It might be an American thing, but it’s not a Canadian thing. If you’re having a barbecue or wedding or something with booze and kids, people here will be drinking, I assure you. Most people will keep it within reasonable limits with kids around. It really isn’t a big deal. Of course, the drinking age here is 18, so our mileage is definitely varying.
Then you’ve got the people who insist on bringing their small children to a pub, just because it’s non-smoking. Um, it’s still a pub, and no, your child is not welcome there. See the pictures of scantily-clad women on the walls? Here the loud music and swearing? See the drinking? See the lack of a clown and a kids’ menu? This is not McDonalds. But, I digress…
Ah yes, the OP - if you don’t want kids at an adult party, don’t have 'em. We didn’t have kids at our wedding, either (and of course my sister with the brat who basically prompted the “no kids” thing was the only one who made a fuss about it :rolleyes: ), and we made it clear on the invitations, too. If I were you, I’d decide now what to do about people who show up with their kids anyway.
“Reasonable limits” about sums it up for me. Moderate drinking is fine with me. If there’s a possibility that people will get tipsy and there might not be people around to watch over the kids, that’s where I have the problem.
[QUOTE=Arnold Winkelried]
Perhaps it is a cultural difference. I have read that in America people are more prone to swearing off all alcohol during the week and then engaging in binge drinking on the week-end, whereas in the european countries I am familiar with, people will drink moderately but all throughout the week. I am a little surprised to see these comments “I know that even after one drink I stop giving a shit about anyone else but me”, and even realizing that alcohol can affect people in different ways, that seems odd.
As far as the observation that “A lot of people get kind of violent when they’re drunk”, my experience has been that the people that get violent when drunk are the kind of people that are obnoxious and belligerent when sober. But maybe I don’t get out enough./QUOTE]
I phrased both of those badly, I apologize.
What I meant was, a lot of people, myself included, get a kind of “tunnel vision,” not literally, but figuratively, when drinking. The world blurs a bit and you don’t much care what everyone else is experiencing because you’re busy experiencing it. That actually applies to a lot of drugs, not just alcohol.
And I said violent, and I didn’t mean violent. Once again, I apologize. I mean like…I guess “boisterous” would be the right word. They move around more than they normally would and don’t look around them. There are people like that sober, it’s just that the likelyhood of it happening when drunk seems to increase.
Hadn’t actually thought about the violent drunks - I’d assume they wouldn’t do that in public, but what the hell do I know? I don’t watch people get drunk in public a lot.
(And I honestly mean that, I’m not being snarky - I don’t watch people get drunk in public)
It’s not an American thing, either. When my family/friends get together, there’s almost always alcohol, and people feel fine about bringing their kids.
It would feel VERY weird for people to either not drink or take their kids home because there was alcohol around.
One drink does not give me or most of the people I know tunnel vision, nor does it make us unable to take care of the kids.
Yeah, I think tashabot’s opinion on kids never being at parties where alcohol is served is rather unique, or at least limited. That’s not to say she’s wrong - it’s a valid opinion, and she seems to have thought it out - but it’s not common to anyone I know.
As for the OP’s query, I agree that while it should not be needed, it would probably be helpful to specify that the party is not for kids. This in particular caught my eye:
Because half of these people know her specifically **because **of your kids and their kids, I could see why they’d think their kids were welcome, and assume that your kids would be there for their kids to play with. While, etiquettarialy (yes, I just made that up!) they shouldn’t, I’d understand it. I have my friends, and then I have my kid’s friends’ parents, and I don’t really think of my kid’s friends’ parents without thinking of the kids. I don’t know if that made sense at all, but it really wouldn’t occur to me that someone I met at play group would invite me anywhere without my kid. I wouldn’t be offended, but I’d be a bit thick about it if it wasn’t crystal clear.
There’s usually nothing fun for kids do to at an adult’s birthday party. I doubt that most teens would want to go either - unless a friend goes too.
I’d say something along the lines of “no children please”. Simple and it doesn’t sound pervy - like “adults only.” Some people will be offended, but like others have said “it’s your party”. You make the rules.
The kids will most likely be bored and whining that they want to go home… so they should stay home.
