** Thudlow Boink** You’re welcome to your opinion. However if I need that $20 spark plug to get my car to run, so I don’t lose my job and you knowing this; forbid me from purchasing that spark plug and instead demand I buy a $20.00 dinner… well have different opinions on what if means to give a gift.
What Gangster Octopus said. You can always say no.
I just remembered a nasty little event in my life along these lines. 15 years ago my girlfriend at the time was given money to go to college by her Catholic Priest uncle. She used the money to buy a few sheets of high-grade LSD (window pane?). I broke up with her over that (final straw, lots of other stuff had been happening). Are some of you saying that she had every right to do with that money as she chose? Her Priest uncle didn’t make a lot of money…that represented a big gift from him. And she bought drugs - albeit, I think, she meant to sell them to make more money, but I can’t really see that as being more moral.
Again, if you accept the gift as given, then I think you have made an implicit contract to respect the wishes of the giver. You can always say no or try to re-negotiate. But your acceptance of the money at the time it is given should be bound by the conditions set by the giver. “Hear is $X for Y.” “OK, thanks.” You are now obligated to pay for Y since you accepted the money to pay for Y. If you know you are not going to buy Y, then I think you should discuss it before you take the money (if before) or offer to return it unless the giver approves your new decision (if after).
In fact, put that way, isn’t there a legal recourse in some places? The returning of engagement rings when the wedding is called off comes to mind…I think there is legal precedent that the woman must return it (in some jurisdictions) if asked.
-Tcat
How about they take you to a $20 per person dinner and pay, knowing you need a $20 spark plug? Is that not a gift either? I think I’m seeing an unjustified feeling of entitlement here …
Though, it’s not like Thudlow is taking money from you or preventing you from spending your own $20 on spark plugs. He’s offering you something that you would not ordinarily have, just not the something you most want/need. Why is that so wrong?
Part of the concept of a gift is to get the person something they would not ordinarily get for themselves. This isn’t even close to universal, of course, but many, many gifts fall under this idea.
Lissa, I think you did right by your grandfather. His goal was to help you financially by reducing your debt. Your more intimate knowledge of your finances allowed you to use his money in a more efficient way than just paying off student loans.
How about, how about…? We can spend all day with different scenarios. This is MY take on gift giving…you’re welcome to your own. I give a gift freely and with no strings. I offer you $20.00, it’s yours to do with as you please. I will not dictate how you spend it. I will not have a problem if you spend it differently than I would. It’s yours.
We could. In fact, since the forum is entitled Great Debates, we probably should 
This is particularly true since I had the impression you felt giving cash with conditions was a form of blackmail, and was curious to see if you would consider any gift giving that wasn’t the item needed the most as blackmail.
I think she was simply applying the lessons of the parable of the talents:
Just sustitute “LSD” for “talents” in that story and you’ll see that she was just being a good Christian.
I would consider it a form of blackmail, if terms are part of gift-giving or no gift. In other words, you offer me $20, but only if you can use it to buy me dinner. That’s different than saying let’s go out to dinner; the amount if it’s a gift, shouldn’t come up.
However I would have to question how much you know or care about me, if you spent $20.00 on a meal for me, when you know I needed $20 for spark plugs in order to keep my job…which is different than a having a $20.00 meal ticket, valid for just that place.
Of course, I don’t have to take it; but why offer something to someone who can’t use it?
This is not about giving. It isn’t about gratitude, and it isn’t about courtesy. It’s about control. It’s about making decisions for other people, and it implies a not at all subtle message that you disapprove of the choices the person receiving the “gift” is making in their life.
I think the proper answer is “No thank you, we really cannot afford a free vacation at this time.” That’s because saying, “Take your advice, and wrap it in your money, and shove them both up your ass.” would be rude. Never be rude unnecessarily. If the offer is repeated, the assessment on necessity might change.
Tris
“Cabbage: A familiar kitchen-garden vegetable about as large and wise as a man’s head.” ~ Ambrose Bierce ~
So from what most people are saying here, giving gift certificates is bad if not blackmail !! After all a gift certificate dictates where the money can and cannot be spent.
