That said, 18-23 is not all that bad; not “killing everyone else’s fun” bad. Sounds like the bigger problem is that everyone else has run all these dungeons 30 times already; a problem that will basically solve itself tomorrow.
[QUOTE=Bosstone]
A percentage? Weird.
Look at it this way. Yeah, you’ve got 5 people in a group, but the tank is doing limited damage and the healer usually isn’t doing any damage at all. You’ve got roughly 3.5 people’s worth of damage being put out. That means you should expect to be doing anywhere from 25-35% of the total group damage.
[/QUOTE]
Yeah, that’s what I’m being told. Sadly, the best I can do (so far) is in the low 20’s total damage percentage wise. Whatever I SHOULD have (gear wise) I obviously don’t have. I also don’t have the mods to optimize my shot rotation, though I know what the rotation is and have studied (somewhat) what all the shots do and what the optimal selection is. My gear is mostly blue (including my guns, which was a dungeon drop) with a few pieces of green quest gear and no purples at all.
I do have a rare spawn pet though (one of the spirit beast pets).
-XT
Pretty much. You’re getting into runs where everyone is bored and overgeared. Tomorrow most everyone will be on the same footing as you.
No no, it’s not about gear(as long as it’s suited to you class/spec), everyone has to start somewhere, it’s about doing what you can with the tools you have, sometimes you wonder if people are even trying to do damage.
I meant that he was doing 700 dps which is extremely low for a level 80 warrior, when I leveled my warrior I was doing almost twice that at level 70.
Looking at percentage of total damage is meaningless since if the other players in the part vastly outgear you, yours is going to be low no matter what you do. It’s your damage per second that’s important and even then you need to consider class, spec and which instance you were doing.
Ah…700 DPS. I gotcha. Well, my DPS is actually not that much higher than that, to be honest. I believe I’m doing in the 800’s atm (I don’t believe this includes the pets damage though as I don’t think the mod I’m using adds that in).
-XT
These are both true, but do point to a problem in the basic game design, IMO. They added a very easy way to group up with people you do not know, but provided no indication of how you are performing or how ready you are to contribute to that group.
So you have a player who is very quickly grouping up with complete strangers and either (a) thinking they are doing fine, or (b) getting flamed by people they don’t know and perhaps causing the group to fail.
The new proc-based effects help, but the game still does a very poor job of pointing people in the right direction when it comes to threat generation (AoE and single-target) or proper DPS rotations. And you still get no indication (other than angry tells) in-game about how well you are doing your job as DPS.
Here’s what I would add: class TRAINERS. Not NPCs that sell you abilities, but NPCs that tell you how to use them. They attack a practice dummy with a non-idiotic rotation with the abilities lighting up on your bar as they do it. Then you do it and they tell you where you went wrong. Hell, tie a stupid achievement to it (5 minutes of perfect rotation!) and you’ll have everybody practicing in no time. 
Well, I sometimes refuse to buy from people that I know and dislike. But I’m a jerk like that, and am willing pay more just to avoid giving them gold. 
Right–percentage of damage I couldn’t give a shit about. Your actual numbers, on the other hand, I do. And, as I’ve explained in this thread every time the subject comes up, my bar for PUGs is very low. I only expect people to perform to the minimum level such that, were everybody else also performing at that level, we’d still be able to beat the content. And, as a DPS in a Heroic, that’s 1500 single-target DPS. That is a number that every single damage-specced 80 should be able to hit pretty much the second they ding (if not sooner). If you’re not, it’s because of some choice you’ve made in the way you play your character. That’s fine if you want to solo, but as soon as you do group content, you agree to meet the minimum requirements for your role: and for damage-dealers, that’s 1500 DPS to run a Heroic. (The Wrath-launch ones, anyway. The number is probably technically higher for ToC5 and the ICC5-mans.)
