I didn’t choose to be phobic but I am.
I did choose to do something about it when it finally got to be more than I could live with and I still am working on it. But it’s not a simple thing and I spent too many years hiding from everyone and missed, I fear, so much interaction with people that I’ll never be able to catch up, to learn how to do it all.
I still try.
You all need dogs, not cats or snakes. Dogs have to be walked. Outside. Around people.
This will conteract your entirely sane and understandable desire to avoid a loud, nasty, smelly world with some severely unpleasant people in it. especially as dogs are best walked early in the morning. When the world is less noisy, loud, and smelly, and every-one you meet will be as sane and eccentric as you are. And walking their dogs.
And if you are a pack-rat, let me tell you when you die some idiot will pay a fortune for all that stuff if they find it in an antique store.
Oh, I’m a depressive dog-owner.
I guess you can add me to the list of folks who will probably die alone. Not that I’m looking forward to it, but the only woman who meant anything to me died of breast cancer last year.
Right now, I date occasionally, but these are friendship dates just for companionship and I don’t really have much in common with the ladies other than we like to see new films.
My Himalayan-Persian cat Susie is really my best friend and if and when she dies I have no plans to get another one. I enjoy my work and enjoy the company of my co-workers here at the hospital, but I’m way older than they are and don’t see them inviting me out, but that’s okay too.
Because I live and work in a small town, I know my patients pretty well and see them in town occasionally, but I’m not particularly religious, so I see them mostly in the supermarket rather than at church. (When I don’t see them in my professional capacity, that is).
I manage to get to Germany sometimes twice a year and see my friends and family there, and that is always a fun time, but it hurts when I have to leave, and even there, there is a big generation gap. I can see the day when I will be thought of as just a lovable eccentric old uncle or cousin. 
Are our numbers strong enough yet to form an army or at least a softball team? 
Thanks
Quasi
Ugh. Groups.
I used to think I’d probably end up like that …then I came out, went on the scene and now have a packed social life that makes me step back and wonder sometimes. I still have a sort of inner certainty that I’ll never have a long-lasting relationship, but I don’t think I’ll end up without friends. I picture myself as an aged cackling lesbian staking out a coffee shop with a bunch of other aged cackling lesbians, drinking good wine and checking out the babes. I do have a child, but she’ll be off having a life of her own, as will I.
Can’t very well come out, as I’m straight . . . and I really am more of a cat person; don’t dislike dogs but don’t like 'em either.
I am not in the position many of you are, but I have seen many, many people who were. All of them more lonely and isolated than you. They were the elderly in nursing homes / assisted living facilities.
If I might make a suggestion, I’ve always found that a good way to stop focusing on my own life and problems was to do something for someone else. The lonely elderly are everywhere, and they are desperate for someone to spend time with them. Many of them are funny, smart, and have wonderful stories to tell.
If you are happy with the way you are, that’s fine, but if not, there are lots of good friends to be had, just for the cost of some of your time.
Woo hoo! Looks like my sills qualify me to live AND work in Canada! Oh, wait…
My roommate and I quite often have conversations about how we’re going to be living together 40 years from now, sitting on the balcony, screaming at strangers. I kinda hope that’s not the case but I guess worse things could happen. We both just seem to have a knack for choosing men that either can’t or won’t commit. 
Ah well - gives us lots of time to work on our respective careers.
As an aside, this seems like a pretty light hearted thread, but on a more serious note, if anyone here thinks that they’re clinically depressed and not ok with that, PLEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEESE see somebody. I know that for some people, melancholy is just how they want to be, which is just fine; however, if melancholy is NOT how you want to be at least consider seeing someone (assuming you haven’t). My mom was clinically depressed for quite a long time, and it was really sad for the whole family. She was very difficult to be around. She finally had a breakdown, took a leave from work, took some medication, and spoke to her family doc on numerous occasions and is now doing 100% better. It’s like having my old, fun mom back. Sometimes I think people creep downwards into depression, without realizing they are. Depression is a disease, which is treatable, but in a lot of cases, a person CAN’T get better without help.
Ok, I’m done.
Oh, except that, once my dad told me that I was a wanna be “Crazy Cat Lady”. Wanna be, because I’m allergic to cats, so I have bunnies instead. Thanks dad.
Hi alice!
I know I’m not clinically depressed, even though I have some of the symptoms, because I eat, sleep and (when I have a job) work normally, and sometimes I do enjoy myself (especially when I’m reading or on the SDMB 
).
ultress –
Nice post sweetie; Did it, however, occur to you that some of us can easily fit into your cast? Action and conversion is self-explanitory, there are some who want something else out of life.
Sure, we can all go to a church, read the books, attend the sermons, listen to the music, join the groups, make the friends, gain ‘that vigor’ over the course of a couple of years; and rewire even hard nihilism into deism… what’s the point though? (metaphorical of any conversion)
I think ‘these’ types of loners tend to simulate people and events extra-ordinarily well; such that the simulations have more free-will than the environment. Who wants to waste twenty years training someone to be a ‘peer’ - only to risk having completely memorized them to banality because the psychic growth has not ceased its rapid processing. It’s a sensitive issue of cognitive age IMO, and the reticence to tell someone that they are nothing but a robot to you. It’s a very surreal experience to listen to people opine about ‘genuine people’, ‘personality’ and ‘faults’; ‘objectification’ and whatnot; when you’re metaphorically processing a trillion cycles of data per second and they’re about 3 million cycles old. What on earth does one even say to such a person? It really boils down to old cognitions having less behavior at their disposal from which to draw meaning.
