Mystery Mafia -- Game Thread

[Krayz]

@Drain_Bead

Before I look more in-depth at peeker, I wanted to make a vote that I might end up moving later, just to get my suspicions on record.

vote Krayz

Mainly for his series of posts between 426-439 (I hope I’m getting those numbers right). Noises up the thread, doesn’t provide any reasoning or analysis for any of his multiple smudges (or soft exoneration of peeker and giraffe), and generally giving us nothing to go on other than “lolwolf.”

I thought providing little reason is a villager meta here.

oops!

you got me.

butnahhhhhhhhh

[Krayz]

@special_ed

It’s not to Bully that’s for sure

That said, I had been toying with voting for Krayonz myself

Since I was actually on the peeker bandwagon (maybe even started it, can’t remember if Giraffe was first) It’s not that.

My initial vote on Peeker was to gauge his reaction. He hasn’t really given me a solid Scum feel in his reaction, but, I’m stil suspicious.

Silver Jan, however, has come in, and basically said:

1. Oh my, there’s so much
2. Commented only on peeker
3. Cast an easy me too vote pushing him farther into the lead.

So, it just seems like a lazy and easy thing to do. Something a Scum might do.

oops, got to go make a presentation. be back later

krayonz is a great nickname, thanks.

@Meeko

First things first, this game is moving with a speed that I have NEVER even dreamed of seeing for a Mafia game. I guess this means I’m closer to a regular volume poster than I thought, my attempts to post more than Peeker be damned. (And even then, I wasn’t actually trying for the record, things just happened.)

I have real concerns with the speed of this game, to the point that I am already considering dropping out. There is no way I can mod my own game, hold down my job and play in a game that moves this fast. Something has to go, and it’s obvious to me what to pick.

However, I’m still here.

Krayz, you ping the hell out of me. Are you sure you aren’t Pleonast?

You come off with an air pretentiousness that Pleonast can only dream of. You are at best guessing about things that you can’t possibly know yet. The voice you are using here, and indeed in other posts, is condescending to the rest of us. Either play the game, or comment on it, not both. I’m not sure if I can explain it any better than this, but if I had to summarize:

**
You come off as “I can’t be bothered by this game, I’m already over it.”**

Both of the above come together. I already feel like I can’t give this game the time I need to give it. I get the feeling you could give this game the time you need to give it but you won’t. One of the two is far worse than the other, and I don’t like where you are going with yours. If you don’t want to play this game, get out.

Vote Krayz

I’ve voted Pleonast in other games for less. You might not have claimed yet, but I wouldn’t hold it against you. As for Pleonast, as for you, you are holding the game to your standard, and that in turn breaks the game, and does not make it better.

u mad?

[lilflower]

@MykBot

So basically the result of all that is that TexCat seems to be playing well and lilflower is not.

What? I’m the one who thinks that **TexCat **is saying you should be telling us all to kill ourselves, i.e., I’m voting for her for doing exactly what you just said she shouldn’t do: take the least charitable interpretation of your suggestion.

I must be speaking another language.

[Krayz]

@Scuba_Ben

I dislike Krayz’s smudges:

You may not be that stupid, but that’s certainly anti-Town. If you think peeker is Town, make a good case to defend em. Smudging people for their votes doesn’t help anybody. Well, not the Town at any rate.
unvote peekercpa
vote Krayz

Please RTF rules, PizzaGuy. As far as we can tell, no Night kill actions would have been effective on N0. There ain’t any certainty that you aren’t a Vig/SK/Assassin/Strongman/other killing role. We’ll have better information on killing roles Tomorrow morning. (I hope we do, Gad promised early bloodbaths to shorten the player list.)

you quoted a post saying that I wasn’t just going after people who were voting for peek, and then you accuse me of going after people who are going for peek and vote me for it? k.

[MykBot]

@lilflower

What? I’m the one who thinks that **TexCat **is saying you should be telling us all to kill ourselves, i.e., I’m voting for her for doing exactly what you just said she shouldn’t do: take the least charitable interpretation of your suggestion.

I must be speaking another language.

Oh wait I’m sorry, the names are just killing me.

lilflower is playing well and TexCat is the one who is screwing around with what I said.

This name thing is painful.

[MykBot]

Sorry lilflower.

