Actually, in our current system, its the wealthy that have the power. So I’m okay.
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It’s happened before.
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Ha. You think I go around “spreading hate” in the real world? I’m the nicest person you would ever meet (unless you’re mean to my beagle). Online, since I don’t know any of you, I can’t say I care much, and am more apt to lose my temper, since from my current perspective, none of you are “real” people. You’re just names on a screen, so why should I care what you think of me? Half the time I’m just being contrarian, because its fun to watch the responses.
I’d rather have those generally moronic masses on my side than the supremes in many cases. Popular opinion is very powerful. And while making laws to protect people is a good thing and should be encouraged, it’s just as- if not more- important to have people on your side.
Well, let me walk on stage here and ask Kirk how evil I am in his sight.
Like him, I believe in a God who loves all men and women, with no reference to sexual orientation, and who calls everyone else to do the same. Like him, I’ve fought battles on that other board for the rights of gay people to be treated like human beings and not subhumans advancing their own agenda.
Unlike him, I’ve been involved in a happy heterosexual marriage for 27 years (as of this Friday). And I’ve been woken up to the need to address the rights and needs of individuals through the love of a young man who is the closest thing I’ll ever have to a son.
And I sympathize with and have compassion for the pain he feels from the wilfully anti-gay stereotypers and from the ignorant who don’t realize what their views entail in pain for gay people. But, as this board’s motto suggests, the task here is “fighting ignorance,” not fighting the ignorant. And the self-proclaimed-as-Christian men who are quick to condemn homosexual activity as sin are also the ones most convicted by the idea that we are to love all our fellow men.
So if I have one thing to say in open-board advice to Kirk, it is to swallow your anger and give people time to grow. You needed it; I needed it; and they need it – and you and I both believe in a God who will force them to grow if they’ll only listen. And to the rest of the board, ease off a bit, including on the psychological analyses. The man’s been dumped on – if he’s venting his anger in the wrong place, all he needs is what MEB had to say – if you’re gonna criticize (or analyze) another member, take it to the Pit. (And that includes all of us, not just Kirk.)
And, just to steer this back to the OP, Power station asked for his views to be analyzed for homophobia, and stated that they were “live and let live” – so long as the gay people “keep it private.” It occurs to me that it might not be a bad idea to explain to him what’s wrong with that stance – something we’ve effectively been hijacked from.
I’ve been reading this thread, and I want to know how evil I am.
He’s jumping up and down screaming that he absolutely hates people who hate gays because hating is wrong. Hello? Dose of own medicine? Practice what you’re preaching?
I’m a straight person, and until the place closed, I used to hang out in a pub that attracted about a 50/50 mix of straight people and gay people. In all the time I went there, I never had a problem with a single person, except for one girl. She hit on me, (she shoved her tongue in my mouth on New Year’s Eve), and when I declined to go home with her, she called me a homophobe who should have the shit kicked out of me until I understood how to treat lesbians.
Since I’d been going there for a long time, and I had been hit on before (by guys and girls) and had hit on people (guys, some of whom I later found out were gay), it never occurred to me that anyone would react the way she did to my ‘I’m flattered, but I prefer men.’
My personal orientation is that I am not in any way attracted to women. Kissing a woman is like kissing the back of my hand, I just don’t get turned on by it. I have no problem at all with the women who do get turned on by it. I’m not a fan of lesbian porn, although I do somewhat like gay male porn (because it features my favorite thing in porn - naked men.) I have a fairly high PDA ick-factor regarding straights and gays. I don’t really get icked by seeing hand holding, hugging, and light kisses, but tongue down throat, groping, public sex, that bugs me wether it’s a male/female, female/female or male/male. Sex is a private thing to be engaged in by 2 or more people who consent to being in the area. I don’t wanna see people goin at it on the city bus (and I have.)
Right. Because the wealthy are so dedicatedly pro-gay. :rolleyes:
I said:
To which you reply:
Really? When?
Surely you realize that the only “you” any of us knows or can respond to is the “you” you choose to present through your computer. With respect, if you choose this forum to exercise your “none too bright angry young man” persona, then you cannot be surprised if we assume you are a none too bright angry young man.
First, we are each of us just as real as you are. Second, I don’t know why you should care what a group of near-strangers think of you, but judging by the offense you took at being addressed as a female, you apparently do care. Third, I can tell you from experience that while you might assure yourself that you don’t care what we think, this little cyber-world can become a mighty uncomfortable place if people decide you’re just another insincere jerk.
A bit of advice: This is not a tendency you want to make a habit of indulging. Yanking people’s chains (a/k/a “being contrarian just to amuse myself watching the responses”) is a form of trolling and as such is frowned upon by The Powers That Be.
