Sure. A two-year grand jury investigation turns up nothing but a lame ‘making a false statement’ charge but you somehow know there was criminal activity going on.
How soon before you guys start turning on Fitzgerald? Rove isn’t being ‘frog-marched’ out of the White House so Fitz must be a “partisan GOP operative,” right?
I keep hearing conflicting comments about that on the news. Some outlets report that it can be extended, others that it can’t. BTW, I believe it has already been extended at least once.
Keith Olbermann pointed out that even if there is just one indictment, that still means a trial, with witnesses (Rove, etc.) so the fun may continue. It ain’t over with just the initial indictment(s).
Oh, and guys, who is leading the NFC North right now? Hint: not Detroit, not Green Bay, not Minnesota.
Need another hint? Think World Series Winners.
Wow. The White Sox won the World Series while also playing a football schedule? I am impressed.
I highly doubt anyone in the reality based community (the left) will accuse Fitz of that. Not that they won’t be dissapointed if nothing comes out of it, but a lot of ink has been used touting his bona fides.
And I don’t think there will be any charges or indictments, and if there are, only Libby will get nicked. I never trust a news conference scheduled for a Friday afternoon.
Ummm, let’s not jump the gun, Stephe96. You haven’t the faintest idea what the investigation turned up.
I’m not really entirely sure what the point of this post is.
Here is my take on the issue:
-Fitzegerald was investigating the revealation of Plame’s covert status. Now, we have some vague ideas that Scooter Libby and Karl Rove were involved in this. However, we do not know if they actually revealed the information in a criminal manner.
-The reason this could potentially be a nuclear bomb of embarassment for the administration is it looks REALLY bad when someone in Rove’s position reveals, illegally, a CIA operative’s status.
That’s why this is news, there is the possibility that a high government official betrayed the covert status of a CIA operative to try and “politically punish” her husband.
From the direction this story is going now I think this is our current situation:
-Fitzgerald is not going to be able to prove that Rove or Libby actually criminally revealed Plame’s identity. So the crux of this whole news frenzy is basically gone now. We’ll never be able to say for sure that, “Karl Rove illegally revealed Plame’s CIA status for political reasons.”
-Scooter Libby and possibly Karl Rove, in the course of giving testimony idiotically committed the crime of purjury (and for the record I never claimed purjury wasn’t a crime.) Basically Fitzgerald has Libby on a technicality (and let’s remember Libby hasn’t been convicted yet) because Fitzgerald doesn’t have the evidence to support any other sort of indictment.
If Fitzgerald doesn’t really break this whole thing open then basically we’re going to come away with one government official giving muddled testimony that may or may not have been perjury.
That’s a victory for the administration when you compare it to the possibility that Rove could have been arrested for the vastly more serious crime of revealing a CIA operative’s status.
I’m not sure that would be under the purview of Mr. Fitzgerald’s authority as U.S. Attorney for the Southern District of Illinois and his position as special counsel on this Plame affair.
Plus, it’s not a crime for the President to lie or deceive the public. In fact I would say very often in the career of a President it’s a responsibility.
I should clarify I was referring to the part about the “deliberate and deceitful lies” that lead to the war in Iraq. Not the calling of a new grand jury which would obviously be something that would be under Fitzgerald’s authority to do.
Perjury is not a technicality. It is lying under oath. It is a felony. How many “technicality people” wanted Clinton’s balls on a spike for this “technicality”? In this case, it is a whole lot more serious than a blowjob. It revolves around the outing of a CIA operative and probably trashing whatever companies and other people were involved in whatever she was doing in other countries. It was kicked off because of the lies used in starting the war to begin with and an attempt to punish her husband.
It is a victory only in that the administration for the most part, got away with it yet again. But you’re right, the revelation was far more serious, although damn near impossible to prove in court.
That is a whole other can of worms. This was not a case of lying to minimize damage, as when the allies during the early part of WW2 told us we were not getting our asses kicked. The present state is a set of lies to start an unjustified war, using trumped up false claims (WMD, yellowcake, Iraq/Osama link, etc), against someone who while a monster, was no threat to us. I would suggest that instead of lying to bolster our confidence in the face of a powerful and aggressive enemy, our current president lies as a matter of habit, even when it is not necessary. Keep in mind too, this president campaigned (among other things) as the “honest and ethical guy”, as opposed to those lying cheating Democrat bastids. The quote marks are my sign of sarcasm. I doubt Bush would know the truth ig it jumped up and bit him on the ass.
IIRC, if it were a special grand jury, apparently it could have been extended multiple times, a normal grand jury only once.
The issue’s moot now, though. Reading this Washington Post article, it appears that it was a normal one, and has now expired, but Fitzgerald plans to empanel another one for further investigations, presumably of Rove.
I understand these are the liberal talking points in this case, but I just have to ask: if someone “outed” a CIA operative why didn’t Fitzgerald charge someone with that?
What Fitzgerald said was that it’s normal to keep open the Grand Jury option. It means nothing. It’s a normal thing in a case like this. He repeated it more than once in his press conference. He stressed that it signifies nothing.
Well, it could be that he needed proof to proceed. He didn’t have that.
That is not relevant to the charges. I don’t know why Fitzgerald hasn’t charged anyone with that and neither do you.
Libby is charged with completely separate crimes; crimes which took place in the course of the investigation. Do you believe that committing perjury is “lame”?
Before the press conference, the local NPR station people made an interesting comment-if a ham sandwich is indicted, the Democrats will sieze that and carry on about accountability and so on… Another observation was that if everyone is going 20 MPH above the limit, who is really speeding?
Sorry, but I’m having a hard time getting worked up over this. Every administration as far back as I can recall has lied to me. If all liars are jailed for perjury, on one hand that would be a good thing, as elected and appointed offices might be occupied by honest people for a change. On the other hand, I’ve got to pay for these SOBs while they’re in the can.
The investigation has had two friggin’ years. If this is the best they can come up with, then so be it, but to continue further is a waste of time and effort, IMO, just as Ken Starr wasted time and effort trying to hang Bill for illicit slap and tickle when the important charges couldn’t be brought.
Uh… this makes it sound like you don’t know the difference between lying and perjury.
I think a key issue here is the relative seriousness of perjury in a civil case versus perjury in a criminal case. What’s the difference?
There’s lying, there’s unsworn falsification to authorities, and there’s perjury. Going back to my previous posit, it’s been going on for decades on both sides of the aisle, so I lack the emotional fuel to get my panties in a wad over it.