This is a subject to which I’ve given a great deal of thought to lately.
You’re ordinarily someone I usually agree with and often someone I read something by and think “HELL YES” , but in this instance you seem really invested in trying to make this true regardless of whether he feels this way or not. It seems he’s said a couple of times (for instance in post #71) in this thread that physical appearance/hotness is NOT entirely what he judges others on yet you repeat it as if it is fact.
I know in Straight Dopeland many people (not saying you) want to pretend that physical attractiveness does not or should not matter but that’s mostly a fantasy IMHO. I would bet that most people need to be physically attracted to someone AT LEAST in the beginning of a relationship. Is it the most important thing? Not for me and probably not for most people, but it has to be there to a certain extent.
A guy can be funny and kind and have lots in common with me but if I am not physically attracted to him there is zero chance we’ll be together. If that makes me like a 13 year old girl in some people’s eyes so be it.
Because ALL hot chicks are gold diggers.
Because hot chicks are ALL ALIKE.
Has it ever occurred to you that hot chicks are people too, and they actually differ from each other in personality and preferences?
I’m really not on board with concepts like “in my league” or hotness ranking. What’s hot to me is different from the Hollywood standard of hot; and what’s hot to that girl on the bus is going to be different from both of those things. What you’d rate a 9 I might rate a 4 – and the crazy part is, neither one of us would be wrong. It’s not like people are unified in what they’re attracted to.
…that you could seriously post such baloney.
And has it ever occurred to you that I am speaking from all my years of experience in a wheelchair; as well as speaking for the scores of other wheelchair-users who have experienced similar realities? There are certain social “truths” out there that some of you are acting like don’t exist. Sure, you can find individual exceptions to those truths here and there but by and large they hold true.
Could you elaborate on what she said that was such baloney? Some women consider Ryan Gosling to be the ultimate man. I think he’s attractive enough but he does nothing for me. People Magazine named Channing Tatum as the Sexiest Man this year. His body is BANGING but his face (to me) is eh. I don’t think she’s a bit wrong in what she said so I’m curious as to what you find to be so baloney-ish.
The disparity. Pure and simple. I’m (of course!) not arguing that tastes don’t vary-even significantly. But to say that she might rate someone a “4” and I would rate that same person as high as a “9” is what I call baloney.
He’s does say it, you’re right, but in the next breath he is back to wondering if as a ‘high 7’ he’ll ever be able to score a 9 or 10 again or are people in wheel chairs invisible to really hot chicks?
What’s he’s saying about about being interested in all levels of beauty isn’t really reflected in what he’s asking. I feel it’s safe to say anyone categorizing themselves and their future dates entirely on attractiveness, such that they have a scale, are, regardless of how much them backpeddle all about judging people solely on appearance.
And I am a firm believer that when people feel really judged, it’s almost always related directly to how judgmental they are being of others. You don’t even have to scratch the surface, to see it usually. Though they are often willfully blind to the connection.
His whole thread focus is on 9/10’s, a pretty telling sign that he’s all about physical appearance in women. How could he not feel like they are judging him in a equally shallow way? And he does, no surprise!
Geez o pete. I shouldn’t be surprised that you are once again completely misrepresenting what I said. I ABSOLUTELY did not do what you are claiming I did here. :rolleyes:
I am sure there are plenty of people whose rankings would vary that much (eg. Kim Kardashian, Tilda Swinton, Paris Hilton, Melissa McCarthy). Not sure I always agree with such disparities, but they obviously happen fairly often.
That said, the answer to your question fairly obvious. Of course being in a wheelchair is, all other things being equal, a negative. For example, how many women in wheelchairs have you dated? A wheelchair is a real, sutantial limitation for the majority of people. Obviously opinions will vary, but if you typically don’t have to compromise in terms of choosing a mate (like most really good looking women), then you probably would ignore those with things they find less attractive (eg. poverty, disabilities, stupidity).
That said, most of what little I know about you seems to indicate your interests and hobbies are wheelchair realted (correct me if I’m wrong), which does make it harder for others to ignore your disability. Either way, one’s attitude and other circumstances would probably matter more in the long run, and to be honest, if people in real life react to you as people online seem to, the chair is the least of your issues.
QFT
Anecdote time!
I dated a guy in a chair when I was about 18 or 19 years old, and still a pretty strong 8 or weak 9 on the hotness scale. I certainly wouldn’t have put the “in a chair” factor in the “plus” column, but he was otherwise very good-looking, smart and funny, upbeat and cheerful, etc. that I wasn’t really bothered by it. I was kind of bothered by the way he revealed it, though. And very much bothered with how fixated he was about trying to get me in the sack so that he could prove his manhood, LOL.
I met the guy online, chatted on the phone for few weeks, and we decided to meet in person. Only after the decision had been made (i.e. I had already admitted that I liked him, wanted to meet him, would go on a date with him) did he mention that he was in a chair. (Not a SCI.) That pissed me off a tiny bit at the time, because I felt like he had shown a real lack of trust by not telling me earlier. I decided that it might be mildly inconvenient, but he was able to drive, and had apparently had no problems with carrying on a relationship with able-bodied girls in the past, so I figured he was worth a few dates.
After date #1, he seemed waaaaaay too interested in making sure that I was fully aware that he was capable of carrying on a sexual relationship. He went pretty far into the TMI category, to the point where I started to feel like he was only interested in dating me because he might get some sex out of it. I decided to nip that in the bud by claiming that I had a “no sex until I had dated someone for at least 3 months” policy, to gauge his reaction.
He declined a third date, so take that as you will.
In retrospect, it seems a lot more obvious to me that he probably had a bit of an insecurity complex, had maybe been passed over for dates and/or sex because he was in a chair (or felt as though he had been) and didn’t want to waste any time with someone who was not that interested in jumping into bed with someone after two dates. Still, I had rather liked the guy and had my feelings hurt over the whole affair.