TexCat

[Krayz]

@Dancecat

Ok, I’m caught up and doing a massive multi-quote instead of making a zillion posts.

This is what I was suggesting when I said that the targeted player would have to use their best judgment. Obviously seers/vigs/angels/rb’s probably shouldn’t do it, but roles with less value can. It would certainly be better to lose a tracker than to have a bunch of scum knowing their powers.

This is a very, very good post. Too bad I can’t clear you for it, because I know you could do it in either role.

Read on, dude. And if you’re a villager, please start acting like one.

I really wish that you hadn’t made this post because it’s going to make it a LOT harder for me to vote for you, and it’s going to look awful for me if you flip wolf.

I think this is mostly a cultural/play style difference. On the other board, we sometimes find it a lot easier to clear villagers than to hunt wolves. This is particularly applicable on d1 when the village has so littler concrete information to go on. But you can always look for players who are working hard and exhibiting a villagery thought process. The only way you can really find a wolf d1 is based on tone (or if they make some ridic TMI slip or something).

Speaking of finding wolves based on tone, the above is an awful post. But Special Ed beat me to the punch:

I think this is good too. Krayz has mostly just complained and hasn’t made any real effort.

Ok Special Ed is basically mirroring my own thought process, so I’m giving him a town lean (gasp).

I don’t think that you see what I was getting at with my pressure of NAF. My objective was to generate strategy discussion that would benefit the village and prevent us from giving the wolves additional free information. It was successful.

I am, admittedly, having a tougher time finding wolf candidates than I usually do. It might be because I’m used to higher volume games, or because I usually play with the same people over and over (and over) again and there are so many names that are new to me here. I’m also trying to value my gut instinct less and my logic more, so I’m having to read much more closely and put in a lot more effort instead of going with my “gut feeling” and just running with it/screaming for whoever pinged my wolfdar to get lynched (which is my usual early game scumhunting “strategy”). That said, my top two scum reads right now are Silver Jan and Krayz. Silver Jan just made a classic wolf post (as Special Ed already pointed out, so I won’t repeat what he said but his thought process was nearly identical to mine). Krayz is usually a high volume, excited, hardworking player as a villager, and I’m not seeing that here. He’s just complaining/whining and not actually putting any work in. I think either is a good lynch.

vote Silver Jan

I’m really confused here. You are pushing me as a wolf for doing things I’ve always done on 2+2. I am quite willing to retract my villager read on you atm after this quite honestly.

I’m in the middle of moving to grad school and posting in extremely small windows when I have time, and it’s straight up wrong that I’m not a hardworking villager here. I’ve made more reads posts than you ffs.

[Drain_Bead]

@Scuba_Ben

Suburban Plankton in #352:
“for breaking the ‘culture barrier’ and voting along with Zeriel (whose vote was half-joking to begin with), for her stated reason (“obvious vote is obvious”) and for later justifying her vote by pointing out how “early voting tends to be done more by townies””

Plank, that’s an incredibly weak reason, about as bad as hers. I expect better of you; that weak vote is out of character for you. So much so that’s it’s a Good Enough reason for me to move my vote.
unvote Krayz[
vote Suburban Plankton

aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaand we’re tied again, by my count.

[Krayz]

@Dancecat

I missed this at the bottom of yesterpage. I think it’s better to target scum suspects, since that’s where we want our vig shots and roleblocks to land. It’s better if the role revealer targets villagers, but I can’t think of any strategy which allows us to adjust for this that doesn’t completely screw us over otherwise (apart from only small powers saying that their role has been revealed after getting targeted by the revealer).

Ok. I think that Krayz has been wolfy. However, the peek he left is one that I know for a fact is correct, since I know my own role. If he had left a peek/breadcrumb/whatever of any other player, my suspicions would remain largely unchecked since I couldn’t personally verify whether or not the peek was good. But I can, so it gives me pause. Of course, he could be scum and have perfect information about my affiliation, and he made that fakepeek/breadcrumb because he knew I would react like that and be less likely to vote him because of it, so it then becomes a bit of a levelling game. I think you guys call it WIFOM. And of course, if he is scum, players might be more likely to incorrectly think that we are teammates and he was defending me. Make sense?

I called you a villager because you were being villagery or I somehow had the only n0 action as a seer. Now you aren’t being very villagery. You are telling them level 1 stuff about me like it’s fact and that makes me a wolf. My peek of you was @ level 0.

