**Storyteller ** is right, you are seemingly certain about the Scout role. Here are two instances where you seem fairly certain that there is no Scout.
Post #151
Post #156
Given that the game can be balanced to include all sorts of combinations of the roles including the Scout, the question is why are you so sure?
Sorry guys, I spent the last part of last week packing and the weekend moving and unpacking, so my internet time has been severely diminished. I did tell USCDiver on my confirmation that this would be the case. I’m going to try to catch up today.
I don’t think Fretful is necessarily saying he is sure in the sense that he has extra information that there is no scout, only that based on his read of the rules, he is sufficiently convinced that there is no scout role.
If Fretful really was scum and knew there was no scout, would he be jumping in here to say “Hey! there is no scout!” I’m thinking no.
I’m thinking this is a WIFOM argument. I am not going to cros Fretful off my scum list just because he thinks there is no Scout.
Hey, y’all, sorry for my disappearance over the weekend. I’m opening a show in less than two weeks and my weekends are pretty hectic right now. I’ll re-read what’s happened since Friday afternoon and be back with comments shortly.
Um, because I didn’t know that the game could be balanced to include all sorts of combinations of roles including the Scout at the time I made those two posts? Intuitively, it seemed to me to be too powerful a role to work, but since people who understand the mathematics of this game better than I do claim that it can, I’m quite willing to take their word for it.
(I’m a she, by the way.)
Damn it. I actually thought about that one. Then I convinced myself that I was wrong and that you have one of the screen names that seems like a woman’s but is really a guy.
:smack:
And I’ll badly quote **Roosh’s ** rule #1: Expect the scum to do anything and everything. 
Why can’t Fretful, as possible scum, come in and start saying there is no Scout? Or is it, that it is not the sort of thing that the scum would do? :dubious:
PS: I did remember **FP ** is a she, I hope everyone remembers I’m not.
On preview: That is a reasonable answer Fretful, but the questions above still hold.
Bleached and snipped.
Game just started, and has mostly taken place over a weekend so far…not a whole lot to comment on in general…hmmm. Early in the game low post count is as good a reason as any for a vote I suppose, however ShadowFacts, you have singled me out above someone who hadn’t posted at all. This is a little :dubious: .
And FTR, I’m a girl monkey.
Sorry, but your question is silly. I want her to do what everyone should be doing: playing the game. Your question seems to suggest that there is no or little value in people’s posts right now. I can’t imagine that’s what you actually mean, but I’m not sure how else to take it.
Let me spell out my position for you: on Day One, we have nothing (or extremely little) to go on. The tiniest things often get jumped on as “scum tells” and odds are high that we’re going to end up lynching Town, simply from a probability standpoint. Scum know this, and it’s in their best interest to sit back and watch Town pick each other apart, which, in my experience, is what usually happens.
Rather than randomly voting for people, my Day One method is to try to make the lurkiest players participate more by voting for them. My suspicion is that there is a higher proportion of scum in the low-participation players than in the high-participation players, so that’s where I focus my attention. I think that if lurkers know they are going to get votes and extra scrutiny, they are more likely to post more, which is what we want. I think it is as sound as strategy as any on Day One and if you want to vote for me for that, go for it.
And I never said anything about a “wagon.”
I’m not precluding Fretful from being female scum. I just don’t see how her thinking there are no scouts acts as an indicator of her being scum.
So yes, I’m of the thought that what Fretful stated is not something scum would say (IMO). The idea that scum would deliberately say something like that to seem more Town is alluring in the abstract, but in reality I don’t think that is a very easy thing to do. Taking actions that are counter to what we expect of scum is more plausible to me than producing words that are atypical of scum.
Nothing has been proven for Ms. Fretful Porpentine; but my opinion is I think she is Town.
Why vote unless you want other people to vote as well - hence wagon
By your own admission you’re not voting the lurkiest player.
Unlike a usual mafia game this one already has a mechanism for getting rid of lurking players. 4 substantive posts each day or the mod will take action.
But why not?
It’s not so much that a posited Scummy Fretful would know that there was no Scout, per se. Of course she would know this, but she’d know that the only way to truly know it would be to be scum. So just saying “there is no Scout” is right out, from the perspective of Scum trying to avoid getting caught.
