Is it rude to serve the well done steak eater a lesser cut?

[Esprise_Me]

@Cheesesteak

The concept here, to make it rather generic, is that the host wishes to spend additional money above and beyond a perfectly acceptable baseline, in order to give their guests an enhanced experience. One guest will arguably be unable to experience this enhancement, it doesn’t matter why or whose “fault” it is.

Is it reasonable to avoid spending extra for an enhancement that will not be experienced? I think at best the idea is a minefield where you’re likely to hurt someone’s feelings.

OTOH, if you have a $500 bottle of single malt, you’re on safe ground to say “I’m not mixing this with Coke for you”.

Yeah, I don’t really know enough about steak to answer the question. But I do know booze, and I do make choices between “totally drinkable” and “truly excellent” beer, wine, and liquor, depending on whether I’m serving it straight or in a shandy, sangria, or cocktail. I never use the crappy stuff, but no, I’m not going to make a spritzer with a $100 bottle of wine, or a frozen strawberry margarita with the añejo tequila I brought back from Mexico that’s not available for purchase here. I think it would be rude of my guests to expect me to. So there’s some gray area between “serving one guest crap because you disapprove of the way they prefer to enjoy it” (rude) and “saving the very best stuff for when you can serve it at its best” (so far from rude it would be rude to object to it.)

So with my lack of expertise, if I’m buying steaks, I’ll just get everyone the same to be safe, no matter how they want it. But I will need to see hard evidence if anyone’s claiming they can tell the difference between Skyy and Grey Goose in a Cape Cod.

[DrDeth]

@Joey_P

I never understood these types of comments. Someone likes food prepared in a different way so you act disgusted or go out of your way to make it taste bad? Why?
Who cares how someone else likes their food?

The idea of getting some expensive cuts of steak is that they are well marbled. But all that goes away if you cook them well done.

If you have someone that likes Bud Lite, do you get them craft IPAs?

@Joey_P

I have two friends that like their burgers really, really well done. I usually just put all the burgers on the grill, pull all but two of them off and let them finishing cooking theirs to the doneness that they prefer.

Yes, and with burgers it doesn’t matter that much. You are not buying a special type of expensive meat that ruins that expensive sort if well done.

@AlsoNamedBort

I really have to quibble with a lot of comments here implying that doing a choice ribeye vs prime is some great act of cooking malfeasance. Choice is great. It’s just slightly less marbling. I usually buy choice unless I’m just making a steak for myself.

Right, and the marbling goes away when well done.

@Jackmannii

As always with these kinds of debates, you have to wonder why some rare steak devotees get so obsessed with the choices of others who prefer a longer cooking time. I certainly don’t care what level of doneness people want.

We are not. It is just useless to get a well marbled cut and cook it well done.

@Johnny_Bravo

He’s making the exact same point you were. He’s saying that somebody who equates well-done steak with inedible food doesn’t know how to cook, and that well-done is perfectly a valid choice.

No, he was saying he doesn’t understand the concept of hyperbole.

@Esprise_Me

But I will need to see hard evidence if anyone’s claiming they can tell the difference between Skyy and Grey Goose in a Cape Cod.

Since Grey Goose is all hype and usually tests worse that Smirnoff, I would say you were wasting your $$ on it. Sorry.

@Cheesesteak

OTOH, if you have a $500 bottle of single malt, you’re on safe ground to say “I’m not mixing this with Coke for you”.

I have both aged expensive rum, and quite decent Bacardi. Even for myself, a Rum & Coke is with the Bacardi.

[Joey_P]

@DrDeth

If you have someone that likes Bud Lite, do you get them craft IPAs?

That’s not really the same thing since you’re talking about two different beers. There’s nothing wrong with saying “John prefers hamburgers, so I’m not going to get a steak for him”. In fact, in your example, if you have someone that prefers Bud Lite over an IPA, then by all means, pick up some Bud Lite for the party.
OTOH, it would be a jerk move (IMO) to say “John adds ice to his beer so I’m not letting him drink my IPA, I’ll pick up some Bud Lite for him”, without considering that maybe he likes IPAs with ice.

