I want to make sure of something: Are you considering that Rin Twisted was a criminal when you say that by your count there’s 2 scum left in London?
I am asking because I missed it the first time, Rin’s death not being highlighted in red.
At this point it looks like a total of 5 criminals is more likely than 4, since we have 2 cops, 2 masons and a powerful spy, thus I agree with your statement that there must be two criminals left in London.
Comparison between the two cop claims:
Mahaloth, #632
Wolverine, #732
I put the differences in bold.
Obviously the central paragraph is sticking out: Although the ability is the same, the wording is very different. It’s more informative than Mahaloth’s role because of this part: “You know that all innocent players have a United Kingdom or New Zealand citizenship”, which indicates that we cannot have an outsider who’s not a criminal. I don’t think this was a certainty until now, if this claim is true.
Anyway, I’m very inclined to believe Wolverine’s claim.
From sachertorte, in case you missed it
So, six of us left in London:
MentalGuy - no claim.
Mhaye - no claim.
NAF1138 - Claims he cannot travel (#101).
Romanic - This guy is Town, I’m sure of it.
Rysto - Replaced Drain Bead after day 1. Scanned as a UK Citizen by Suburban Plankton (post #669).
Wolverine - Claimed Wellington cop (post #739).
I’ll start the hostilities with a vote.
vote: MentalGuy
I believe Wolverine’s claim. Rysto was scanned English so I’ll leave him alone for now, even though he could be the Godfather, immune to Plankton’s power. NAF strikes me as Town, even after the discussions I had with him yesterDay.
That leaves MentalGuy and MHaye.
I’m balancing toward MentalGuy mainly because of the case that was made on him by Normal Phase and I trust her instincts, now that she’s confirmed Town (well almost).
Yeah, I missed it the first time I read the writeup because I skimmed the post, but I got back to it after reading Mahaloth #736 post.
So, no, at this point I wasn’t missing that part, but thanks.
Frack, sorry, I couldn’t get back to participate in time for local Dusk.
I like your reasoning (though I am not as sure about you as you are about me) and was going to drop a vote on MHaye.
Vote MHaye
It’s a metagame vote, but I have caught him in it before. He hasn’t been his normal helpful self. Sure, he is typically quiet, but then when he talks he generally has something good to say. This game, so far, we have gotten the quiet without the quality posts to back it up.
I’m still not convinced of anyone’s alignment. Since MentalGuy and MHaye have votes I thought I should turn my attention to them first before reexamining Romanic and NAF1138.
MHaye’s posts
(#120) - shows the flaws in my stupid suggestion
(#218) - in favor of mass claim
(#225) - restates support of mass claim because of ability to catch liars while acknowledging the main flaw is that scum could target travelers to keep one town traveling to the other to lynch scum
(#227) - speculates about passport clerk [does MHaye have similar role?]
(#242) - comments on Day 1 bandwagons for Baffle and ShadowFacts
(#246) - see that ShadowFacts has claimed and votes for Baffle
(#527) - long attack on Romanic with vote
(#548) - explains WIFOM [BTW, I’ve seen the movie at least a dozen times, but had never see that phrase in acronym form before]
No strong reading from me either way. I couldn’t find any scum pings or suspicious wordings.
MentalGuy’s posts
(#121) - Waffles on mass claim. Thinks it’s a good idea but does not feel strongly enough to push for it. Then says that mass claims are almost always beneficial. Also points outs my idea was odd, but doesn’t see the scum advantage
(#165) - Doesn’t like Baffle or Astral Rejection. Suspicious of Astral because they are suspicious of me. “Astral is looking for an easy reason to have a vote on someone.” [But Astral is killed that night. Of course town would look for suspicious behavior]
Wants vanilla town people to travel to draw attention away from town with power roles that need to travel.
