Is there a reason why this is still acceptable in this day and age?
As a British person, I’ll frequently see my culture mocked in various ways by Americans. I’ll also see my fellow countrymen mocking Americans in other ways. And, of course, there’s plenty of other mocking going on - I just happen to notice that directed at us the most.
I try not to do it. I’m not perfect, and it’ll happen occasionally, but I do try - and I’m am fully cognizant that any “mocks” I may direct towards American culture are usually baseless, uninformed, or hypocritical (not that that’s why I try not to do it - I try not to do it because I think it’s fucking obnoxious and rude.)
Sure, friendly rivalry, competition, etc. is fine. But sometimes it really come across as nasty.
What’s that all about? Should we hope for an end to it some day?
It’s easy for people to say “Eh, doesn’t matter, get over yourself.” But that’s the argument directed at many groups about which one may not “mock” these days. And so one shouldn’t mock those groups. Why are nationalities an acceptable excepetion?
I don’t get the concern. As long as it is all in fun then fine, people need to grow a thicker skin sometimes.
I mercilessly mock people for a variety of nonsensical reasons, It is what we do to our friends. Of course it happens to me as well and I can easily tell when it is said from a position of affection and when it is designed to be offensive.
My wife has the temerity to come from a village 4 miles away from my own and in a different county, just imagine the mocking she gets!
OK, maybe I misphrased. Yep, that’s obvious. That’s not what I was getting at.
Obviously that’s the cause of a lot of unacceptable behaviour in the world; from religious wars to racism, to a bunch of other things. They vary in degree, of course (I certainly wouldn’t want to equate this to actual racism, which is far more harmful); but the question is more geared at - why is this one acceptable, and should we hope for an end to it?
Aha! Thank you. That’s the very attitude I’m querying.
When you say “it’s all in fun”, is this a generic position? Can a white man use the N word when addressing a black man as long as it’s “all in fun”? Fun to whom? To you? To the target?
As for concern - it’s a fairly casual query (which is why it’s not in Great Debates). It’s like a teeny minor debate. I don’t think it’s a major problem, just a curious one.
I don’t think hoping for an end to it is reasonable, regardless of the Star Trek fantasy of a world without racism, sexism, etc.
There is as much humor and opportunities for coming together in those fuzzy differences between peoples as there are prejudice and threats. Preventing one prevents the other.
Americans spend far more time and effort mocking other Americans in much more vicious ways. You think Americans say mean things about Britain? You should see the shit they say about George W. Bush or Barack Obama, both of who are not only American but their own Dear Leader. Same for Britons vis a vis Americans. It just stings more because they are outsiders looking in.
My point was - we as a species are hard-wired to denigrate out-groups or even out-individuals; we’re (social) pack animals. Like wolves or rats. You can socially engineer out a lot of “uncivilized” behaviour - and as a species we’re doing fairly well on that score, thankfully) but it’s never going to go away. So “develop a thicker skin and deal with it” really isn’t bad advice.
In your OP you said “my culture.” Let that sink in a bit. In a utopian, we are all the same kumbaya world, there would be absolutely no reason for you to think in terms of “my” (or their) culture, right? You also refer to “American culture” as if it’s a discrete entity. So right there, you are part of the problem. Or, if not problem, you’re still thinking of yourself as part of a separate culture, and us Americans as part of a different, perhaps not-so-nice culture.
Except that I refrained from* saying all that*. Those are your words. I didn’t say “Americans are part of a not-so-nice culture”, and I wouldn’t dream of doing so; I’d think myself an ass for doing so.
So yes, maybe I’m part of the problem. But I make an effort not to be. I don’t always succeed, but I think it’s worth trying.
I get that we’ll all think stuff we shouldn’t. Mostly we hold it back and don’t actually say it. When that happens enough, it starts to become normal, and we start to see why it’s wrong.
For example - I bet many of us know older people (grandparents, perhaps) who come across as more racist than we’d prefer. We know they’re not bad people. We know that they don’t mean harm by it. But we wince inwardly (or, in some cases, chastise them for it). They brush it off as PC nonsense, much the same way as people are brushing this thread off as similar.
I get what you’re saying, I think (and FWIW I am a U.S. citizen but raised overseas and my education mostly came from the U.K.) but my point is - yeah, it sucks, yes should’nt be so, but it is and most importantly there are more constructive ways to combat tribalism or racism or whatever-ism than posting on a message board; because any idiot can do that.
So, what are you doing, concretely and for real, to combat whatever it is you’re combatting here? Because if the answer is “nothing, actually” then STFU. If the answer is “something, and this is what is is” then let’s hear it.
I don’t like the status quo either, and I do something about it IRL. Which, yannow, involves a tad more than complaining or venting anonymously on message boards. So what do you DO, Candyman74, that makes a difference IRL?
It’s a message board. It’s designed for one specific thing: online conversations. So I’m having an online conversation about something that I was curious about.
Sorry if that bothers you. But I’m gonna carry on having conversations about things that interest me.
Obama is AMERICAN?? I know I read somewhere on the internet that he was really born in Africa. Don’t tell me I can’t believe everything I read on the 'net!?
Just be glad you’re not French. I’ve been to France many times, and it’s my favorite country except for the U.S. (in some respects more than the U.S.). I don’t think there’s anything about France of its culture that isn’t routinely derided . . . mostly by people who’ve never been there.
It may be due to the British having a reputation for having a great sense of humor. I can’t imagine a Brit taking American mocking seriously. Plus, the common language spares us from needing to have our mocking translated.
Oh, very true! I must admit I’ve been guilty of that many times in the past - although I have been there a number of times (it’s not that far from here!)
There is a lot of stuff that other people find funny, that I used to find funny, that’s no longer funny to me. This topic is in that category (along with racist jokes, and calling people I deemed inferior “fag,” &etc).
I call it “growing up” or “evolving” (depending on who I’m talking to), but some people will never move past this phase. People who are in this phase view people like me as liberal crybabies who want to censor the speech of others. I view them as mildly-pitiable neanderthals who should seriously investigate more worthy topics of conversation. Whether I’m right or they’re right, well… the jury’s out on that. Stand-up comedians make an awful lot of money by exploiting jokes like these. It doesn’t mean I have to laugh.