But scum need to say something. It’s often safe to discuss game mechanics, since they’ll be of interest to everyone and generally don’t involve voting (which of course draws the spotlight). So you wade in to discuss the likely construction of the game. And here’s where Perfect Information Syndrome comes in. It seems like PIS generally doesn’t manifest in really obvious ways (like the above). It more often manifests when the scum player tries to develop a “real” argument that represents his/her true thinking. It’s always good for Scum to do this, because if they’re being sincere, they’re harder to tell from the Townies.
So let’s hypothesize a Scummy Fretful, who knows that there is no Scout (or, also possibly, knows that there IS a Scout but truly believes that it is unfairly powerful). She wants to comment on it in the game thread, because why not? She outlines her real, true, opinions on the role - as Townie a thing to do as there is in this game.
But.
Her real, true opinions on this subject are influenced by a critical bit of information that the rest of us don’t have: the number of Scum. It is self-evident that, with five Wolves, a Scout would be really unfair to the Town. But it is just as evident that, with four or even only three Wolves, such a role would fit neatly into a balanced game.
So she makes her argument, being as sincere as possible, but underlying the argument she’s making is a bit of knowledge that she has - the number of Wolves - that influence her conclusions indirectly. See below:
I believe that the last sentence is a true statement of Fretful’s opinion, whether she is Town or Wolf. But to me, the only way such an opinion comes intuitively is if one has information on the number of Wolves, as explained above. Her response feeds into that a bit for me - it reminds me of Blaster Master in the Asylum Lane game, who kept insisting up and down that the things we caught him for (he was scum in that game) were legitimate and sincere attempts to be a good Townie. But they reflected hidden knowledge and hidden motives, even when they were not conscious.
So I think I’m going to vote Fretful Porpentine.
I don’t think I understand the difference between these two things, in a game where actions and words are essentially synonymous. Her public statements are her actions (unless you want to look only at votes, but that’s not going to get us anywhere).
Sorry I tried to use “reasoning” for my vote - I’ll remember to vote more capriciously in the future 
I specifically explained why I didn’t vote for Blaster. Based on my experience playing with him (including the recently finished Simpletown), I expect he’s going to be in here at any moment with 4-5 long posts catching up from the start of the game. Expecting this, I gave him the benefit of the doubt and skipped to the next person. I think I’ve only played with Hockey once before, and do not recall what her posting patterns are. I’m not avoiding voting for Blaster, and will happily do so if I’m wrong about his M.O.
You know, if you had done this on Wednesday with a day or so to go and voted randomly for a lurker, I could understand it.
Let me put forward an alternative viewpoint. The scum are rarely lurkers. It gets mentioned every game, but in general, I find that it tends to be town who spend their time not posting too much. Voting for lurkers on the grounds they are scum, more often than not, is likely to be wrong.
Now, I’m not saying the **Hockey Monkey ** is not scum, but your vote does not follow what you said you would do. Vote for the lowest poster. Instead you have provided “extra” reasoning as to why you will not vote BlaM!, but think it is perfectly ok to vote for someone else. If someone like Pollux Oil, who posts infrequently, but generally full of content was the lowest poster, would you vote for them as well.
Sorry, if you are going to follow a stated method, follow the method. You didn’t and that is suspicious.
Action: voting for scum; solid game action type stuff
Words: hypotheticals; opinions; more creative rather than regimented game actions
Does that make sense?
Hang Fretful if you really must, but I’m baffled that such a comment would warrant so much suspicion. My view is: suppose Fretful is scum. Why would she bring up the scout at all? My feeling is a scummy Fretful would be more inclined to avoid that topic rather than address the scout issue. (I need to go back and check. Who was the first to bring up the Scout discussion?)
Which is more plausible? Scummy Fretful decided to convince the Town that there is no Scout or Town Fretful said something that didn’t make sense. I’m going with the latter. Why would a Scummy Fretful try and convince the town that there is no scout? If there really is no scout and Fretful knows that, she would want to keep that information secret.
If there really is a Scout, I have a hard time accepting that scummy Fretful would jump in and try and convince us otherwise.
I just don’t see it.
FTR, the scout discussion began with OAOW and CatInASuit discussing the scout.
OK. It does make sense; it just reflects the fact that you and I approach this game from very different angles.
She has one vote. ShadowFacts has more at this point. Where do you see “so much suspicion,” or even a strong suggestion that her hanging is imminent?
My answer is above. The scum have to talk about something. Game mechanics, overall strategy, who to vote for, something. Every single topic of conversation beyond the weather is dangerous for scum, because they have hidden information and motives. They can’t just avoid every topic. So (hypothetically) this is the one that she picked. Why not?