As I understand it, Jews believe that a Gentile does NOT need to follow the Jewish law to get to heaven, but must only follow the seven Noahic laws. That means that a Gentile, even if he believes that the Jewish scriptures are God’s own absolute truth, doesn’t need to become a Jew to follow this belief. Yet, despite this, people do convert to the Jewish religion. My question is, why? Why would a person who’s not obligated by God to follow Jewish law want to take on that obligation for nothing in return? For that matter, why would the Jewish religion WANT converts in the first place?
Lately, the answer to this question is “so she can marry a nice Jewish boy and make sure that their kids are Jewish, alleviating a possible massive coronary in the aforementioned NJB’s mother.”
I agree that conversion to marry a Jew is a valid reason, since Jews are forbidden to marry non-Jews strictly according to Jewish law. But are there any OTHER reasons to convert?
Well, Jews are not proselytisers, meaning: they don’t recruit (ever have a Jew knock on your door, holding up a Torah? Didn’t think so).
So, basically, converting isn’t a list of priorities for Judaism – they don’t want you unless you really want them.
[Note: I’m just bumping this thread so the usual suspects, zev and David, etc., see this in the morning.]
[In other words: I’m probably wrong.]
A friend of mine is in the process of converting, and she says that far from trying to convert people, Jews will discourage people from converting unless they are really serious.
One reason to convert is becauswe of the ceremony. While any old schmuck can go get communion, in order to participate in many of the Jewish rites and rituals, one has to be Jewish by blood or by conversion.
Yer pal,
Satan
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To get a job in Hollywood, Music industry, Clothing industry
etc. etc…
ricksummon:
The answer lies in your mistaken premise. There is something in return: a greater degree of closeness to G-d. Or, to put it another way, a “higher level” in heaven, so to speak. Jews don’t believe that all non-Jews are doomed to eternal torment and suffering, but they certainly believe that the more obligations one has and fulfills correctly, the greater reward one gets.
Reminds me of an Archie Bunker quote. He says this to Edith about Stephanie (before the episode when it was revealed she was Jewish)
Archie) Edith don’t let her spend the weekend at the O’Brien’s; those people will be dragging her off to church. Let her stay with the Shapiro’s. That’s the one good thing about the Jews, they don’t want you.
Why do people convert to any religion? I’ve known a few people who converted to Judaism on their own (that is, not because they were getting married), but it is generally considered rude to remind a convert that they weren’t born Jewish. In one case, though, the topic came up with an acquaintance, so I very politely asked her why she had decided to convert. She was raised nominally Catholic, with no Jewish background. Her answer was that she felt like she was looking for a spiritual home, and when she read about Judaism, it all seemed to make sense. She knew that was where she belonged. For her, it wasn’t enough just to be a good Gentile and follow the Noahide laws, she wanted to be Jewish. I imagine that this is the same motivation for most people who convert to any religion - being an accepted outsider is just not enough. FTR, this girl had not yet begun the conversion process when I knew her, and she was one of the most religious people I knew.
There is a midrash that all converts to Judaism are, way, way, way back there in family history, Jewish. So they aren’t really strangers, but old family coming home.
{shrug}
Some people are joiners, what can you say?
I’M still tryin’ to figure out the rationale for the Kiwanis.
Don’t forget, Jews are the chosen ones. Do you really think that it’s easy to invite someone to be chosen by God? If it were, wouldn’t everyone convert? What’s really baffling is why would anyone convert AWAY from Judiasm?
Answer: Because they believe in the tenents of the Jewish faith.
As I mentioned before on this thread, my former roommate, now a Conservative rabbi, is a convert to Judaism. (In case anyone’s wondering, his conversion process was overseen by an Orthodox rabbi, so he’s a Jew by anyone’s standards.)
To summarize his conversion experience, but to leave out the emotional elements, which aren’t mine to reveal, he was a deeply spiritual person, dedicated to G-d and desiring to serve his community, who had a slight problem … he didn’t believe in the divinity of JC. He underwent a spiritual crisis which ended in his leaving the faith of his birth, then embarked on an intense period of study of the Jewish faith. At the end of this period, he came to the conclusion that the Jewish faith was what he believed in, and started the conversion process.
Getting into Heaven isn’t the only purpose to a religion. (To my understanding, the existence of Heaven is not universally accepted in Judaism anyway.) The work to be done on this planet is also pretty important.
Sua
Montfort wrote:
Montfort, the image that this placed in my mind had me LOL. Thanks for a good laugh to start my day.
However, Jews do proselytize to some extent - to other Jews, that they don’t consider as being religious enough. Ever seen the “Mitzvah tanks” in NYC? They have Orthodox Jews accosting people on the street asking them if they’re Jewish.
DNFTT
Zev Steinhardt
Also, I wouldn’t say that Jews are totally against proselytizing. When I was going through my spiritual awakening several months back, a Jewish person on this board sent me information about a group which goes around the country and looks for people like me: Jewish by blood but non-practicing.
This group - can’t remember the name of it - will then go about trying to get the out-of-practice Jews to start practicing again.
While they are definitely more discriminating than, say, the Mormon missionaries (if you ain’t a Jew by blood, they ain’t gonna try and get you to convert), this IS a form of proselytizing, though my guess is that the group would say it is merely reinforcing it’s religion upon the people who should be practicing it anyway.
Overall, the more I look into the Jewish faith, the more I like about it. Makes me glad to be a Jew! 
Yer pal,
Satan
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My usual response: “Baby, I ain’t even MONOTHEISTIC!”
Montfort, you ever try carrying around one of those things? They get pretty heavy after a few minutes. This might explain why fundies always work in pairs.
Why would people convert? The Jews do not believe that Jesus Christ is the savior. If you die a Christian not believing, you won’t be saved. Not so for the Jews.
The Jews are the chosen people. This doesn’t mean we’re special, exactly, merely that we were chosen above all others to obey God’s laws and follow the commandments. If you too want to be “chosen” you’ll convert.
The Jewish religion doesn’t recruit because they don’t want those who don’t come to them. You ask to convert and you will be denied twice. You must ask them three times of your own volition before they accept. Most rabbis won’t even grant requests for reasons of marriage. You must come because you yourself want to become a Jew, not your fiance.
Once you are converted, however, you are not a convert. You are a Jew. :j
Funny story - my former roommate, mentioned above, didn’t have a full appreciation of the conversion process when he started. He went to a rabbi in the chaplaincy at our college and said he wanted to convert, and the rabbi (metaphorically) threw him out. This rabbi had a reputation for being a bit crotchety, so my roomie figured he caught him in a bad mood, and decided to go to another rabbi on campus. The second rabbi was a bit too gentle with my roommate, and the message my roommate got was “think about it some more”, rather than “no.” A few days later, my roomie went back to see the second rabbi. He wasn’t available, but he ran into a third rabbi. He mentioned to the third rabbi his meetings with the other two, and the third rabbi started him on his way. It wasn’t until after the fact that Roomie realized he had been rejected twice.
Sua
The point of Christianity is to be “saved”, i.e. to guarantee one’s entry into heaven. That’s why Baptist churches have calls for salvation every service.
The point of Judaism is to obey G-d, with a hoped-for side effect of entry into heaven (if you believe in heaven). The Jewish perspective is, to paraphrase JFK, “Ask not what G-d can do for you, ask what you can do for G-d”.
If someone finds the idea of living by a high ethical code appealling, and they’re not looking for a reward in the afterlife, then perhaps conversion to Judaism is for them.