Looks like Pompeo is saying that the US continues to insist on denuclearization first, then an end to sanctions. I don’t think Kim is going to buy this approach, but maybe I’m wrong and the agreement to end military exercises is enough to keep Kim listening to what the US has to say. Still, increased legitimacy and political standing aside, the sanctions are still a thing, and they represent an existential threat to his regime the longer they continue.
It appears that you’re unaware that Iran was having ITS OWN FUCKING MONEY returned to it.
Surprise, surprise! That’s NOT what NK thinks they agreed to.
From the article:
“But the North Korean news agency said that the two leaders had agreed to a phased process it which Pyongyang would bargain away its nuclear arsenal in stages, securing reciprocal actions from the United States at each step.”
I’ve worked with idiots like Trump my whole life, these vague negotiators that think that they are such good businessmen. And it doesn’t work.
One time I was doing showroom sales and I was working with a customer that was looking to buy a LARGE quantity of product. But he wanted me to include an accessory at no cost. I felt it was a firm request (and a good deal). I tried to get my boss to approve it. But he wouldn’t, he decided to use this as an opportunity to “show me how it’s done”. So he double-talks the customer and closes the sale. And he has a LARGE quantity of merchandise delivered from the warehouse to the pickup area of the showroom. And he’s gloating the whole time and bragging about how “ that’s how it’s done.”
Then he hands the customer the invoice, a brief confrontation ensues where he tries to tell the guy “I told you I’d give you the accessories, I never said they’d be free.” The customer walked out rather forcefully and everything went back to the warehouse.
One of the things my boss did wrong was setting himself up as successful before he started the negotiation. And he put himself in a bad position when he decided to “show” me that he could close the deal without giving up anything. Now if he hadn’t decided to put on a show, he probably could’ve sold the accessories at half-price. And our double teaming would’ve worked.
But he was a lousy negotiator and he once read The Art of the Deal*. I went into the restroom and laughed my ass off.
- just kidding. He couldn’t read**
** seriously. He had some sort of untreated learning disability. He could only read small sections of text with great difficulty. He tried to cover but I caught on.
And even if they didn’t sign anything, so what? It’s like releasing a prisoner on parole. You give him a list of hard specific conditions and you let him know the consequences if he doesn’t abide by those conditions. So what if your convict doesn’t sign it. He breaks the rules, he goes back to jail.
Now if you just made your prisoner sign some vague-assed promise to “be good”, then maybe a signature is important. But if your agreement has teeth, it doesn’t matter. They break the agreement, they face the consequences.
Even if the US insists on continuing the sanctions, Russia and China might decide it’s time to ignore the US and it just might push back against them. Politically, Trump might have just put himself (and the US) in a situation in which it loses political leverage to impose sanctions. If that’s the case - and it’s too early to tell if it is, but if so – then that would mean North Korea might be able to get just enough relief to get by for a while.
The concern I have is that if Kim goes back to being Kim, it’s going to be a major embarrassment for Trump, as it would strike at the heart of his identity and who he imagines himself to be. Meanwhile, there’s the angry walrus-man named John Bolton, who has probably been quietly seething the entire time, and he’s been waiting for more than a decade to show the world what he means by using “hard power”. If Trump feels belittled, ridiculed, and humiliated, Bolton is going to reinforce his appetite for revenge.
On its surface, Trump’s meeting with Kim is a major foreign policy achievement - just getting the guy to talk and speak diplomatically and put his military toys away for a few months is an accomplishment. But it’s precisely because of the personalities involved that potentially magnifies failure. We’re a long way from peace, and failure is still unfortunately a very distinct possibility.
And like clockwork…
:rolleyes:
I will reiterate my previous statement, silver lining. Would you be willing to bet money on the denuclearization of North Korea within the next 5-10 years? Because if so, I’ll give you 2:1 odds and bet my next paycheck on it. Hell, I’ll bet my next paycheck and 10% on every subsequent paycheck I receive for the time until the bet is due. You trust your president. You seem to think this is a diplomatic coup de gras. Put your money where your mouth is. Take a few grand off me, take a nice vacation.