I think that if he’d downplayed the sex thing (a brief comment that things were operational down there would probably have been appropriate and informative, but not the overkill that I was subjected to) and removed some of the chip on his shoulder, things might have worked out better.
Last I’d heard though, he’d found someone and gotten married, so apparently things worked out eventually. I did hear through mutual friends that he was trying to convince his new wife that they should have a baby straight away, and I got a good chuckle from that. That guy, always trying to prove his manhood! 
Newsflash: men often value looks more highly than women do, and for some men it’s extremely important even if they also value other qualities in potential mates. Jaimie may or may not be one of those men (though I’m inclined to think he does fall into that category) and probably was before he landed in the wheelchair. It’s no better or worse than preferring blonds or a particular eye color or skin color or a particular height range or any of the other superficial criteria by which people judge sexual desirability. It’s certainly not limited to the OP. Really, from my viewpoint it’s coming across as a personal attack on someone some posters dislike rather than an actual consideration of the question.
And, as un-PC as it may be, when it comes to dating and mating a wheelchair is unquestionably a liability. Unless you’re talking about people with a particular fetish, which are few and far between and which the OP has mentioned in prior threads he has had some unsettling experiences with.
Yes, for some people a wheelchair IS a turn-off. For some even a dealbreaker. Others can overlook it the way they’d overlook some other defect. For some of us who are willing to consider physically disabled mates it is still an obstacle and worry.
I think what the OP was asking was if the pool of stereotypically hot women - pretty, svelte, socially successful, with an ample field of potential mates to choose from - are going to look at him at all or would he be able to gain their attention long enough for them to see his other good qualities?
Whether it’s fair or not, any one in a wheelchair is going to have to try twice as hard (at least) at developing their positive qualities to date and mate in this world. They’re not out of the running entirely but they are at a definite disadvantage.
Wrong. Other than bodybuilding; which I compete against with other wheelchair users, I don’t take part in any wheelchair-related hobbies. Even that I only actually compete every few years, so the training and bulk of activity time spent on the hobby is spent with non-wheelchair users. And as far as you suggesting that I WOULDN’T date a woman who used a chair simply because I HAVEN’T is silly. I have no hang ups about dating an (attractive) wheelchair user. None whatsoever. The limiting factor is the fact that there aren’t that many around to meet. Period. I haven’t had the chance.
Also, as counter-intuitive as this may seem, women who use wheelchairs are THE MOST RESISTANT to dating other wheelchair-using men; much more so than there able-bodied counterparts. The reasons for this are probably grounds for a new thread.
Fair enough, but you do seem to get into arguments about handicapped parking, bathroom stalls, and how people treat you at the gym to make me think you’d make it hard for those around you to forget you are in a chair.
I wasn’t implying that you wouldn’t, I was assuming you haven’t. It seems I was right. Now, even though you are theoretically open to dating disabled women, you have not sought out the opportunity. Why? I cannot imagine you have never seen an attractive chair bound woman - that is unless they are invisible to you.
But like I said before, my admittedly brief encounters with you on this site make me think you are a guy who is stubborn, too interested in being right, and always involved drama. I could very well be wrong, but I know I am not alone in seeing it that way.
I stick up for myself and my rights-andvthe rights of other disabled people. If I don’t no one will. If that means someone can’t “forget that I’m in a chair”, well I don’t think id want that anyway. My besides, if I wasn’t so adament about being treated fairly and equally, any person who spent a lot of time with me would suffer along side me as well.
And as far as your disbelief at the fact that I have not come in contact with attractive women in wheelchairs, all I can say is we don’t all live in NYC. The only women I ever see in chairs are old women or very, very disabled ones. The high functioning wheelchair users aren’t in my vicinity. “Invisible to me”. Geez man.
If I were single, I’d not object to dating an attractive wheelchair-bound woman.
As long as she hated Law & Order: SVU, of course. Some things, though seemingly superficial, are good indicators of character and thus are not negotiable.
FTR, Ambivalid’s pet cause is a worthy one IMHO. Able bodied people shouldn’t take spaces from those who need them, and I suspect one of the reasons they do is because they have an image of a weak, elderly wheelchair user who is too meek to ask them to move. Those people are bullies, and won’t respond to a posted sign or polite request. I’m proud of J for sanding up for others. I would hope he wouldn’t endanger a date by risking a physical confrontation, but I don’t blame him at all for having an aggressive response to bad behavior. I feel the same about child abuse or neglect of pets, and I’m the crazy bitch who will step between a parent hitting a child (I’ve done it) and I will call the cops on any shithead who leaves a dog in a 90 degree car. Each of us has pet peeves or some idea of injustice that we are willing to fight. It isn’t our sole defining feature.
I’m losing track of your point here.
From what I can tell, your stance is very attractive women don’t seem to even consider men in wheelchairs. Kaio says that not all super attractive women are some mind-sharing monolith. Also, it’s not like super attractive is some objective thing; what one guy finds stunning another may find meh. Then you called that baloney.
Ah hmm. So in an effort to understand what, precisely, is baloney about that, your response is there’s not really that much discrepancy between what people find attractive. Okay, so to you the flaw in her post to you was how much variability she believes there is in what is good looking? You’re on board with the part that suggests not all gorgeous women think the same?
I’m going to be that guy.
A woman being in a wheelchair would be a turn-off. I wouldn’t mind befriending someone who is handicapped. Hell, I befriended a few guys who were handicapped in college (they were very cool dudes). There were a few women who I interacted with in college who were handicapped. The fact that they were handicapped made no difference to me on a platonic level. On a romantic level, it just wouldn’t work out.