Just because someone prefers their steak cooked more than you, doesn’t mean they’re wrong and doesn’t mean they deserve something of lesser quality than what everyone else is being served.

@DrDeth

Yes, and with burgers it doesn’t matter that much. You are not buying a special type of expensive meat that ruins that expensive sort if well done.

You do realize that was just an example, right? One of those two people I mentioned also likes hot dogs grilled to the point that they explode (pop? rupture? split?) and start to get a bit charred. Do you get high quality hot dogs for the group and some cheap ones for her?

Let’s look at this from a different angle. You’re having a bunch of people over for steaks. One of them likes prefers their steak well done. Would you be willing to call them up on the phone and say “I know you like your steak well done, do you mind if I pick up cheaper one for you?”.
Whether they’re okay with that or not is irrelevant. The question I’m asking is if you’d be willing to come right out and tell the person that, because they like their steak well done, you plan to get them one of lesser quality. If you would feel rude or awkward doing that, then you know the answer to the OP.
It’s worth noting that the OP was concerned the person’s feelings would be hurt ‘should she find out’. I’m inferring from that statement that the OP wasn’t planning to tell her…why not?

[Esprise_Me]

@DrDeth

Since Grey Goose is all hype and usually tests worse that Smirnoff, I would say you were wasting your $$ on it. Sorry

Nah, I’ve actually done blind taste tests, and when it’s unmixed, I can tell. It’s more of a texture than a taste.

[DrDeth]

@Joey_P

You’re having a bunch of people over for steaks. One of them likes prefers their steak well done. Would you be willing to call them up on the phone and say “I know you like your steak well done, do you mind if I pick up cheaper one for you?”.

I’d say- “I got you a less fatty cut, as that comes out better well done”.

@Joey_P

One of those two people I mentioned also likes hot dogs grilled to the point that they explode (pop? rupture? split?) and start to get a bit charred. Do you get high quality hot dogs for the group and some cheap ones for her?

Hot dogs are also different. The higher quality ones generally have less fat, and better meat, so yes, there is still a quality different when well done.

@Esprise_Me

Nah, I’ve actually done blind taste tests, and when it’s unmixed, I can tell. It’s more of a texture than a taste.

This Blind Vodka Taste-Test Changed The Way I Drink — & Saved Me So Much $$$

The results? Vodka A, voted the cheapest, turned out to be Grey Goose. Vodka C was Titos (spot on for a mid-range guess). And — drumroll, please — Vodka B, voted the most expensive, was Smirnoff. I was shocked.

Does Premium Vodka's Taste Live Up to Its Price Tag?

Freeland described it as “kind of thick and not smooth at all. Something I would never ever buy.” Kay called it her “least favorite one, for sure.”

Finally, the moment of truth. Klemm revealed that vodka No. 1 – the group’s least favorite – was Grey Goose. Everyone was flabbergasted.

“No way!!!” said Freeland.

“I can’t believe that!” exclaimed Kay. “I mean I’m really very loyal to it. And I just totally dismissed it.”

“I’m shocked,” said Gliksman. “I really am shocked, because it was bad.”

Those test do not mean that you might not prefer it. Everyone’s tastes differ,

But many blind taste tests have shown Grey Goose is hype. Cool bottle tho.

[Rejutka_Lupex]

I’m curious - has anyone (here or elsewhere) ever really compared different cuts of well-done steak?
I’m not talking theoretically, or “everyone knows”.

I mean a real test, trying to be objective instead of snobbish (i.e. go in with an open mind, not already knowing what your answer will be). Two cuts of beef, one with more, one with less marbling, both done well (both in the sense of cooked thoroughly and cooked with skill).

It’d be interesting to know how many are eating steaks rare because “it’s the way it’s done” and never even tried anything else. Maybe more people would like it well-done, if the social stigmata (like that obnoxious waiter upthread) weren’t.