Ha ha, implying Trump has a reputation for keeping his deals.
Here’s what CNN says
Is it your considered opinion that a plane full of cash is more sinister than a single electronic transaction of the same amount?
I’m not the betting type, but I do think North Korea will change for the better and give up much of their nuclear engine and plants within the next 5-10 years.
They have already changes the way they are reporting things in the press. Trump isn’t a welcome fool. Much happened behind the scenes before he meet with Jong -In.
Chisquirrel,
There seems to be some confusion about Iran. They **did not SIGN **on the nuclear deal.
Sources:
How many more do you need??
Now, please show me any source where that says Iran signed off on the nuclear deal. I’ll read them. Don’t say its a falsehood, I showed some cards.
Now let’s see yours. PM Me with the link please. I shall read it.
- Silver Lining
Why would North Korea give up their weapons? To follow the John Bolton Libya model of trying to rejoin the rest of the world, and end up with a murdered dictator? Makes no sense.
You seem to be arguing a particularly stupid point that an agreement requires a signature.
By basic contract law, an agreement was formed with the JCPOA. The P5+1 took certain steps on the assurances that Iran would take their steps; and Iran took certain steps on the assurances that the P5+1 would take their steps. Both parties acted consistent with the agreement, regardless of the precise form of the agreement. You can’t fucking argue there was no agreement if everyone is doing what they were expected to do.
I showed the cash the plane to Iran. Any comments now?
Would you like to see were a secret Obama-era license let Iran tap dollars? Read below, nice of Obama to mislead Congress…
Full link of the above quotes:
What treaty or deal is made without a signature? In other words, I am correct. It’s not a stupid point. The JCPOA isn’t good enough, then bent in many places and were taken. At the very least having Iran’s supreme leader’s signature on it would come a political cost as the world can see it. Why not sign it???
Once again, Iran signed NOTHING. Try getting a mortgage, a car or anything else without a signature on it. It’s basic.
All treaties, which this was not even close to one, requires signatures too.
North Korea sent their leader to meet face to face without ours and at least signed an agreement, and seems to be working towards it. And no planes full of cash or access to billions was granted. A stark contrast to the Iran deal. Absolutely.
This Iran " deal " looks like foreign aid under the guise of a hope. No less authority than John Kerry, our Secretary of State at the timewho understands Iran funds terrorism and actually has in their budget said, we are now funding terrorism. If you want that quote and link, simply ask. Powerful words. And very true.
How much in Billions did Iran acquire, before Trump shut it down? I’d like to know that. Who has that answer?
PS: You’re use of language is not clean. I debate cleanly. I ask the same in return.
How rude.
Maybe they fear Trump? Maybe they want a seat at the world table for trade? Maybe Jong -UN looked at South Korea and decided his nation is better off being more like them. Victory though arms can not be achieved by North Korea.
If you can’t beat them, join them.
There are many reasons, I just gave a few examples.
It is estimated that North Korea sits on 10 trillion in metals and minerals. The average worker in North Korea makes about $25 dollars a month. Cheap labor. They can make a good trading partner.
De-nuclearization of North Korea is a good thing for the world. Some just cant stand that Trump’s name is attached to it. What happened, wasn’t the left very anti nuke?
How many times has North Korea promised that, and more, and never complied? Please not the absence of any enforcement, or even as much specificity, in this thing, unlike previous NK deals. The difference this time is that the US gave up military exercises and reduced its ability to enforce denuclearization or anything else, and gave a tinpot murderous dictator status he never had before.
The Great Dealmaker got rolled. Face it.
How will we know if they denuclearize?
No; this deal is awesome because it has signatures, right Silver lining?
The *best *signatures. With a Sharpie!
Kerry said: “Some of the money MAY be used to fund terrorism. There’s no way for us to prevent that.”
He also said that there are such great demands on the Iranian government to develop the country that “there is no way they can succeed in what they want to do if they are very busy funding a lot of terrorism.”
He continued, “If we catch them funding terrorism, they are going to have a problem with the United States Congress and other people, obviously.”
Debate “cleanly” indeed.