"No GOOD Woman Leaves Her Kids Behind..."

One of my female co-workers said this today, in a discussion with a male co-worker, about a woman he’s recently begun to date. Actually, the full quote is “no GOOD woman leaves her kids behind if she breaks up with their father.”

To my co-worker: Fuck you. Fuck you and the horse you rode in on. And when you’re done riding, I hope the horse fucks you too.

Who the hell are you to define “good”? I see you at lunch, reading the tattered, well-worn, well-loved Bible you said your grandmother gave you when you were little. I hear you discussing God and church with other colleagues. I see your Lord’s Prayer screen saver. And yet…you didn’t marry the father of your two daughters until the youngest was five years old. I myself have nothing against not being married when you have kids. But an awful lot of people don’t see it as “good.” Including your God. Of course, since Christ is your savior, and according to your system of beliefs, you’re forgiven, and you’ve got nothing to worry about. But IMHO, that should make you LESS of a judge on what “good” women do. LESS. Not MORE.

Fuck. I’m so pissed off right now. And while she was not talking to me, and was not talking about any issue realted to me, this is a really, REALLY sensitive issue with me.

She’s not worth the bile that’s rising in your throat, Pers.

Glad you had this forum in which to vent, though. Saves you from keeping it bottled up until you cracked at work one day.

I will never understand anyone seeing any aspect of life in complete black and white terms. And then to label people as being “good” or “bad” based on one’s own definitions … Well, really, it’s unChristian, IMHO.

Christ caught a lot of heat from the “righteous” of his day for hanging out with prostitutes, tax collectors, Gentiles, and “sinners.” But the difference was he loved them rather than judging them.

Some Christians do try to follow his example in this regard. Please try to remember that.

No sig this time, 'kay? :wink:

Your co-worker sounds like a snotty, sheltered, self-satisfied little twerp. The pathetic type who needs to put others down to feel good about herself.

It’s a sensitive issue for me too. After my divorce, it took me about nine months to find affordable housing and get a car on the road. During that time my kids lived with their dad more than with me. It was the worst time of my life ever and I was judged harshly by more than one person. I heard remarks like “Oh, I could never give up MY kids…”

And neither could I, and neither did I. But some people don’t need any actual information in order to make their shitty judgments.

Fuck 'em, sez I.

Me, too. Nobody so far outside of the divorced couple has any inkling of what’s best for kids of divorce. Sometimes Mom, sometimes Dad, sometimes a mix/match thing. So long as the kids are kept first in mind, 's ok by me. Meddlesome creatures have difficulty with this.

What the fuck? It’s not like your kids were with some stranger; they were with their FATHER. That is so insulting to both parents. People who assume that only the mother is capable of caring for children really piss me off.

That’s the thing that gets me the hardest about her statement.

My own parents are divorced, and when they separated, my brother and I stayed with my DAD. Because at the time, it was the best thing to do. Not that my mom sucked in any way, shape or form. Quite the contrary, in fact. But there were a lot of circumstances that they had to take in to consideration, and between the two of them, they decided that us staying with my dad was the best way to go. I was fine with it then, and in hindsight, I’m STILL fine with it.

There’s other issues, too. My own husband, for example, is a stay-at-home-dad. We’ve got two kids together, and he’s been their primary caretaker from minute one of their lives. And because of that, (fuck, I hadn’t intended to announce this in the Pit, but oh well) when my husband and I separate, he will most likely keep the kids. I love my children desperately, but I also know them well enough to know that me leaving will mess them up for a while, but taking them from their father would fuck them up forever. The fact that I’m the one with the uterus does NOT automatically mean that my children will be better off with me.

That’s exactly it. You shouldn’t be made to feel guilty because of some idiot who doesn’t know you or your kids or your situation. Each couple has to decide based on their own personal circumstances what the best situation for the kids will be. And if it’s with their father, then that’s where they should be. I just get SO steamed by people who assume that men are incapable of caring for children. Well, fuck them. I know you’re going to do what’s best for your kids regardless of whether some overbearing biddy approves of it or not.

I’m sorry to hear that. My husband and I separated for a year, we’re back together now though…the kids stayed with me because I’m the primary caregiver. Makes all the sense in the world for them to stay with the primary caregiver, and people should just drag their minds into the 21st century - it’s not always the wife’s role.

Persephone I am in awe of someone so brave as to really put their kids first. Divorce is hard on kids and most parents make it so much worse.

When my sister left her husband she walked out with the clothes on her back. She was just out of the hospital on her second suicide attempt. She believed she was too unstable to provide a good home for them at that time, and she was correct. The job of parent is not about custody it is about taking care of your kids.

Arrrgggh! what a BITCH!! My ex-bf and I evenly split custody of our son from the time he was six (when I broke up with him and moved out) until the ex-bf was offered a job in a smaller southern Alaskan town when my son was 9 and a half.

Though we’d had a bitter break-up and disliked each other quite a bit. We were GLUED to a promise to never, ever let it make us bad parents and to always put our son first in his needs and desires.

So, as it turns out, we ended up having me be the weekend parent and my bf being the “full-time” parent.

Best thing that could have happened to both the ex-bf and my son. The ex-bf quit drinking and smoking, and we became, if not friends, at least really good allies as parents. And my boy lives in one of the best communities in the US for raising kids, he has a great “dad and son, hiking/fishing/outdoorsy” upbringing, with me getting to spoil him and send all those noisy gadgety toys home.

