In defence of Russia

The BBQ Pit
1241

Based on this war, it seems to me the “lot of countries” not getting “real, effective weaponry for what they are paying” is a set of one – Russia.

For all the ballyhooed aid from the West, Ukraine has gotten little to no top-tier, cutting-edge war materiel. The majority of military aid provided to them has been weaponry and technology that’s 20 or 30 years old. They’re using this to fight an aggressor who has three times their population base and an exponentially higher military budget. An aggressor, it should be added, who agreed to help guarantee their sovereignty, and as of the night before the invasion was telling anyone who would listen they were definitely, no kidding, NOT going to invade.

The fact that Ukraine has taken this largely decades-old technology and weaponry and been able to keep the aggressor from taking over their country is a testament to their resolve and skill. But do not for a moment think that the results of the war thus far are an indictment of Western military might.

US (and NATO) war doctrine is based on a combined-arms approach. Ground, air, naval, and special forces units work together in a coordinated way to achieve goals, win battles, and shape the outcome of a war. The weapons and materiel they produce are designed with this cohesive approach in mind. For example, an F-35, with its stealth technology, its advanced avionics, and its integrated weapons system, is an awesome plane in its own right – but what makes it truly formidable is the way it links with other assets in the theatre to share real-time data. It works with other weapons and information platforms to become a significant force multiplier.

Ukraine hasn’t been given the capability to conduct full combined-arms warfare. They’ve gotten some individual pieces, but not the full package. It’s like they asked for help building a clock, and the West gave them some gears and a minute hand and said “You do the rest.” They don’t have all the pieces to create a combined whole.

Russia, on the other hand, DOES have everything it needs to conduct warfare on its own terms. They prepared and planned (in their own Russian) way for this invasion and war against a much smaller and less-well-equipped nation. The fact that their initial thrust was blunted and stymied, and that they’ve been reduced to indiscriminate shelling / rocketing / bombing of metropolitan areas, is a massive indictment of their strategy, logistics, training, and planning.

1242

It depends on what the goals are. Yes, the Russian doctrine of quantity has a quality of its own has some validity and if you don’t care about casualties, or preserving infrastructure, lots of cheap stuff is probably the way to go. The US has decided to concentrate instead on lower numbers of higher quality munitions, so as to reduce the collateral damage to infrastructure and civilian causalities and also making sure that our men and women come back alive.

When faced with opposition holding a city, Russian strategy might be simply to fire a bunch of artillery willy nilly, raze the city and let god sort it out. Western philosophy would be to launch a precision strike that hits the opposition but otherwise leaves the city intact. The first might have more bang for your buck but in terms of humanitarianism and public relations, the second is superior.

If say one American tank can defeat 10 Russian tanks but cost 20 times as much, both sides might think they have the better deal, the Russians are glad that think they can get away with spending half as much money for the same fire power, while the Americans are glad that they can take 1/10 the casualties.

1243

Cite? All I’ve seen so far is that the advanced equipment is working extremely well for Ukraine in the field. Here is a gift link to an article regarding the Bradley fighting vehicles, which although has suffered some casualties they are often able to repair themselves. Lack of parts is something of a problem but it sounds like its more an issue of logistics that needs to be sorted out rather than the parts not existing, and in the meantime the are cannibalizing the severely damaged ones for parts to fix the ones that received less damage.

1244

I assume that this is just our dear Komrad sloppily letting his allegiance show again. He’s not talking about Western systems; he’s talking about the Russian ones that have been noticeably completely absent from the battlefield (T-14 Armata, Su-57 Felon, exoskeleton ‘Iron Man’ armor) or which have barely made a cameo appearance with little to no actual effect (BMP-T Terminator, Ratnik future infantry combat system).

1245

I’ve heard nothing but praise for the Bradleys from Ukrainian crews. Even if the vehicle is destroyed, the crews say that the Bradleys saved their lives. They said that if they’d taken the same it in a Soviet vehicle, they’d be dead.

1246

I agree Ukraine should have got far more materiel. Aircraft would have always been a hard thing to do in quantity and quality. But I think more air defence pieces could have been provided. More long range artillery pieces and ammo. And yet more APC’s. Even then minefields are a terrible barrier. A huge amount of minefield clearing equipment was required. Of various types. With more air defence and longest range artillery to suppress during clearing operations. Without good air support you need good air defence and long range suppressive fire capability.