ETA:
xtisme, Recount and Skada both include pet damage with their owners; dunno what you’re using. 800 DPS is really, really, *really *low for an 80 Hunter of any spec, and it’s much too low to be running Heroics. (Really, it’s probably too low to be running regulars.) If you’re happy soloing like that, it’s your $15 a month–but if you want to link your profile here and ask for advice, we’ve got a bunch of people who’re familiar with the Hunter class who’d be happy to offer some suggestions.
ETA2:
Apologies if it sounds like I’m jumping down your throat–that really isn’t my intention. I support the right of anybody to play the game the way they want, so long as it isn’t affecting other people. As long as you’re solo, or playing with friends who agree with you, there is no “right” or “wrong” way to play.
That doesn’t really seem consistent with 18-23% of party damage; your other two DPS and the tank are probably doing about 8k between them, so you’re probably doing about 2k with your pet. Or so I’d guess.
Ahhh.
With hunters (speaking from experience), it’s using what you’ve got at every opportunity. The intersection of “trying as hard as you can” and “playing as smart as you can” is the sweet spot.
“Trying as hard as you can” is the opposite of AFK’ing at the keyboard, auto-shotting while you text your friend in another window or on your mobile. (No, I’m not accusing you of this. I’m citing the extreme, and also the very old hunter stereotype.) Use your cooldowns. Turn on and turn off pet abilities as appropriate, saving that precious focus for damaging or enhancing abilities.
“Playing as smart as you can” is where a lot of players, including me, fall short. Some rotations are finicky and very conditional. A dynamic priority system, picking the best shot at that moment, never missing a cooldown or proc… that’s where a highly-focused hunter can rock the dps-box. I’ve learned that as a MM huntard, I need nearly-savant attention levels to sustain the short-lived procs and temporary buffs that stack up to easily double damage output in a fight.
Also, build and gear choices figure into “smart”. Reforging, glyphing, gemming, and enchants also. A neglected bit is pet build, with both the appropriateness of the pet type (ferocity, period, if you’re dpsing in a group of any kind) and talent selections (don’t waste points on self-heals or pet survivability talents unless you need them to advance a tier).
If you build smart and try hard, your damage output will scale to the potential of your gear. At that point, you’ll only draw criticism from ego-inflated epeen asstards, and you will just have to blow that off.
Seriously…you should consider transferring over to Cairne and getting into our guild. Most of us have greatly benefited from becoming acclimated and comfortable with each other here, that it easily translates to a comfortable guild (BDL) in Cairne. We have all the professions covered so that you can have a guild mate enchant, jewelcraft, blacksmith, etc. things you have/need to help in increasing your dps, as well as advice you get from here. If you go dungeon running with us, you will get enough “guildslack” to practice improving your dps.
I can’t think of a better way to improve your game experience, IMHO.
Playing with people you know really is the best way to go. Especially for getting more comfortable with content–just knowing that you’re with people who are going to absolutely be patient with you and go as slow as you need to be comfortable can be a great help.
[QUOTE=Shot From Guns]
xtisme, Recount and Skada both include pet damage with their owners; dunno what you’re using. 800 DPS is really, really, really low for an 80 Hunter of any spec, and it’s much too low to be running Heroics. (Really, it’s probably too low to be running regulars.) If you’re happy soloing like that, it’s your $15 a month–but if you want to link your profile here and ask for advice, we’ve got a bunch of people who’re familiar with the Hunter class who’d be happy to offer some suggestions.
[/QUOTE]
I don’t remember which mod I’m using, but I tried to load Recount and was having some issues with some other mods I have loaded so I dropped it. I know for a fact that it doesn’t include pet damage though, since the numbers don’t change at all from if the pet is on passive to if I have it engaged in the fight. The mod I’m using focuses mainly on the percentage of total party damage for the ‘raid’ (I assume party in this case) I’m doing, and give a little graph showing how it stacks up with other party members. It has a DPS section but I’m unsure how accurate it is, since I’ve noticed it doesn’t seem to change much even if I’m doing things like multi-shot. I’m also not sure of what my DPS numbers are recently, as I turned off that particular mod before I reached level 80 (I’ve spent the past week or so trying to take Loque as a pet, so was focused on that).