Even if most of the fat runs out, some will remain - and in wagyu I’d bet it changes the taste, so that there would be a noticable difference to non-wagyu.

[thorny_locust]

I don’t understand this theory that every bit of the fat disappears just because the meat is cooked until the pink disappears. I could understand it if people are using “well done” to mean “cooked until it’s dry and hard”; but I don’t think people who want it well done usually mean that by it.

If I get distracted and misjudge my timing and my medium steak gets well done, there’s definitely still fat in it.

[k9bfriender]

@Rejutka_Lupex

I’m curious - has anyone (here or elsewhere) ever really compared different cuts of well-done steak?
I’m not talking theoretically, or “everyone knows”

Yes, I have. I’ve worked in high end restaurants, as well as attended culinary school, where we have done almost exactly that, as it is important as a chef to know how everything will taste no matter how it is prepared.

And there is a slight difference in texture between a prime cut of meat and a choice cut of meat when cooked to well done. Not much, and you’d probably have to be a bit of a culinarian or foody to be able to tell the difference, but it does exist.

If the two cuts of meat are rare to medium, the difference is dramatic. The prime melts in your mouth in a way that the choice will not.

Of course, if you put ketchup on any of it, it completely overpowers any flavor of the meat.

@Rejutka_Lupex

It’d be interesting to know how many are eating steaks rare because “it’s the way it’s done” and never even tried anything else. Maybe more people would like it well-done, if the social stigmata (like that obnoxious waiter upthread) weren’t.

I doubt it. No matter how “snobby” a steak eater, at some point in their life, they have had a steak done more than how they like it. A person who prefers their steak rare has had plenty of opportunity to try other ways of cooking it.

OTOH, someone who will only eat their steak well done will have never tried it rare, and will send it back if they see the slightest hint of pink.

@Rejutka_Lupex

Even if most of the fat runs out, some will remain - and in wagyu I’d bet it changes the taste, so that there would be a noticable difference to non-wagyu.

Never actually had wagyu, as that’s a bit above my price range, but the whole point of well done is that the fat been melted and most has left the steak, if much remains, it’s not well done. The tenderness of the meat, one of the big selling points, is ruined by the cooking process, leaving it chewy rather than succulent.

I would not offer wagyu meat if I was having a shindig and I knew that there was anyone who would want it well done.

[k9bfriender]

@thorny_locust

I don’t understand this theory that every bit of the fat disappears just because the meat is cooked until the pink disappears. I could understand it if people are using “well done” to mean “cooked until it’s dry and hard”; but I don’t think people who want it well done usually mean that by it.

Every bit? No. But the vast majority? Yes.

Fat melts, then runs out of the steak on to the grill.

That doesn’t mean that it’s dry and hard, but it does mean that it is much chewier and dryer.

[Joey_P]

@DrDeth

@Joey_P

You’re having a bunch of people over for steaks. One of them likes prefers their steak well done. Would you be willing to call them up on the phone and say “I know you like your steak well done, do you mind if I pick up cheaper one for you?”.

I’d say- “I got you a less fatty cut, as that comes out better well done”.

@Joey_P

One of those two people I mentioned also likes hot dogs grilled to the point that they explode (pop? rupture? split?) and start to get a bit charred. Do you get high quality hot dogs for the group and some cheap ones for her?

Hot dogs are also different. The higher quality ones generally have less fat, and better meat, so yes, there is still a quality different when well done.

Since you keep moving the goal posts, erecting straw men and not grasping how an example can be used to illustrate a point without it being a direct, one to one comparison, I’m not sure I see much reason to continue down this road with you. There’s an interesting debate to be had, but this isn’t it.

[Esprise_Me]

@DrDeth

Those test do not mean that you might not prefer it. Everyone’s tastes differ,

But many blind taste tests have shown Grey Goose is hype. Cool bottle tho.

Your insistence on this point is baffling. You acknowledge the subjectivity of taste, you don’t dispute my claim to have chosen Grey Goose in a blind taste test, and I never argued with you about your assertion that some people don’t like it. What do you think you’re proving?

