If you look across other threads, I think you’ll find several other people who said they thought it was Islamic terrorism, and you’ll find nobody who was ripped to shreds or called a racist. Granted that’s a lot of threads and a lot of places to look.
True, I did not post in this or any of the other threads on this board about my suspicions. Generally I pop in to SDMB, take a look at a couple threads near the top of the list, occasionally post and then pop back out. Maybe I should have put on my Encyclopedia Brown hat and put in my two cents earlier.
Could they really “just be a couple of messed up kids”? Maybe. But those are the kinds of people terrorists like to get a hold of. “Things not going your way, disillusioned with the world? Join our terrorist group! We’ll help you teach the US/Israel/abortionists/meat-eaters/Catholics a lesson they’ll never forget!”
I agree that Muslim terrorist /= Al Queda. There’s Hamas, Hezbollah, Islamic Jihad Movement in Palestine, Fatah al-Islam, Jaish-e-Mohammed (tied to the Daniel Pearl murder) and, of course, the Cechen Caucasus Emirate just to name a few. However, there has been some evidence that AQ has provided training in Chechnya to the separatists. I looked at what was presented, added up 1+1 and got 2. Some people on this board add 1+1 and get potato.
hmm. “…appears to have been sympathetic to Islamist radicalism.”
Who would have guessed it. Certainly not the guy from salon.com that hoped it would be a right wing nutcase
http://news.yahoo.com/brothers-tsarnaev-clues-motives-alleged-boston-bombers-162101446.html
I think Leaffan’s point was that Muslim insane criminals =/= terrorist.
Dylan Klebold and that other kid weren’t terrorists. The idiot in the ‘Batman’ theater wasn’t a terrorist. The guy at Newtown wasn’t a terrorist. They were just fucked in the head.
If these guys meant to spread terror to further a political or religious cause, they’ve done a piss-poor job of it. What are their demands? What do they want the evil Americans to do? Create a Muslim state in Chechnya or something?
ETA: I’m not saying they aren’t terrorists. But finding out they’re Muslim isn’t the smoking gun that it’s terrorism.
Agreed. Columbine, Newtown and Aurora weren’t terrorist acts. They were mass murderers. Adam Lanza could be considered a spree killer because he killed his mother then went to the school, fitting the definition of killings in multiple locations without a “cooling off” period.
Now Nidal Hasan, on the other hand, while he could be considered just a mass murderer, actually is a terrorist. Why? His communications with Anwar al-Awlaki, statements from several associates expressing concern about his increasingly radical view of Islam and anti-US military statements and, of course, his shouting out “Allahu Akbar” as he was shooting people. He was promoting a viewpoint against the Army in particular but in general against the government that was sending Muslims to kill other Muslims.
And, again, just being a Muslim doesn’t make you a terrorist any more than all terrorists are Muslims. You just have to look at Ireland’s bloody history. Or the Environmental Liberation Front for that matter. And a crazy Muslim who kills on his own is not a terrorist. Fathers who kill their daughters in so-called “honor killings” aren’t terrorists. Messed in the head with a warped view of what’s right and wrong, maybe, but not terrorists.
What was the statement these two were trying to make when they bombed the marathon? Who knows? They themselves might not be the ones with the statement to make or if they had one, it was one that had been drummed into their heads by their handlers. They most likely were directed to do it on behalf of some organization with an axe to grind. Remember, the 9/11 hijackers weren’t the brains to the operation. They were the guidance system, flying suicide bombers. They had to be a little smarter than the average schmuck who straps some TNT to his chest because they had to be able to steer a plane. That didn’t make them strategic geniuses.
Why haven’t their handlers taken credit for the bombing, or issued a statement, or said anything whatsoever about their justified attack on the Infidels?
I’m still thinking this isn’t a coordinated terrorist attack by a Muslim terrorist group.
That it may not be a “coordinated terrorist attack by a Muslim terrorist group” is in a way even more telling and disconcerting. The Ft. Hood attack also was not a coordinated one.
Remember, Al-Queda only hinted of their involvement in 9/11 in October, 2001 and bin Laden didn’t directly acknowledge his involvement until 2004. Give them time.
