Am I the only one hearing ** Shagnasty’s** posts in a Trump-like voice? At this point, it’s just comedy.
We should do a game thread: Shagnasty or Trump?
“I went to an Ivy League school I’m very highly educated”
I don’t think anyone is suggesting that sexual orientation and sexual attraction are directly equivalent issues. They are suggesting rather that the way in which one comes to have a sexual orientation, and the way one comes to have certain sexual attractions, may well be similar.
No, that’s not what they are saying. Go back and read again this time more carefully.
Can I attempt to inject some basic data here? The gist of Shagnasty’s OP is that he is 44 and doesn’t find women his own age attractive and finds younger women more attractive.
The only surprising thing is that Shagnasty admitted this. The resulting pile-on is all too predictable. The *fact *of older men’s attraction to younger women is not even slightly controversial; the admission is however rather “brave”.
Here’s the results of a relatively unrigorous survey of male attractiveness preference, by age. Basically, this indicates that males of pretty much all ages find women in the 20-24 y.o. range most attractive. Here’s a more scholarly article which finds that men show a tendency to be sexually interested in women in their mid-twenties.
It’s one of those weird things; if you put forward to a middle aged woman the general proposition that older men are attracted to younger women they would agree with you in a heartbeat. If you asked an older woman if she looked better when she was younger she would (nine times out of ten) agree.
But woe betide any older man who admits they are attracted to younger women; they will get piled on like they are some sort of particular asshole.
Further, as to the nature/nurture issue, it seems to me that there is likely a substantial nature (over nurture) component to attractiveness preferences, because findings are relatively consistent across cultures.
Admiring beautiful women isn’t the issue. Making nasty comments about those who aren’t beautiful by your subjective standards is. I don’t understand why this is so difficult to grasp.
It’s the disdain he has for older women, not his attraction to younger women, that’s the issue.
My bad. I clearly mixed you up with the OP who said:
I can’t see how that is anything but a bad date.
Then there’s this guy who says:
But I’m glad that you don’t have a history of bad dates. However, I think we can both agree that those other two guys have a long string of bad luck.
You wouldn’t know if you did, any more than most people who have negative feelings about black people or Jews know if they do. Consider that if a bunch of (pretty smart!) people are telling you that you appear to have a problem with women that maybe you might actually have some problems with the way that you view women. Perhaps you ought to try and reflect on yourself. None of us our perfect and just about every flaw is correctable for smart and decent-minded people .
Shagnasty, someone asked a great question that I don’t think you answered yet – would you want your daughters (once they’re in their 20s) to date a guy like you?
That’s what “one of these things” means, as opposed to “both”.
I don’t know. Maybe I was born disliking broccoli?
You’ve missed the point entirely. No one is surprised or appalled that Shagnasty finds younger women more physically attractive than older women. He’s being criticized for the way he talks about middle-aged women. It’s not just that he finds them less attractive. He finds them boring, bitchy, loaded with baggage, incapable of entertaining him, overly-ambitious, and so forth. Far from being brave at admitting to a truism, he started the thread to bitch about all the ways that women continue to disappoint him, without any semblance of self-awareness that he just might be part of his problem.
Bingo.
I just read through this entire thread :smack:
Saying one’s sexual preferences, homosexual, heterosexual or lesser variations within and between the two is absolutely 100% determined at birth, all cases, is not anywhere near a scientific fact. So what is it when people insist it’s the case and moreover insist anyone who doubts it in any way is morally inferior and beyond the pale than politics? Sure it’s politics. No reason to ‘wait’. 
The reason the OP’s quest is inherently difficult is that his ideal woman (gorgeous, smart, adventurous, young) has little incentive to dedicate time to an older, divorced man with two kids who doesn’t want to wine and dine, marry, and/or father children with them. These women are going be to picky themselves and will likely have a plenty of suitors who have all the pluses that Shagnasty has with none of his negatives.
To the women he desires, he very well may be coming across like the baggage-toting hags he finds repulsive, except in the male form. Should he hang his head in shame over this prospect? Of course not. But I would think some humility and pragmatism would go a long way to helping him adapt to his circumstances. Or at least help him accept that he might not ever find what he wants. Accepting the cards dealt to you sometimes makes a whole lot of sense.
I spent most of my adult life single and looking, so I can empathize with the OP’s struggle to a certain extent. The heart wants what it wants. But Shagnasty’s predicament differs from most people because is he is most attracted to women that likely are predisposed to viewing him negatively.
I don’t think you’re a bad guy at all and hopefully you don’t think I’m saying you are.