I love my son enough to put what is best for HIM first. Do I miss him, and want him to live with me? Hell yes. But he and his dad have a great bond, and he’s a healthy happy kid.

This situation isn’t supposed to be what’s best for me, but what is best for him. THAT’S what being a good parent is about, sacrificing for the good of the child even if it’s not fun for you, even if that means you aren’t the custodial parent (and in a short hijack, where is it written that men can’t be just as good a custodial parent as a woman?, this woman is not just a bitch, but an ignorant bitch!!).

I have to say it again, what a BITCH that woman is!!! (grrrrr!!!)

Hey Pers, don’t let those who do not know what the fuck they are talking about get you down.

How do you react when some idiot co-worker tells you something stupid like-- oh, I don’t know-- humans only use 10% of their brain or you can get AIDS from a toilet seat?

Use the same haughty expression, raise one disdainful eyebrow and say: “Uh, yeah.”
Fuck stupid people. They aint worth the angst.

Pers, when is you co-workers birthday? Give her a VHS of Kramer vs. Kramer.

You know what? When my mother laft my dad, I was five. She left me with him. He was an overbearing prick, and she knew it. But she still left me with him. As things turned out, my life with my mother and her (eventually) new husband would have likely been a good sight better than my life with my mean and (eventually) drunkard of a father.

And yet, based on what she knew at the time, she still made the right decision. She was leaving my father because she couldn’t live with him anymore. I can certainly understand that! However, he had a secure job and a home he could provide, while she had neither. With my father I at least had security and a pretty good guarantee that I would be provided for. There were also suggestions of a contentious court battle over me if my mother had tried to gain custody, a battle which my father would have likely won in the end anyway.

My mother left me to be raised by a jerk. You’d think I’d be mad at her. And yet, she made that choice based on the fact that, by what she knew at the time, I had a better chance of a stable life with him. I can hardly blame her for that.

Sometimes, good women do leave their kids behind, and they do it because they’re good women, and they care more about their kids than themselves. Tell your Bible-thumping office mate to go fuck a flagpole.


Okay, that’s better.

In May of '99 Mr zoogirl broke up. The house had been mortgaged to death, we were fighting all the time , etc, etc, etc.
Since we had to move anyway, doing it separately seemed like the best idea. At the time, the boy’s were ten and twelve, almost thirteen. I got the chance to take a course and Mr zoogirl was offered a place on our friend’s five acre property, complete with large pond and studio. We’ve known this family since '84 and their son is exactly thirteen days younger than Kid, the Younger. Guess where the boys wanted to go? Not Mom’s tiny basement suite, that’s for sure!

As it turned out, we got back together within the year. It’s been a lot better since then.

I’ve always been the one who spent more time outside the home, looking after my mom and that kind of thing. Mr zoogirl is the family cook and houseperson. With their opinion of my cooking, they’d have starved before the first month was over!

I’m particularly burned by that “Christian” woman. When I moved out, my church Homegroup was right there to help me move and they all fully accepted my decision to leave the boys with Mr zoogirl. They saw it as a chance for me to get myself on track, which I did. I got some skills that got me into my jobs and learned a lot about myself during that time. If I hadn’t, I really think the family would have stayed broken. Mr zoogirl did some changing during that period too, and a big part of it was having the full responsibility for the boys. It made him a lot steadier.

Persephone, you do what you think is right. Your co-worker is a jerk first and a Christian second and you can tell her a good Baptist Sunday-School teaching friend of yours said so! So there!

Seriously, no one knows your kids and your family as well as you.
What you and their dad decide is what counts. That goes for everyone else on this thread too.

“no GOOD woman leaves her kids behind if she breaks up with their father.” WTF ?!?

She probably considers it ‘babysitting’ when her husband looks after his own children, too. No moron, you can’t ‘babysit’ your own kids!

This sort of attitude shits me and I don’t even have kids. It’s so unbearably judgemental and sexist. Ideally, both parents are caregivers and usually one of the paretns is the primary caregiver. Who cares what gender that happens to be ?

And I bet she’d never dream of saying ‘no GOOD man leaves his kids behind if he breaks up with their mother’. Not that I would, either, because that’s just as judgemental, but it illustrates the fact that she probably considers her kids “hers” not “ours”.

Vent away, hon. You know you’re doing the right thing for your family and that’s all that matters. All the best.

I could get behind a statement like “No GOOD woman abandons her kids, period” (as in, casually dumps them on someone else because she doesn’t give a damn about them) but my gosh—leaving them with the father? There’s absolutely nothing wrong with that.

What a silly (to say the least) thing to say. I reminds me of a statement I once heard while riding on the bus: “You’re not a REAL woman until you’ve given birth to a son.” (The person who said it was a middle-aged woman.) The things some people say.

I know that this wasn’t the intent of your OP, but I’m sorry to read that, Persephone. I hope everything works out the best way it possibly can with your family.

Being a ‘Birth Mother’, I want to strangle the woman.

Good women give up thier babies so Better women get the chance to be Mommies.

**TelcontarStorm, ** I hear you on that one, too. I’m also a birthmother.

Persephone, I thought we had established a long time ago some of your coworkers were ijiots.

I’ve known lots of different situations wrt motherhood etc. And the times that I saw the mother (and/or father) putting their childs best interests above all, I’ve made it a point to let thme know I’m impressed (for what it’s worth). Ditto for your situation.

re: your announcement - I’m certain that you wouldn’t take such a step lightly, so I’ll just say that my best wishes are w/you and yours.