Funny how 6 months ago, many dopers were advising that gift certificates are a better preasent than cash, since they show the giver thought about what the receiver would want. Or funny how recently people have complained about how Mother Terese used much of the money donated to her charity to build Mission churches rather than to heal the sick.
Sounds like you learned the wrong lesson from this life event.
The moral of the story is to be a better judge of people. That a gift to an ungrateful person can be a bad thing. It could end up being a curse. It could be that you are being an enabler.
Instead the lesson you have learned is that people can burn you, so treat everyone as if they are ungrateful.
I think Triskademus is right. It is about control. I think you are more concerned about being taken advantage of, than bringing joy into someone’s life by giving them a gift.
Often, the strings attached are hardly unfair.
For example, if I know someone with a broken down Ford truck that needs a new transmission, it’s entirely reasonable for me to offer a gift that’s earmarked for that purpose. If this person chooses to spend the money on booze instead, that would be a violation of my trust.
Are there strings attached to my gift? Certainly. Are they reasonable? I think so.
If you don’t know your friend’s going to spend the money on booze, then you have no business giving him the money. My point has been, that you need to know the people you are giving certain types of gifts to and then give them freely.
If you want the money spent on a tranny, then buy him the tranny. Don’t tell him if he doesn’t buy a tranny, he can’t have the money. Just buy the freaking tranny and give it him.
Why is that so hard to do?
Dude, you REALLY lost me on that one. I treat everyone as ungrateful? Huh? :dubious:
Some people react poorly to a tranny surprise.
d&r
I’m saying that if you put conditions on all your gifts, so that they dont take advantage of you, aren’t you in effect treating everyone as if they will act like your ex?
The kind of funny thing is that no one is talking about an actual case, this was all premised off of a hypothtical meant really to ask people how they would vacation if money were not an object. I love how some of the arguments have evolved into along the lines, “I need a kidney transplant and you expect me to use this money on a Segway???”
No,
As was said, the receiver can always turn down the gift. If the gift is given “so you can go on the honeymoon of your dreams” its wrong to use it for a mortgage on the house (and don’t be surprised if you never get another gift from me). Of course, if you thanked me profusely and then said that you “really needed the money for a downpayment and would I mind” I’d tell you to buy a house and appreciate how responsible you were. And if you then bought lots of LSD (!) you’d never get another gift from me.
You’re saying that if I don’t know for sure that he’s going to spend the money on booze, then I had better act as though it’s not a valid concern?
That makes no sense whatsoever.
I guess it doesn’t matter how desperately his family is depending on him, right? It doesn’t matter if his children are on the verge of starvation? After all, if I have to choose between (a) soliciting a promise that he’ll buy a new transmission and (B) letting his family starve, then I had better choose starvation for his young 'uns. After all, the freedom to spend money freely trumps all other considerations, right?
Pardon me for disagreeing.
OK, I think I understand what you are trying to say, but, please remove the personal aspect from it. I never said I put conditions on my gifts, I don’t believe I have ever brought the term ‘taking advantage of’ into any of my arguments and really, saying that my ex controls my life 15 years after the fact gives her much more credit than she deserves! 
I, of all people here, have probably been the closest to these arguments in reality. My wedding happened 2 months before we moved to Prague from Colorado. When people asked where we were registered, I said “Wells Fargo account #12345, tell me what you want me to buy with your money and I will.”
See, getting a toaster that only works on 110 volts was useless. shipping silverware? No way. Any of a 100 traditional gifts would have been useless or too expensive to ship overseas. Not one person that gave us cash actually took us up on the offer to buy what they wanted once in Prague. All of them said it was the easiest wedding gift they ever had to buy. A handful went and bought us traditional wedding gifts, and frankly, I think they are still sitting in their boxes at my mom’s house. I’ve never been able to transport a porcelan fruit bowl over 2 feet across in the last 8 years. So I understand the issue of need and cash - those ‘gifts’ helped us establish a new life here and mainly went to rent for the first 6 months while we looked for jobs. For that we are forever grateful. But, if every single one had dictated what they wanted us to buy with their donation, we would have respected that.
-Tcat