[lilflower]

@MykBot

Oh wait I’m sorry, the names are just killing me.

lilflower is playing well and TexCat is the one who is screwing around with what I said.

This name thing is painful.

@MykBot

Sorry lilflower.

TexCat

No worries! I just thought I must be completely incomprehensible. It’s happened before.

[Krayz]

@Dancecat

See, that’s the thing. The way Krayz is behaving isn’t consistent with his town game, but it’s not exactly consistent with his scum game, either. Although since a lot of us from the other board are having to make adjustments to the play style over here (and unsurprisingly, different people are doing that in different ways), it could be a function of that more than a function of his role. He’s clearly not himself, but it’s almost impossible to say why that is.

OK, I have 0 time to play. obv I’m not going to spam the thread longer than 10 min at a time or make huge read posts especially since this damn forum doesn’t work on my phone. I can guarantee you can see why I made the reads I did on all my unexplained read posts, that’s why I didn’t really care enough to write it out.

[TexCat]

@Inner_Stickler

You probably shouldn’t have used the verb recommending as I suspect that’s what lilflower is basing her opinion on. Listing would have been a better choice as ‘still on the table’ makes no judgment about the action, but ‘recommends as a viable option’ implies preference, ie. in this list of viable options I recommend you X.

This makes sense. But two additional things:

1. Lilflower added the hyperbole of “every night”, which neither MykBot nor I said.
2. Everyone, including lilflower and sachertorte, keeps ignoring the second part of reasoning that MykBot knew, or should have known, better. This was not the case for NAF.

@MykBot

So basically the result of all that is that TexCat seems to be playing well and lilflower is not.

Huh? Oh, on preview, nvm.

[Krayz]

@Scuba_Ben

Bolding mine.

It seems to me that revealing oneself as a Seer/Cop too early is generally a bad idea. Also, IIRC this is the first game on the Dope with N0 actions.

There’s a third possibility. Krayz and Dancecat might be masons that have to spot another mason to find out. In other words, a mason may need to target another mason to identify that player as a mason.

Dancecat, I suggest you consider the usefulness of targeting Krayz Tonight or the next Night. If masonry exists in this game and works kinda like I’m guessing (and taking from a post a few pages back), it would be worth knowing at some point.

Aaaand this opens up a possibility of false mason claims. Would anybody care for the wine in front of me?

woah this is really cool and a good idea, but is totally out of left field. I feel it isn’t too strongly antitown to say I have no idea what my role or HiFi’s is as of now.

@Mahaloth

This thing is moving way too fast for me and I can’t believe Day ends today. Krayz is the only one pinging me. Peeker is being his usual distracting self, but that’s just him.

**Vote Krayz **

voting for people pushing you as wolf is not optimal strategy afaik. Not sure if it is in this board’s meta though

@LightFoot

I wager that ** Krayz ** breezed in and posted before catching up on the whole conversation about
“ fake peeks” and their non purpose here. I am looking forward to their return (after catching up)
As I also wager there could not have been results of 2 investigations from Night 0 going to ONE player.

And to add…………… only one Night 0 action got a result…………..In a game this size we only have one detective? …….I think NOT……so why would the Mod choose just ONE Detective/Seer to receive results. I can’t see it

I read the discussion but didn’t partake in it because it was superfluous and an easy way for wolves to hide is by talking strat. I left the fakepeek as a sort of rebellion against the no fakepeek meta, as after reading both sides I feel fakepeek meta is optimal for villagers, though god knows if I’m right.

[Suburban_Plankton]

@Scuba_Ben

Plank, that’s an incredibly weak reason, about as bad as hers. I expect better of you; that weak vote is out of character for you. So much so that’s it’s a Good Enough reason for me to move my vote.
unvote Krayz
vote Suburban Plankton

Aside: I noticed I’m starting to shift to gender-positive pronouns as I figure them out. I hope this makes my posts more readable as the game goes on.

What if I told you I was trans-gendered?

I’m actually a little bit surprised that nobody else commented on my vote. Yeah, it’s a weak case, but I’ll argue that it’s still as good as any other at this point. Even among our own group I think it’s very, very difficult to get a Scum-tell on Day 1, and with the extremely large (for this board) group and the quick pace I’d wager it’s near-impossible in this game. So I went looking for something else that seemed ‘off’, and that’s what I found.