But I do think you’re approaching this thing like its only a numbers game: if you just keep at it, you’ll eventually land on the beautiful no-strings attached activity partner you are pining for. But for a man in your situation, I don’t think it is as simple as that. I don’t think it’s bad idea for you to reassess what you think you really need to be content in this life. Beauty does fade; if intimacy is really want you want, it’s okay to admit that and go for it.
Also, looking at your own baggage and seeing what needs to be tossed away might also be worthwhile. Women (and men) can be surprisingly adept at picking up on lingering pain from someone’s past hurts and upheavals, and this stuff can be a major turnoff especially if you can’t relate to it due to inexperience and youth. You’re going after women who largely already assume divorced, middle-aged men have issues; if you’re not actively combating that impression, then you are going to struggle.
It still kind of boggles my mind that anyone thinks saying “I don’t have a problem with women”, or “I’m not a racist” or “I’m not a homophobe” or anything like that is remotely convincing. Virtually no racist thinks they’re racist. Virtually no misogynist thinks they’re a misogynist. Whenever someone says something like this, my immediate reaction is to think that their so clueless that their chances of being what they claim they aren’t are significantly higher than I would have thought before.
In case anyone’s curious, I don’t know if I’m a racist, sexist, or the like. The best I’ll say is that I hope I’m not, and I strive to not say or do racist, sexist, etc. things, and I hope others will challenge me if I do so that I can improve myself.
Your name is covfefe but you registered in January. Was that good luck or are you a time traveler. Or did you change your name recently?
That is so funny because by page 2 of this thread, I was picturing Shagnasty as Donald Trump. They have so much in common, including the misogyny that each tries desperately to disguise as affection. Plus they each share a deep, abiding admiration for themselves.
So let’s play!
**The Donald or Shagnasty: **
“Heidi Klum. Sadly, she’s no longer a 10."
“I know there are some attractive older women. I would go out with Lynda Carter…”
**The Donald or Shagnasty: **
“Being married to a hose-beast on either side is worse than being set free (divorced) in my opinion.”
"(She) is unattractive both inside and out. I fully understand why her former husband left her for a man- he made a good decision.
**The Donald or Shagnasty: **
“She made it blatantly clear that she was only interested in younger men like me at the time. I should have tried it.”
"All of the women…flirted with me – consciously or unconsciously. That’s to be expected.”
**The Donald or Shagnasty: **
“I don’t like losers.”
“However, I don’t someone that is dumb and poor either.”
**The Donald or Shagnasty: **
“Almost all soccer moms are already spent.”
“A person who is flat-chested is very hard to be a 10.”
**The Donald or Shagnasty: **
“I take care of two daughters on my own every weekend.”
“I like kids…I’ll provide the funds and she’ll take care of the kids.”
**The Donald or Shagnasty: **
"I have a great relationship with the blacks. I’ve always had a great relationship with the blacks.”
“All females that know me love me.”
**The Donald or Shagnasty: **
“I would never buy (my wife) any decent jewels or pictures. Why give her negotiable assets?”
“Even at several hundred dollars an hour for a high quality escort, it is still cheaper than a wife or a girlfriend with guaranteed services and none of the hassle.”
**The Donald or Shagnasty: **
“The beauty of me is that I’m very rich.”
“I am also flat out rich from family money.”
**The Donald or Shagnasty: **
“I am well over 6 feet tall, have a great head of hair, a high income job in a prestigious company.”
“My fingers are long and beautiful, as, it has been well documented, are various other parts of my body.”
**The Donald or Shagnasty: **
“I went to a prestigious undergraduate school and an Ivy League grad school.”
“My IQ is one of the highest.”
**The Donald or Shagnasty: **
“Fathers love their daughters more than anything yet they still think that some twenty-somethings are pretty hot. It is just human nature.”
“If (she) weren’t my daughter, perhaps I’d be dating her.”
**The Donald or Shagnasty: **
“What is it at 35? It’s called check-out time.”
“Like I said, all it takes is one or two really good (women) but they are light on the ground when you are in your 40’s.”
**The Donald or Shagnasty: **
“Nobody respects women more than I do.”
“I am not anti-female at all and everyone else knows that.”
**The Donald or Shagnasty: **
“When I was in college in New Orleans a group of notable gay businessmen befriended me. I got blatantly hit on all the time and even got slammed into a wall once but I just brushed it off.”
"I have so many fabulous friends who happen to be gay, but I am a traditionalist.”
**The Donald or Shagnasty: **
"I am an exclusive date for lots of reasons. The average person isn’t going to get one. "
“I think I am, actually humble. I think I’m much more humble than you would understand.”
Brilliant.
Furthermore, would you encourage your daughters to do this (in their 20s with a man in their 40s)?
That is easy , some men do date or marry women for more than their looks ! How do women stay attracted to shallow men at any age ???