Maybe I could post my equipment and specs and the shot rotation I’m using and see if anyone has any obvious advice. I’ve gotten all my specs, including my pet spec, from stuff like WoWhead and WowWiki builds. Same with the rotations I’m using (I usually go Marks in dungeon, again based on what I’ve read…my solo PvE spec is Beast). I am using the glyphs also suggested on the various sites I’ve been looking at.
As to my gear, none of it is gemmed (that’s a new thing to me and I haven’t found much that has the sockets) and most of it isn’t enchanted with very high level enchants (basically what I could buy at the AH). It’s also not very good gear, being mostly quest blues and greens with some dungeon drop blues dropped in. It’s all Dex/Stam gear, which is what hunters need afaik.
-XT
As soon as I dinged 80 I was so excited to be able to do Heroics with my friend.
I don’t think I got to do Heroics for a week. It wouldn’t let me in because I was too undergeared. That was such a wake-up call. Hitting 80 is when everything changes again. You either have to learn the game again or go back to alts and stop at 80. I’d never socketed a gem or used a glyph! I had no idea what the hell anyone was talking about. I thought you just did dungeons forever until you had enough Emblems to get your T9 then T10 gear and that was it.
I guess I chose to play to the level of Heroics. I haven’t committed myself to playing to the level of raids yet, just because of the level of commitment needed.
It still doesn’t let me do heroics…my average gear rating is 177, and I understand it has to be higher to get into the heroic zones. My guild won’t let me do any raids with them either at such a low level. I’m not likely to build that up any time soon, as my own plan is to roll up a brand new character to relearn the game from scratch. I wish I had some of the heirlooms folks talk about that you can send to your new toons, but it should still be better rolling a new guy and playing him through.
-XT
54 minutes to go, there’s a silly amount of people standing in front of the flight trainer. 
Yup, Kush - it’s a whole new game at 80 (85 in 10 hours…, or less for our EU friends I guess).
And, as I indicated above, it’s kinda where WoW drops the ball. There is very little in-game to point you to things. Is there any NPC or in-game text that explains gemming or glyphs?
One great idea from the forums: a few non-ideal but cheap glyphs from a trainer. Say at the level you get a new glyph slot available a new quest pops up that sends you to your class trainer to buy an appropriate glyph. It’s not as good as the scribe-made ones, but it lets you know what you should be looking for, or that such an option even exists.
Something similar could be done with gems - when you get to Outland and get your first socketed piece you get a “How to Gem” quest that has you seek out a NPC that sells you a relevant gem and tells you how to install it - maybe even make it class- and spec-specific so folks have a general idea what to be gemming for. Boom - a huge area of mystery resolved in-game.
Otherwise you get the phenomenon that xtisme just stated - folks hit a wall at 80 and just give up and level again. That’s fine for Blizzard, I guess, but limits players from some of the more rewarding and fun parts of the game.
Well, I just reported my first player - a guy named Trizle who repeatedly stole my loot. His reply when I complained: “Dude when I care, I’ll let you know.” I had to edit my ticket 3 times - everytime with name, time and place.
Think I’ll get my loot back?
Q
My opponent is clearly flip-flopping on this issue. She has, in the past, strongly supported those who won’t get off their mammoths while talking to NPCs, a behavior that clearly and strongly affects other people!
Wait, are they selling the flying early? Or are you in Europe or something?
Cuz I found a whole crowd of people around the flight trainer in SW, and it’s not even 3:00PM here.
compulsively refreshes Canada Post tracking website
Yesterday at 7:33pm it was in a processing facility in Richmond, BC. This morning it said Dec 6, 8:59pm processing in Vancouver. Yes, this morning it had an update for tonight.
C’mon guys, you can get it from Vancouver to Regina for tomorrow! 
What level was he?
I’m making an intricate scenario in my head where this guy is low enough that we can all create Death Knights and gank him over and over. Doper Mafia indeed.