At the moment, I’m interested in the voting shift from **peeker **to Krayz. It could be an attempt by Scum to save one of their own from a day 1 lynch…then again, it could just as easily be all Townies on both sides of that one…but it might be something to look back on as the game goes on.

[Krayz]

@MykBot

Woah you guys are not understanding what I was saying about targeting yourself at all.

In the first game I targeted myself on night 0, on the assumption that having the ability to kill or really harm myself was probably impossible because it wouldn’t activate until night 1 if it was that dangerous. This was a true assumption in the first game. I got no result.

So on night 1 I targeted someone else. I got no result. This meant that I didn’t know what my power was, but that it almost certainly didn’t kill or seriously harm the other player.

So on night 2 I targeted myself again to try to get a result, so that I could learn what my ability was. I still got no result.

I finished the game having no damn clue what I was doing to people when I targeted them.

So I guess I need to be more specific here. You CAN decide to take the gamble of targeting yourself tonight (“on the table”) if you haven’t already done that night 0, but you SHOULD probably make your own decision about that, and the BETTER decision is to target someone else so you don’t harm yourself.

Then, some players will have info on what they do, but most will not. On night TWO, if you’re still alive, you can target yourself again if your night 1 target didn’t die or something, and you’ll hopefully be able to ascertain your night action.

In the first game there were a lot of people who never knew what their action was. I expect that to repeat here.

But chiefly, I didn’t provide a bad idea, I provided the best thought process about the night actions in the entire thread.

even night vig would have been balls. I suggest targetting 2 people before targetting yourself in this game. Even and odd night vigs and other roles are quite common in 2+2 mishmashes

[peekercpa]

@Drain_Bead

Well, I was emphasizing more that it was a tying vote, not the third vote.

and he just did it again.

[Krayz]

that’s my spam for the day. Hopefully I’ll be on later.

vote: mahaloth

I really look like I’m completely level 0 here,and just retaliating for the vote on me, but I honestly think he’s the most scummy player itt so far.

plox don’t lynch me.

[Episkey]

@Askthepizzaguy

I see in the OP something about “one action”.

So I think I can rule several things out if that was me.

I’m not a seer, or else I’d have results and therefore I’d know what I am. Not sure how seers are supposed to *work *in this one… I’m not a nightkiller of any kind. I’m probably not a bus driver, because having a bus driver as the sole Nzero action makes no sense at all, since it would accomplish nothing. Similarly, I was probably not blocking, as blocking being the only action to go through also makes no sense. Same for a doctor if there was no kill. Will re-examine that logic later.

But I think I can rule myself out as being one of the team’s more vital roles. That said, if my action was the only Nzero action, then I feel I should at least reveal what I did with said power.

Not sure if targeting myself would do anything useful, if I’m not a doctor.

If I were to wager a wild guess, there could be a mechanic like reversing the effects of someone’s next night action, or something… or perhaps something with a similarly delayed effect. As such, being active on Nzero makes more sense, since it could affect the outcome of N1. Otherwise stumped. Though I doubt the game was meant to be solved on D1 anyway.

I wouldn’t assume the orange is true entirely.

One possible action that could have gone through that was a role in the other game was that of an “oracle”. Essentially, the oracle was a cop, but instead of getting a result from their investigation they got nothing. Upon dying, the investigation result of their last night action was revealed in the thread.
Also, what is a bus driver?
The rest of the analysis makes sense

[Dancecat]

@LightFoot

And to add…………… only one Night 0 action got a result…………..In a game this size we only have one detective? …….I think NOT……so why would the Mod choose just ONE Detective/Seer to receive results. I can’t see it

Peeking (or investigating or whatever you call it) is one action. That action can be performed by multiple players. Ruling out n0 peeks based on mod wording doesn’t seem wise.

[Dancecat]

@Krayz

I’m really confused here. You are pushing me as a wolf for doing things I’ve always done on 2+2. I am quite willing to retract my villager read on you atm after this quite honestly.

I’m in the middle of moving to grad school and posting in extremely small windows when I have time, and it’s straight up wrong that I’m not a hardworking villager here. I’ve made more reads posts than you ffs.

Link me to a game where you’ve done this before.