Now that Allan Gurfinkle has been banned and his thread safely locked and everybody who posted in it has (I hope) calmed down, I thought I’d indulge my curiosity about a question I posed him several times in that thread and to which he never responded, not even by hand-waving, or even acknowledged:
If the Holocaust is a hoax, who perpetrated that hoax, and how did they manage to gull all the British, Soviet and American generals who presided at the Nuremburg Trials?
I’ve never heard any Holocaust denier address that very obvious question even obliquely. But they must have some sort of theory.
That’s a glib answer, but it is more or less correct. In the warped minds of the denialists, there is a global conspiracy of the power elites that either are, or are in thrall to, the Jews. This conspiracy usually involves international bankers, high-level politicians, and the Queen of England. Or something.
Well, of course the Allied military leaders had to come up with a BIG reason to justify the war against Germany, with the massive expenditures of resources, destruction of property, and bloodshed on all sides. Soooo take some piles of bodies (and who knew if they were really Jewish or German or what), add on more piles of bodies probably killed by our good Russian “allies”, take some anti-Semitic Nazi writings as an alleged motive, spread some Zionist banker money around to pay off anyone who might blab- and Voila, ya got yerself a HoloHoax!
I didn’t even have to consult any Revisionist books. I just made that up out of my imagination.
So the hoaxers would be FDR, Truman, Eisenhower & Patton, and their underlings; Stalin & his underlings; any Germans wanting to curry favor with the new Allied overlords; the Jews- both those who were victimized by the Nazis and those Elders of Zion who bankrolled the whole thing.
And things like Germany declaring war on pretty much everybody and the Nazis being a bunch of dangerous asswipes, Holocaust or not, that the rest of the world was glad to be shut of doesn’t occur to those guys. No, WWII happened so we could save the Jews. :rolleyes:
While Allan Gurfinkle’s arguments were ridiculous and so forth, I did think he was clear in saying that the Jews did the faking, and did it so they could get rich. He wasn’t really clear in saying how fake genocide >>> profit, or maybe more importantly, he didn’t explain how they managed to fool such an enormous number of people, but I thought he did express that they did it for money and so they would be given a homeland.
Yes, it’s a bit like all those African Americans pretending that they had slave ancestors, so that they can get affirmative action, and reparations, and that Black Muslim Barack Hussein Obama into the White House. A very similar process.
AFAIK what happened was that for propoganda purposes, the atrocities of the nazi’s were exaggerated by the Russians and the Allies to demonise the Germans (particularly at the end of the war), and those numbers of dead were attributed to the Jews, who then, having lost much during the war, used those lies to improve their standing and political power.
I am curious about how Russian historians dealt with the holocaust. many of th death camps were in the regions occupied by the Red Army, and the russians surely knew what was going on. of course they had a lot of skeletons of their own (like the murder of 50,000 Polish Army officers, buried in the Katyn Forest). Stalin had a mini-pogrom of his own going on-so, did the russians mention the holocaust in their history of “the Great Patriotic War”?
FDR’s “Holohoax” papers actually called for a pile of dead puppies and kittens as he thought it would generate more sympathy in the heartland. When he died Truman, a noted cat lover, refused to allow them to actually kill kittens, though, and not enough people in the test audiences were moved by the footage of dead dachshunds, so it was changed to Jews. They’re not as cute as kittens (most of them- Seth Green’s kinda adorable) but they tested better in the major markets than French, Claims Accountants, and nuns.
1- the “sincere” explanations are about as factual as these
2- they vary widely from group to group
Holocaust Deniers range from those like George Lincoln Rockwell (head of the American Nazi party) who essentially claimed nothing like the Holocaust happened, to those who will concede “yeah, millions of Jews died from overwork and disease maybe, but there was no deliberate genocide”.
The “hoax” is almost always laid at the cloven hooves of world Jewry by these people, the motive being justification for the resettlement of Israel and world sympathy. Some deniers claim that the conspiracy was many years old before World War II and all the groundwork had been done by fore-runners.
Actually, as with most idiotic conspiracy beliefs, there had never been a truly coherent scenario put together for many years. Initially, the deniers simply resorted to the usual bait-and-switch claims and deliberate obfuscations. They would pretend that a claim had been made that all six million Jews were killed art Auschwitz and “prove” that there was not the time or space to accomplish that effort, (while ignoring all the murders carried out at numerous other camps, as well as all the murders carried out by the Einsatzgruppen prior to the establishment of the camps as death camps). Or they would attempt to claim that the Nazis did kill a few thousand Jews, but that the numbers were inflated by including everyone who died in Allied air raids and from disease or who simply never existed. There have probably been a couple of attempts to write a comprehensive conspiracy tale in the last few years, (although I have yet to see it), but the earliest deniers resorted to trying to nitpick tiny details without actually trying to describe an actual conspiracy.