[ftg]

The display given here of people with the attitude that “raw = God’s way, the rest of you are sinners who deserve to be punished” is scary.

Look. It’s personal preference. Period. You don’t get to tell me how I want my food done. Not one bit. My choice is in no way at all inferior in any way. So a chef picking the worst cuts for people who like meat cooked is just a major jerk.

Any argument about “But with over (?) cooking you lose out on …” is intrinsically flawed. Personal choice doesn’t work that way. A person gets to chose what they want to gain or ignore. Not you.

The flaws in “logic” are in high display here.

[k9bfriender]

What’s really scary is the passive aggressive hyperbolic misrepresentations of what was actually said.

[pulykamell]

@ftg

So a chef picking the worst cuts for people who like meat cooked is just a major jerk.

In a pragmatic manner, somebody has to get the “worst” cut, although “worst” among a set of prime meats is not going to make much difference. I personally would probably choose the prime steak that seems not quite as well marbled as the rest, but it’s all prime, so they’ll be pretty close to one another. I’ve definitely had choice steaks with marbling that looks damned close to prime. Some butchers will call this choice plus. I will serve that to the people who like their steak at lower levels of doneness. But they will all get the same grade meat. I have to make some decisions when grilling.

[Joey_P]

But the OP isn’t talking about picking up a bunch of [the same quality] steaks and choosing the ‘worst’ one for the person that wants theirs well done. They’re talking about going to the store with the specific intention of picking a ‘lesser cut’ for that person.
To me, that reads like punishing someone for wanting their steak cooked in a way the host considers to be wrong.

[Galactus]

I’ve had steak at every level of doneness, and I find the rarer end of the spectrum way more flavorful and tender.

The people I know who prefer well done say it’s because they find the uncooked-ness of it distasteful. They always joke about my steak mooing.

https://memegenerator.net/img/instances/34181156/we-likes-it-raw-and-wriggly.jpg

[Galactus]

@Joey_P

They’re talking about going to the store with the specific intention of picking a ‘lesser cut’ for that person.

The point as I understood it is that the better cut of meat will taste exactly the same as the lesser cooked well done. So it would be a waste of money to get them the prime cut.

[DrDeth]

@Rejutka_Lupex

I mean a real test, trying to be objective instead of snobbish (i.e. go in with an open mind, not already knowing what your answer will be). Two cuts of beef, one with more, one with less marbling, both done well (both in the sense of cooked thoroughly and cooked with skill).

Well, yes. We had a big steak cook out, with rib steaks, t-bones and sirloins. The cooks (including me) picked the sirloins for the well done crowd, but most were medium rare (my fave), with one sirloin ending up well done, and one rib blood rare. So we got to try a sirloin, a t-bone and a rib all medium rare. There wasn’t a huge difference between rib & t-bone, which is not surprising. There was a vast difference with the sirloin- which was still tasty mind you, but not as tender and not as tasty as the others.

Between prime and choice? Not that much in taste, but the Choice is more tender, on the average.

@Joey_P

Since you keep moving the goal posts, erecting straw men and not grasping how an example can be used to illustrate a point without it being a direct, one to one comparison,

“How about hot dogs?” “Reasoned reply” GOALPOST!!!< STRAWMEN!!!

[Joey_P]

@Galactus

The point as I understood it is that the better cut of meat will taste exactly the same as the lesser cooked well done. So it would be a waste of money to get them the prime cut.

I think an argument could be made that if the OP felt that way, insulting their guest wouldn’t have crossed their mind. Just like I wouldn’t give a second thought to buying Ketel One for the people drinking it straight and Fleischmann’s for the people making blue raspberry blended margaritas.

[kayaker]

@Esprise_Me

I’ve actually done blind taste tests, and when it’s unmixed, I can tell. It’s more of a texture than a taste.

I’ve done Grey Goose, Belvedere, and Nikolai blind taste test and ID’d accurately after a sip of each