I mean the brief period of time the opposition takes power
No lie. I suppose, one could buy a small boat that is at least large enough to be livable [say, a 38-40 foot sailboat, like the one my grandfather had when I was a kid] because if nothing else, you are coastal and if the fecal matter processes through the rotational cooling device, you can pull up stakes and transit elsewhere temporarily. Hard to beat going out and making circles at sea in international waters, and with a decent solar setup, you could sea anchor somewhere and use solar and batteries to keep a reverse osmotic water maker and an ice maker =)
I can’t think of a country outside the U.S. where I’d be comfortable living.
But there’s been a “Calexit” movement gaining steam the last few years, advocating for California to become an independent country. I used to just snicker at such a ridiculous notion, but if the Democrats fuck up this year’s election like they did in 2016 (and don’t think it can’t happen), I may have to get on board with my support.
The U.S. Constitution is a wonderful document, but it’s worthless if nobody enforces it. Who needs amendments when you can just ignore the parts you don’t like with impunity? That’s what’s happening now, and if this administration (and, perhaps more importantly, its enablers) are able to do so for another four years, the country will become a de facto dictatorship. (Again, don’t think it can’t happen.)
If my state doesn’t want to be a part of that, I’ll be all for it.
I was already considering moving to Israel. If Agent Orange wins (or “wins”) in November, I’m definitely moving to Israel.
Precisely. If there’s a lesson from Jewish history, it’s that you can never be paranoid enough.
What I still can’t figure out is 70% of the electorate in America is women and minorities. How the fuck are we electing fascists to national office? I could understand if only white men were allowed to vote (which was how America originally operated, property owning white men could vote and thats it). But as the electorate expands to include the poor, minorities, women, etc that should form a bulwark against fascism.
I mean, hopefully, it kind of is. College educated white women are abandoning the GOP. I think they preferred Hillary by 7 points, they prefer Biden by 20-30 points
Either way, Trump isn’t a one off. He is a symptom of a deep rot at the core of America which is fundamentally based on angry white people throwing a fit since they aren’t the center of the universe anymore. Even if Trump leaves office, the people that support and enable him will still be here. Theres not enough room in canada for all of us.
This is spot on…
Naw, wouldn’t go out to sea - it’s just a couple hundred miles north and I’m in Canada via water around here. Go north hugging the coastlines, it’s fairly rugged along much of it, I could keep a low profile. It would be one way to get out of Dodge although I’m sure there are bumps along that road, too. (If nothing else, the Great Lakes in bad weather can kill you quick). Won’t need reverse osmosis because the lake water is fresh, and I can live without ice.
That’s why the systematic vote disenfranchisement, the gerrymandering of election districts, and all the other crap going on - so only the “right” people will wind up able to vote.
Curiosity leads me to ask: How does your state view the parts of the first amendment that don’t refer to the right to peaceably assemble for a redress of grievances and how does your state respond when those peaceably assembled are no longer peaceful?
Got to admit, I’m a little shocked you have any concept of the political unrest in Chile right now. Yep, they are certainly having issues but from where I sit they aren’t as bad as what we’re having in the US.
As far as as the glittering mansion or shit hole I’ve got no clue what you’re talking about. The most expensive part of Ascunsion runs about $650/month for a 900 sqft apartment. My friend just bought a 40 hectare farm in arroyo y esterros for $200k. Even in the most rural land in the US that is capable of agriculture that is crazy cheap. I was just looking at 150 acres of unimproved land in Southern Minnisota for almost $400k. I don’t know of anywhere you can get 100 acres of a working farm in the us with a home for $200k.
Or how about an apples to apples comparison Chilean wine country to say Colorado wine country. Sure Chile’s wines are world renowned and even in Colorado no one wants a Colorado grown grape but let’s see how it goes. Here is a 5 acre Vinyard with a working winery in Colorado for $2.5mm. Here is a 370 acre working vineyard and winery in Chile for $1.8mm.
The US is crazy expensive even the non glitzy mansions in San Francisco.
Only in terms of theory. We cannot stop working and hide. We live in NYC. What we WANT to do is leave and move to the North Country- upper Vermont or New Hampshire.
We’re not farmers and cannot become self-sufficient. We’d starve without a community. We can contribute some skills but cannot survive alone.
We’re scared.
We’re also sad. I have been watching the collapse of Rome for almost 4 years now and it sure isn’t comforting.
Well there’s Canada. It’s similar to the US but better. You get all the same cable channels plus you don’t have to go broke if you need medical attention.
I’d also like to add that since the voting age was lowered to 18 in 1972 no president has had more than 36% of the voting age population actually vote for them. The non-voters are actually the largest political block in the country–not the Democrats or Republicans.