Although I don’t know your reasons for starting at 6:30, I’d imagine that if you could:
[ul]
[li]Move the start time to say 8:30 or so[/li][li]Specify the dress code, say suits/cocktail dresses[/li][/ul]
you’d probably eliminate most kids from the party. Few parents are going to want to doll up their larvae and drag them to a party that starts at about their bedtime. It’ll pretty well telegraph the idea that it’s not a kid party without having to explicitly say it.
The reason for starting at 6:30 is that we’ll be serving dinner. I have people flying in from halfway across the country for this (for the benefit of my wife), and I’d be embarrassed to ask them to come for a 2-hour event & no dinner. Plus, it gives me a good reason to get my wife out of the house- c’mon honey, we’re meeting so and so for dinner, let’s get a babysitter… SURPRISE!
By the way everyone, thanks for all the suggestions. I think what I’m going to do is call those people that I’m worried about under the auspices of getting their mailing addresses, and casually mention that it’s an adult thing when we’re on the phone. Then if their RSVP card comes back and says “# of people attending: 7”, I’ll know I have another call to make.
I realize it’s my party and I can invite (or uninvite) whomever I want, but I’m particularly sensitive to offending people that I don’t know- namely my wife’s friends through the playgroups and schools. When we got married, we made the same rule, I think by putting it right on the invitation, but I wasn’t really worried about it at that point since I didn’t really care if we offended anyone. Plus, she could reassure me that her Aunt Mabel wouldn’t be offended, and vice-versa. I don’t have that same luxury this time since I’m planning this solo.
Don’t think I’m being offensive or defensive, because I’m not.
It’s not so much that I have a problem with kids at parties where alcohol is served. I have a problem where kids are going to parties where people might get DRUNK. I don’t think drunken behavior, which can range from overly affectionate and happy to violent and handsy, is appropriate for young children.
As I stated before, once kids reach a certain age, usually ten, or younger, or older, depending on the maturity of the child in question, it doesn’t really matter. But younger children aren’t going to understand what’s going on and might not know when to stay away. They might get hurt, they might piss someone off, or they might, if you don’t know your friends very well, be the victim of a molestation (that’s a very extreme example, I know). Normal bumps and bruises are a normal part of a child’s life; getting beaned across the head by someone who had a little too much to drink isn’t.
My opinion isn’t unique, so to speak. Most people that I know (which might be why I have this opinion) object to exposing young children to the possibility unnecessary danger. Also, I grew up in an alcoholic home, so I’ve seen someone drinking at their worst, and I’ve also seen them at their best. I know firsthand how easy it is for a kid to get hurt in those circumstances.
Not that I hate alcohol or something because of my experiences, because I don’t. I just don’t find it appropriate for young (stressing YOUNG here) children to be around it.
OK, I still get what you’re saying, and I still stand by what I said. It’s completely outside *my *realm of experience to *not *invite children to a dinner party, barbeque or picnic simply because large quantities of beer are served. Not everyone is drinking, the kids are gathered in a group playing, and someone’s always watching out for them.
In my social circles, when we do stuff, the kids are there. They may be in another room, or in the basement, but 98% of the time, there are kids at any party, alcohol or not. (To bring it on topic, if kids aren’t invited, we’re all crystal clear about that, and there’s no hard feelings.) This was not true when I was in college, and I’m not saying I’d bring my kid to a frat party, but now that we’re 30somethings with kids, it’s all good. No one has ever come close to getting “beaned across the head by someone who had a little too much to drink”. I find that a bizarre consideration. If my friends were prone to beaning anyone over the head, I’d probably feel the same way you do.
I don’t mind my kids being around drunk people as long as there’s sober people there also. If anything, I find it’s taught my son the “evils” of alcohol, as he just goes :rolleyes: when Uncle Jonny starts giving his “I love you all, man!” speech, and he knows that it’s possible to not drink at all and have fun, drink in moderation like Mom, or be an embarrassing drunk like Uncle Jonny.
So you have your opinion, and I have mine, and isn’t it great we live in a country where we each get to raise our kids the way we want? (For the moment, anyway.) If I’m ever at your place with a 6-pack, I’ll get a babysitter, OK?
As for unique (which I qualified with “rather” and then changed to “or at least limited”), that’s true too. You’re the very first person I’ve ever heard articulate these feelings who wasn’t a teetotaller. That doesn’t mean that you’re the only one that has them, but I’d have to see some serious cites that yours is the majority opinion in the US, which seemed to be the conclusion Arnold Winkelried was beginning to draw.
