With regard to aspects like this, I’m curious, has it been confirmed how many seasons they’re going to make and up to what year? Sally’s now what, 11? So it would take at least two more seasons and realistically one or two more after that before a storyline like that could be written in. Or do people mean it’s a foreshadowing of her life rather than a future storyline?
On a completely superficial note…
Anyone else think that a touch of orange might help Joan’s apartment? (Damn, honey, are you renting an apartment in Yam Towers?)
I want to run screaming from those red walls. How can anyone live with red walls?? And I think they clash with her hair.
Was Grandma Pauline supposed to be caring for baby Gene? I think Betty had taken the baby with her. (the middle brother was at camp).
I think Ginsberg is smarter than people are giving him credit for. I think he knows how to play a fool and does it to get what he wants. He sold the campaign he wanted and bypassed Don. He dropped the Cinderella idea quickly when Don shut him down and only brought it up in front of the client. He wanted to pitch the idea from the beginning and he did it in a way where he was not directly defying Don. After the pitch when he was at the bar and Harry said “you almost got fired” and Ginsberg said “I don’t think so”, I think Ginsberg was right. Don was not thrilled by how the pitch went but he was not going to fire him, Don needed to put him in his place but that was it. I also think he also acted like a fool in his interview with Peggy so she would not be intimated by his creative work. Also, he was playing on her need to “help” the little guy. I guess time will tell if Ginsberg is an idiot or savant.
I’m sorry, but this is not plausible. Whether the legal definition of rape included what happened or not is one thing. (And, as I said before, they weren’t married, so I have doubts whether this would have been the case anyway.)
However, this is another thing. She was forced, she was obviously not happy with the situation, and she later said that this incident made Greg “not a good man.” 1965 was not some alien time when women didn’t realize that being forced against their will to have sex was something they shouldn’t have expected or had been unusual. And I suspect 1865 and 1765 wasn’t all that different either. Not in New York city, anyway.
The vultures here want Sally to have a messed-up future because of the way the adult world around her has been portrayed. Ain’t gonna happen. As Grandma Pauline showed, adults have been messing up their kids since that little kerfluffle between Cain and Abel. Kids grow up anyway. We’re all messed up and we’re all normal. Sally will be a kid when the series ends and grow up to live a life just like theirs, just like ours, and just like our kids’ and kids’ kids. Nothing new or different.
That’s the entire point of the series. Haven’t any of you been paying attention?
Made creepier by the fact that Speck knocked on the nurses door and when they answered, he was holding a knife (or a gun in some reports).
I really liked the episode except for the dream sequence which I thought was heavy handed.
Vultures?
Okay, Acsenray, two things:
(1) It’s within this show’s wheelhouse to depict hot adulterous sex, exploitive and coercive sex, perfunctory marital sex, and all the flavors in between. They aren’t always clearly labeled. They sure weren’t during that episode last season.
(2) I kind of resent your ongoing insinuation that you’re a better person than the people who don’t appreciate this TV show on precisely the same level you do, or that the people who disagree with you about the popular culture are morally deficient in some way. It sure didn’t begin with this thread.
I only just now saw the last five minutes (DVR issues) and found it quite implausible for Greg to just walk out so unemotionally, not even stopping to look at his son. The whole scene just seemed too emotionally shallow, and has me wondering why Joan ever married him to begin with. She had, after all, been around the block and knew her own worth as a person, rather than just as a helpmate or kept woman.
He was supposed to be a handsome, young NYC surgeon, and Joan was not yet fully valued at SDC until the very end of season four. She viewed herself as an aging head secretary.
I agree that they kind of put Greg on a bus a little too quickly. It was a little too quick and clean.
We aren’t talking about every single depiction of sex on the show. And I don’t know what you’re talking about that happened in an episode last season. We’ve been talking about the rape of Joan by Greg in Season 2. Finding ambiguity in that incident takes something like a willful effort at self-deception.
I don’t know what you’re talking about but I am of the understanding that personal problems go in the BBQ Pit. But I’ll say this much, I haven not implied that people who don’t understand that Joan was raped by Greg in the office in Season two are morally deficient. They are either confused or having a problem with perception. And it has nothing to do with enjoying the show on any particular “level,” but rather failing to grasp a “fact” that was presented on the show with zero ambiguity: Greg raped Joan. Joan knows it and the show knows it. Period. Whether Greg knows it is less clear, but since he seemed to accept Joan’s accusation “You were never a good man and you know what I’m talking about” I think it’s reasonable to assume that he knows it too.
She had an abortion and then immediately got pregnant again, soon enough for the baby to be born at full-term on the same schedule? First of all, I’m not even sure how soon after an abortion it’s plausible for a woman to become pregnant again — I assume there’s a period of recovery of at least a few weeks. Second, Roger isn’t that deluded.
Joan and Roger had a conversation in which she told Roger she was pregnant, and Joan said that Greg had been away too long for him to have been the father. Roger then told Joan that the decision was up to her but that “I can’t be its father,” meaning that he would not acknowledge paternity.
We may not have seen the last of him.
I’m okay with Greg’s easy departure. He and Joan weren’t married very long when he joined the military and he’s been gone for at least a year. He has a whole other life, and that life is more immediate to him. He cares more about the new life than the old.
Also, he has enough ego that he’s not going to beg. He probably figures she’ll calm down and take him back. He really doesn’t know her all that well – we’ve seen that.
They got in a spat and he left. We have no idea if it is an easy departure. Let’s wait and talk about how easy it was at the end of the season.
I agree, although it might not actually be until next season or something like that. Greg goes to Vietnam and for a year Joanie is managing on her own and then oops a year later Greg pops in, out of the blue wanting visitation or maybe even custody or something like that.
Seriously? I mean… seriously?!?!
Rape is when you force someone to have sex against their will. The act itself is a crime. It doesn’t become not a crime if the person you raped fails to fall apart in some fashion.
Yeah, I think you should definitely stop posting about what constitutes rape.
What kind of doctor is Greg if he doesn’t realize that the baby is not his? Perhaps he won’t admit it to himself, but somewhere he knows. That might explain why he re-upped and why he left so easily.
I was expecting him to be dead meat in Nam myself - still might happen.