(#232) - Votes Baffle. Now against mass claims, but thinks that individual claims are OK. [Does not claim their own role]
(#237) - Responds to Astral Rejection about suspicions. Seems to be indicating that a mass claim would be good “I also think forcing the scum to choose would probably be a good thing”
(#532) - Defends Rin Twisted. Suggests my vote against Rin Twisted is a “safe vote” (which ended up being a good vote) and then misconstrues my attack against Rin Twisted as being against him. [Does not acknowledge later that they overreacted to my post after I responded back] Votes ShadowFacts
(#554) - Responds to Normal Phase’s objections
(#572) - Defends ShadowFacts vote
(#584) - Again defends vote
There is a lot more things in here that are setting off my radar. I still want to look at Romanic and NAF1138 again before the end of the day, but
vote MentalGuy
Primary reasons: They are in favor of sharing travel information, but do not divulge any of their own. They are sensitive to being associated with scum/Rin Twisted, but uses my attack against Rin as further possible proof of my scuminess.
So that other players do not waste any more time trying to figure things out, we (the remaining criminals, Rysto and myself) have decided to concede.
We (well, primarily Rysto) have analyzed the game and even if we both survive as long as is feasible, there is still no way we could win the game. The town team has too many players that are essentially confirmed or will be confirmed for us to eliminate them all.
Good game, town.
Wow, so I was wrong about damn near everything in this game.
Go me.
Yay for winning?
Wow, that was sort of…anti-climatic.
But nice job Town.
(I would have never guessed Rysto was scum, myself)
Another thought: The game was fun and a nice one and thank you to Sach for hosting…but it did seem to leaned heavily in favor of Town. I mean, two cops with strong powers? Even Plankton’s power alone was pretty strong (being able to deduce the number of scum in each location). Seemed a little off balance to me.
Unless scum has some really special/strong powers they didn’t have a chance to use.
Wow, so Rysto/Drain was a godfather?
Wow.
Uh, I only posted because I assume the game is over. Sach, can you let us know if it is not?
After thinking about it a bit more, I sort of need to take back what I said about the game being balanced in favor of Town. I forgot that Rin Twisted was scum too, but was taken out since no sub was found. That’s always a big blow to a side, especially scum side.
And the fact that one scum just happened to be in Wellington the Day before (as per SP’s power) and that we managed to find that one must have set them back majorly with all the rest of the Wellington players being semi-confirmed. Oh sure, SP could have been lying, but it seems most were going to give him the benefit of the doubt for now.
So it seems just lousy luck played a bigger part in it then I previously saw.
MentalGuy had the ability to get somebody travelling from Wellington to London rejected at the border and sent back. I was a godfather, and Ed was an investigator.
I think that sachertorte didn’t realize the the two city setup favoured Town as much as it ended up doing. I think that the concept is a good one but obviously it needs some tweaking in order to balance it properly. I have some more concrete suggestions in mind which I’ll PM to sachertorte.
In case anybody was wondering, here’s why scum can’t win:
The key thing is that once there was only one scum in London, Cookies could eventually get me lynched but I had nothing I could do to her. I don’t think that sachertorte realized the effectiveness of powers that work at a distance.
Just a quick note, if Rysto took control of London, the game would have split. Cookies could not arrest Rysto. All Rysto had to do was vote for someone, ANYONE else and his vote would take precedence over Cookies (e.g., vote for Cookies herself). Then Rysto would not be arrestable.
I agree that scum were in a very bad place, but I’m not convinced the stalemate was out of reach. I’ll have to think about it more.
Well, that was a bit anticlimactic…but I’ll take a win any way I can get it… 
sachertorte, thanks for sunning this game. It was a very interesting and a lot of fun. I’m not sure if it was overly balanced in the Town’s favor, or if we just got extremely lucky. I’m sure things would have been much different if we hadn’t bagged Scum the first 2 Nights in Wellington…and while I’d like to claim superior investigative skills on that, it was really mostly luck. And losing Rin Twisted on top of it certainly didn’t help the Scum’s cause.
I hope someone runs another one of these games…and I hope we get a bit more movement of players next time. It’s an interesting twist, and it barely got used at all…
That would work fine one day, but what happens the next? I don’t think that I could arrest Cookies a second time, could I?
you probably could have arrested the same person each Day, as long as they were in Wellington and never traveled to London