The Supreme Court has come down against the tide of public opinion on many cases. Thier decisions on school prayer did not sit well with the bulk of the populace at that time (though in retrospect the court has come around to their point of view). The Reihnquist court is not so motivated. But it could happen.
Yeah. But I don’t care what you think about me, generally speaking.
Okay, fine. Take all my positions, and tone them down by about 3000% if you want see where I really stand on things. I’ll admit it. I don’t wear pride shirts, I don’t spit on Baptists, I don’t picket churches. I’m an extremely moderate libertarian on everything but free speech issues, where I’m a radical (say anything, anywhere, anytime, no matter who it offends). I play chess, swim, write a weekly political column for my university paper, and am writing a novel. I’m not a firebrand.
But I play one on TV. Which has now gotten boring, so I’ll stop.
A case of a supreme court giving rights to gay people when the majority wasn’t for it would be Vermont in the passage of the Civil Union law, I think. Although I can’t find any statics on what percentage of the population supported what.
You’re a four. But I won’t tell you what the scale is.
No, what I was saying is I hate those who discriminate against other people, or who push the government to. Or thats what I shoulda been saying. I dunno, I haven’t been paying much attention. Has anyone been taking notes?
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Yes, anything above a kiss should be kept in private.
Hmmm… You’re a six, but most of it by association.
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Congratulations. Which anniversary is that? Balsa wood?
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But the best thing about fighting the ignorant is that they don’t even realize they’re in a fight until its too late.
Attacker: “Die, scum!”
Moron: “Huh… what… hey!” (dies)
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To seriously answer POWER’s position: he is a bigot, based upon what he says. Not because he finds gay sex icky, but because he support discrimination against gays in regards to marriage and adoption.
I don’t have a clue – I thought the stereotype called for you to be the expert on good taste and etiquette! But thanks for the congratulations.
Seriously, a fair proportion of this board (on the order of 80-90%) is in favor of gay rights, almost totally as strongly as you (though not quite with the vehemence), and is generally in disagreement, not on whether they are entitled to them, but on how best to accomplish the ends of getting them for them. Check some old threads on the subject; you’ll be surprised.
Also, with reference to an exchange in a related Pit thread, don’t forget that there are independent Baptists and the ABC, the former ranging from rabid fundy. to extremely liberal and the latter among the most liberal denominations. Baptist =! SBC member.
But you see, you’re not all that real to me, either. Certainly you’re not real enough for me to want to have to work hard to discover the truth of an issue I frankly don’t give a tinker’s damn about, such as “where you really stand on things.” I mean, life is short. You’re either . . . well, let’s just call it “unsmart,” or you’re pretending to be “unsmart,” and I find I can’t be bothered to care which of those reflects reality. What’s blindingly obvious, however, is that you’re wasting my time – time which, while cheap, isn’t that cheap. So while you make up your mind as to whether you’re done being a jerk or not, I’m just going to wander off to a thread where my time isn’t being quite so obviously wasted. Toodles.
Geez, everybody gets so uptight around here. POWER_station, I will give you as literal an answer as I can.
Yes, it is ok to be homophobic, because we are all entitled to our fears, rational or not. Almost everyone can identify groups of people or situations with which they are uncomfortable for some reason.
What is not ok is to act out on those fears in the civic arena. If you do so you may be crossing a line into mental illness.
You are self-described as “homophobic”, and implicit to the definition of that term is the concept of irrational fear. You must recognize that your gut level reactions are, in fact, irrational, and you must judge your own subequent behavior with this in mind.
It was pointed out early on that it was “OK” to be homophobic. The ever-helpful SDMB was trying to answer the followup question: “Should I be homophobic?”.
and you are one of those liberal tolerant people that speak of freedom.
I am entitled to have the opinions I want. I think gays like you should have more taste than you show here. You sceam for tolerance and becomes intolerant the moment you feel that you have some kind of majority on your side.
Irrational fear ??
Well that depends, if the cause of homosexuality is biological or social.
It’s not irrational to be homophobic if the cause for homosexuality is social. = A society that are very liberal when it comes to sex and homosexuality tend to create more homosexuals.
However, I do not know if the cause is biological or social.
Because then we’d still have the tax, familial and parental rights and priveleges. We’d still be legitimized by the government. To hell with the bigots. A hollow victory is better than defeat.
I am not in anyway a liberal. At least, not in the American sense.
Sure you are. But your opinions against gays are bigotted and dangerous, and society should rebuke you for them. You would deny me equal protection under the law, just because you find me “icky.” That’s despicable.
I apologize for my hyperbole, but my intention stands: if you do not believe in total equality for all people, then you are not a good person. In my estimation, of course.
Which has now gotten boring, so I’ll stop.
But thanks for the congratulations.