Indeed they are having a hard time in the offensive due to lack of a full combined arms base of materiel. Aircraft especially. I fear this will remain a fairly stagnant line. Both sides hoping to wear the other out.

1247

I think it is a valid point about Russian high tech weapons in particular. Without the access to many of the best electronics and some other items, they have to build a more complex system of more lesser capable parts to get an equal device. This will lead to higher failure rates and less perfect performance. But again they seem to be willing to just increase the amounts. So far they seem capable of building them.
But it is a great cost. They seem to be doing a bit better than the USSR in the economics, so far. But I suspect the strain will grow. How soon till it starts crapping out, I do not have a guess.

1248

See what I mean about sloppily letting his allegiance show? He’s talking about the shitshow performance (or complete absence) of Russia’s ‘high tech’ weapons.

1249

Is this a paid consultancy gig?

Might want to encourage Russia to stop invading its neighbors. That’d save enormously on “defense” spending.

1250

Yo, Putin’s mouthpiece, here’s a question for you. Why do you support this genius move?

A Russian court has ruled that a soldier who killed his wife should not go to prison, the mitigating circumstance being his participation in the war against Ukraine.

1251

My immediate thought was the insanity that could have occurred had this soldier’s trial occurred last month and he’d actually been convicted and sent to jail. He could always have volunteered and signed on for the Wagner six-months military service for clemency program.

Then again, per the article he could only have been sentenced to a maximum term of three years anyway, so probably not worth it even then.

Private Eduard Bitarov was found guilty of murder in the heat of passion, for which Russian law provides a sentence of up to three years in prison.

What a fucked up criminal justice system. I almost wouldn’t be surprised if there’s an honor killing exemption on the books.

1252

Isn’t “crime of passion” simply the western term for “honor killing”?

1253

That is bizarre. Such a light sentence even if fully applied. Laws in various countries are odd. That seems pretty backwards.

1254

LOL, sure, it’s definitely something we should chuckle about. That is the best reaction! Oh how silly to do such a thing. What funny goofballs those Russians. Excusing a man who murders his wife so that he can participate in attacking a nation that did nothing but want to not be part of Russia, deliberately targeting civilian areas and infrastructure, bombing schools and hospitals on purpose.

I’ve also heard that some countries wear silly hats and eat weird things! Countries are odd. Let us all chuckle with amusement.

1255

This post has convinced me that you’re a very damaged person.

1256

Hahaha, yes Komrad, laws certainly are humorous in ‘various countries’. Funny how man who kill wife only face three years and sentenced to zero because he fight Nazis in Ukraine for Mother Russia.

What’s even more funny is man who give wrong answer in street interview initially only face five years in prison, but now faces ten! Laws in ‘various countries’ certainly odd Komrad!

Russian police upgrade charges against Moscow resident in ‘fake news’ case over comment for Radio Liberty — Novaya Gazeta Europe

Moscow resident Yuri Kokhovets now faces up to ten years behind bars after a linguistic examination found “motives of hate or hostility” in a comment he gave to Radio Free Europe/Radio Liberty (RFE/RL) about the war in Ukraine, OVD-Info reports.

And a mandatory link to Roman’s video, without which I’d have not heard about this:

1257

Russia now has expanded its draft age, to assure more cannon fodder volunteers for the defensive war with Ukraine.

Next, Russia will create a Volksturm patriotic force of old men to defend the Rodina against aggression fomented by countries it invades.

1258

In one instance the word odd is sort of defined as funny. But funny as in strange.

Morons.

1259

Also. WTF about the case anyways. Fucked up legal things happen all the time. Post something useful.
I don’t bother posting about all the fucked up stuff that goes on in Ukraine that are aside from the war. It had and has it’s issues as well. But it has little bearing on the war or as an indication of the total character of the country.

1260

It’s a good thing you’re not plugging for Xi or Kim here. Their propaganda departments not only expect better, but actively punish those who do not perform up to expectations. To be blunt: your defense of Russia is not worth the 50 cents certain netizens get for their touts.

“Fucked up legal things happen all the time”? Seriously? Yeah, they do. But here’s the deal. Those fuck ups are not because a damn dictator you adore cannot get people to go murder people in another country for him to sate his ego.

“But it has little bearing on the war”? Seriously? The court declared that being involved in the war is exactly why this criminal is not being punished.

“or as an indcation of the total character of the country”? Seriously? The fact that the man can murder his wife with apparent premeditation and was only facing an incredibly short incarceration is very much an indication of the character of the country.