian had in the skating rink; she asks him why he became a boxer. Rocky responds that he always knew he was never going to get by on his brains, so he knew he had to use his body. She laughs and says that her mother always told her she was never going to get by with her body, so she’d better develop her mind, or words to that effect. Kindred spirits.

My favorite sequence in the film: Rocky has been offered the fight with Creed. Everybody knows it. Mickey, this awful old man who’s been berating Rocky the entire film so far, telling him what a bum he is every chance he gets, suddenly shows up at Rocky’s apartment. Hat in hand, all soft and nice. Barely even looks at the apartment, and tells Rocky what a nice place it is. His motives are completely transparent, and Rocky, while not the smartest egg, knows, and doesn’t want any part of it. Mickey goes on and on, making small talk, and Rocky is barely saying a word. Mickey tells Rocky that he’s going to need a manager. Rocky doesn’t want to hear it. “I needed you 10 years ago, Mickey. Where were you then?” Rocky goes into the bathroom to get away from Mickey. Mickey knows it’s over. “I’m 76 years old”, he says, almost a whisper. Talking to himself at this point, really. And suddenly, we actually feel for this pathetic old man (granted, due in large part to Burgess Meredith’s performance). He starts to leave, but realizes he’s forgotten his hat, and Rocky, hearing the door open and close, comes out of the bathroom, and finds Mickey still there. Now Rocky has had enough. This guy who’s been pretty quiet the whole film, explodes, yelling at Mickey. Mickey lets him yell, and leaves, trudging slowly down the stairs outside the apartment. Rocky is still yelling at him, letting everything out; where were you when I needed you? Cut to outside. Mickey is walking down the street, and we can STILL hear Rocky yelling at him, from all the way up in the apartment. Mickey walks down the street, away from the apartment.

All good stuff, but this next part is why it’s my favorite sequence, and one of the reasons why the first Rocky was a good film, so much better than all those that followed.

Mickey is almost all the way down the street now, and Rocky comes running out of his building after him, running down the street to stop him. Now, most screenplays, most filmmakers, would cut in on this, maybe have a little dialogue here, even if it’s subtext, or at the very least, cut in on it to a two-shot, showing Rocky making nice-nice with Mickey, saying, hey, we’re okay; shaking hands, whatever. But no, here we stay on a static long-shot, and the reconciliation happens waaaaaayyyyy down the street, way far away from us; we can’t hear what they’re saying. The director (or possibly writer; I’m not sure how this was in the script) was willing to take a very nice moment, and distance us from it, keeping it between the characters, kept it subtle, and made it a great scene. An especially brilliant way to end a scene where this normally quiet, introverted guy explodes. That’s good filmmaking. And yes, subtlety in a Stallone film.

10

I still prefer Rocky III (because of Mr. T as Clubber Lang and Hulk Hogan as Thunderlips) and Rocky IV (for the Vince DiCola score, and for being one of the ultimate '80s “we-hate-the-Commies” movies).

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Sounds good to me!