Unless these two took it upon themselves to do this (I think that’s unlikely) the claim for responsibility should come in the next couple weeks. If these two did plan this on their own, a journal or at least a note will be found in their belongings describing their list of grievances against the US.
I’m surprised that these two guys didn’t seem to have any decent plans for their get-away phase.
Was the bombing sophisticated? A lot of the 24hour news channels on Monday (that I watched) were marveling about how the second bomb may have been set to catch the people fleeing from the first blast (even though it didn’t), and had the hallmarks of someone with training in this type of stuff.
If I was on an undeclared war with my neighbors, I would make plans about the getaway. But if these two were coached into doing this deed by some mysterious Dr. No from afar, whoever was doing the coaching wouldn’t care if these two pawns got caught.
With what little I’ve gleaned from the news so far, the best comparison I can think of is to the DC snipers. It sounds like an angry kook who’s managed to recruit an accomplice who places personal loyalty over morality. The political motivations are likely secondary to dissatisfaction with the circumstances of his life and general hatred of a society he feels alienated from. I won’t be surprised to find out that “black hat’s” girlfriend recently dumped him. If that’s the case, it’s not any kind of Islamist terrorism I’m familiar with.
I think they underestimated the power of police work and simply thought they wouldn’t be caught.
“Stroll anonymously through the crowd, put a backpack down and stroll anonymously away. How will they ever find out it was us?”
Is anyone else a little disappointed it wasn’t the North Koreans?
Bingo. Crowd of thousands, many of them with bags or backpacks, they figured they could slip in and out.
When Reddit et al started scanning photos and posting suspicious people and things these guys realized they had to get the hell out of there. They were smart enough to not head for the airport or bus/train terminals and also not to use credit cards but they still needed cash and a way to get away. Rob a 7-11 for some quick cash and carjack some poor guy.
Why didn’t they kill him as well? I don’t know. Anyone know what the carjack victim’s name is? It would be interesting if we found out that he was Muslim and they felt guilty enough to not hurt him.
It’s possible they did this by themselves and it’s possible they were advised or trained by other people. The investigators aren’t ruling anything out and there are indications the older brother traveled overseas, and since we know that bombs similar to these have been used by terrorists before, it’s possible he got help.
Some of the options are not mutually exclusive. The whole idea behind the “lone wolf” terrorism thing (and I’m sick of the phrase already) is that you have people who - here’s an even more annoying term I feel like I’ve heard a million times today - “self-radicalize” and get in touch with people who have training or know-how over the internet and through other means. That’s pretty much what the Fort Hood shooter did. The older brother may have gone that route.
My guess is that the Feds will get grief for releasing the pictures yesterday. I can believe that once the pictures went public the brothers got desperate and threw out all caution and basically went on a rampage. I’m sure there will be people who will say it wouldn’t have happened if the pictures weren’t released.
I think this was exactly the point of putting out the pictures–to put pressure on them, and flush them out one way or another. Also, perhaps, to get past the amateur public sleuthing which was using fragmentary data and had the risk of setting off a vigilante action.
I hear ya, but what was their option? Sure you can put out an APB and put their pictures up in the post office but getting their faces out to the general public was the quickest way to find them. America’s Most Wanted isn’t on the air anymore. They needed to cast the widest net in the shortest amount of time. The cops and feds knew these guys were dangerous but they had to be stopped before they either blew up another bomb or else they escaped, most likely to Canada (shortest route out of the country and crossing the border would be a breeze). The risk was the two feeling like they were being cornered and killing someone else, which is what they did.
I wonder if they were planning on stealing the security vehicle from the MIT cop but something went wrong. Maybe when they killed him they somehow damaged the car or else made too big a mess for them to feel they could get away in the car.
I totally agree that the decision to release the pictures was justifiable, especially after the NY Post published pictures of different guys. Not everybody is going to see it that way and right now lawyers are dreaming up lawsuits.
Releasing the pictures worked. They needed more information on these guys, and by releasing the pictures, they go it and put more pressure on them. I don’t know what else anyone thinks they could have done.
I wouldn’t be surprised, what with the availability of “low-jack” and “on star”, that a lot of police departments got GPS trackers in their vehicles (with all that expensive equipment inside) these days.