And if I remember correctly voter turnout in mid-term elections has never been over 50% either.
Well, every element of the U.S. Constitution’s first amendment is also included in California’s current State Constitution. And certainly State and local laws regarding violence and vandalism are already codified.
So I’m not sure what this question has to do with California’s potential independence.
This.
But in addition to this, people would be surprised at how little space they need to live on. People might find it hard to imagine, but we don’t need a 3-bedroom home. We can do just fine in a flat or a smaller home.
I’d gladly trade in extra space for easy inexpensive access to medical care and even halfway decent public transport. Granted, right now, people aren’t itching to use public transit, but that’ll change in time.
If Cal is picking and choosing which parts of the Constitution to apply when there is oversight, how can you trust them to enforce their own constitution evenly without it?
I’m really not trying to be obtuse here, but do you want to just come out and tell me what the hell youre talking about?
If you think the United States is about to undergo some dramatic change of character, you’re probably white. Unless the change of character is that white people are suddenly going to start experiencing the same chaotic, capricious spasms of state-sanctioned violence that target nonwhite people.
Consider that a huge part of this country’s population was once beaten and whipped to extract labor for the enrichment of white people. That was America, and we have a long way to fall before we reach that point.
What’s changing is white people’s understanding of how faithfully this country lives up to its ideals (i.e. not very well). They’ve been insulated from the betrayals and precarious chaos that they inflict on the rest of the country. Now we’re starting to see that it’s broken and has been broken from the beginning.
How many religious organizations are not free to worship as they choose due to governmental oversight? How many arsonists and looters are not being charged by sympathetic prosecuting attorneys? How many gun nuts have had their ability to own or possess firearms restricted without cause? How many people are not free to travel or gather because of an overblown viral threat? How many gatherings are denied or broken up because they are not politically approved? Covid-19 handed many petty bureaucrats a magic club to control the populace and with which to enforce their vision of what is right. Many overreaches existed before it but the pandemic opened Pandora’s box and the actions of a fucked up Minnesota LEO threw a flare into a fireworks factory.
Okay. I gather you think California’s COVID-19 response has been too restrictive. A lot of people here think so too. We’re all dealing with an unprecedented event, and there are bound to be missteps. I do believe, though, that Governor Newsom is making a good-faith effort to keep his citizens safe, even if not everybody agrees with how he goes about it.
You think we’re too soft on crime? Guess what, sometimes I agree with you on that. Sometimes I don’t. There are a lot of shades of grey, and it’s a subject worthy of a good debate, for sure. I will say that the media has very much overreported the violence around BLM protests. It really isn’t an issue.
You think we’re too restrictive toward gun owners? Maybe. I truly don’t know; I’m not at all plugged into that world at all, so I can’t say.
You think we don’t support freedom of religion? That one, I’m afraid I don’t see at all.
So anyway, thanks for pointing out that California isn’t perfect, and its government isn’t perfect. I did already know that.
But the bottom line is, I trust my fellow Californians to elect competent and compassionate leaders, and to subsequently hold them accountable for their actions. I do not trust the country as a whole to do that.
So why don’t you? A lot of people seem like they are leaving NYC (and they aren’t becoming sustanance farmers). I’m friends with one family who has more or less moved to their vacation home in NC and will probably stay there. A shame too, since they were the ones who threw parties on their penthouse rooftop a fifteen times a year.
Talking about the “end of America” or “end of NYC” is stupid because it doesn’t mean anything. Even if they walled off NYC Escape From NY style and the USA split up into it’s component states, I don’t know that I would necessary move out of New Jersey (or what will become known as the Barony of Upper Guidoshire on Hackinsack). I still have to do ordinary run of the mill stuff like find a job and find out who my kid’s teacher will be this year (hopefully not me).
The whole problem is that people talk about “new normal” like this is it, but it’s not. The current situation is not sustainable long term, so it won’t be sustained. The actual “new normal” will happen in a few months, maybe a year when the world settles into whatever it is going to settle into for awhile. The problem is that there are so many unknowns, it’s tough to plan anything long term.
I’m looking for a job, but should I look local to NYC or anywhere else? A lot of that depends on how “remote” everything stays.
Similarly, my wife’s been at her job for 15+ years and it appears to suck.
We have property in the NJ/NY area. Should we unload it or will we be kicking ourselves in 10+ years for selling it in a down market? Or kicking ourselves for not selling it after it’s under 80 feet of water?
Really, what I’m say is I kind of wish everything would just collapse or not and get back to normal. I don’t want to have to both scavenge the wasteland for gasoline AND prepare a resume for a corporate job.