When females say, “I hate it when men objectify me; I want an intelligent man.” (sorry to pick on the ladies … it’s just a common perception) They seem too arrogant to realize that an intelligent man can objectify their mind as easily as their bodies.
This is true of all intelligent simulators; there is a critical mass where personality becomes law, and astonishing predictive power becomes a matter of processing a corruption of that critical mass. (i.e. I can predict you, because you are less than me in every concievable subjective respect). This is a very sore subject for any human being, but will promote anger, disbelief and gossip in those who don’t have the ability. It’s like all those bell curves we become so famailiar with over-time. The most intelligent person is going to look exactly the same as the ‘dumb-ass’ (which makes them very easy targets (to them, that you are a target is self-explanitory; as to not even require articulation (hence, they don’t ever critisize or gossip)- mastery of a system does not act within the confines of that system)); with the notable exception of cognitive ages being on extreme ends.
When a ‘dum-dum’ walks up and says, “Let’s cut the BS… do you wanna screw, and maybe be friends if that thing works out?”
They are objectifying the body and basically unaware of the ‘subtleties’ of what is you. The average simulator will address both topics to varying degrees; and the ‘geniuses’ will ask the same exact question as the ‘dum-dum’. The difference of course is that human determinism has been synthesized, mapped, memorized, simulated (simultaneously processing 10 billion perspectives weighing per event) etc… to such a vast degree; that what to 99.99999% of the population seems like their ‘personality’ is nothing more than an easily manipulated object. The subtext is something like: (iow “I have memorized everything you can ever possibly think, feel or say… please don’t make me lie to you about having a personality of some sort… but I’m really horny; are you?”). The ones with an ounce of integrity; will, by the act of objectifying your body, honor the sacredness of your humanity.
The others… it’s a very strange ‘sociopathic pedifillia’; that they would even bother to reverse engineer your personality for their personal use. One may as well screw dead animals or converse with their own hands on a word procerssor. One begins to realize that chance has nothing to do with attractions; the predictive power of these revolve around theories of theft, trickery, violence and hypocrisy so severe, as to leave one feeling wholly alone in life. When you compound increased sexual tension by time being processed in incerments of trillionths of seconds; to label such people as weak, is clearly a misunderstanding of the courage required to maintain ones integrity at the expense of oneself over such magnified effects of emotion and pain; for the benefit of perspectives others will achieve in their more cognitive idealized forms. Just because you can’t comprehend certain crimes (or never will in your life), doesn’t mean that it isn’t still a crime. All crimes are of the same axiom: It is more logical to commit suicide than to: <add crime here>. If it wasn’t for the hope that people actually can grow cognitively (maybe 50 years of slow, chaotic suffering towards death at 112 years will even out the average cognitive age towards the current human peaks); geniuses would all consider humanity to be wholly morally depraved and unworthy of existence. The idea that everyone will achieve these critical masses of cognitive age at their sexual peaks instead of their last days or worst days; lends hope of a brighter reality.
I’ll just make the statement that: what is to cognitive youth; qualities of sincerity, truth, honesty, morality, rightiousness, is to cognitive old-age; lies, deciets, acts & games that are violating trust implicit in the laws of determinism, transparency and consistancy aquired over time.
‘Personality’ and ‘preference’ eventually become framed as a luxury of cognitive youth.
Just because someone can do something, doesn’t mean they will do or will even want to do it. Which one of you would have spotted the main charachter in “a beautiful mind” in that bar scene? Mental illness is not a requirement for blazing speeds of pattern formulation; you could have literally slapped the very person you’ve been ‘seeking’ all along. “No games” if actually applied, looks exactly the same on both ends of the spectrum.
Ironically, the statement is used to deselect people who don’t play games (link between intelligence and lying for a general population); throwing out the gems with the garbage.
These people will most likely not be sexually or emotionally attractive to you at all; as everything you percieve in these realms is to them: “the game”. “If I smile right now, this human being will have a better opinion of me, if I say these words right now, this human being will continue the conversation, if I make this gesture; this human being will become attracted to me…”
To suggest that they underestimate your intelligence; is as statistically charming as every bible-thumper believing that they are of the few in “The path is narrow and few will enter.”. It might make you ‘feel’ good to think that about yourself, it however has no bearing on the reality of the situation. These people are doing for perspective what in the words of Mozart; (paraphrase - can’t remember verbatim) “The ability to hear an entire symphony at once, the joy of which I wish I could pass to every person - it is unspeakable.” These people are simultaneously simulating, processing, combining and creating 100’s of millions personality structures; parallell processing in short term memory; with the ability to literally decide whether or not to pretend ‘scared’ at the balloon that just popped like everyone else, or just ignore it. Either way, it rarely, if ever crosses the average mind, that the person actually had a protracted period of decision.
It would be more accurate to say; “I want someone who treats my mind like an object” or “I want attractive people who aren’t hopelessly stupid and unsuccessful”. That is at least consistent with the way that human beings as a general population approach all relationships, regarding meaning. That is literally what the net is designed to catch, no matter what is said. Those open terms that take meaning to the extreme of human depth, that grow in volume and qaulity over time become so transformed, as to wonder why people even bother using those words they clearly don’t understand; and don’t just listen long enough to realize what they actually mean; so that at least we can extend some understanding and compassion towards our moral reserves of humanity.
This stuff can go on for days and days, but hopefully you had an opportunity to see a fraction of one of many equally compelling and valid reasons why people do as they do; and yet do so with moral validity. I can complain that intimate moral companionship is next to impossible for me without aknowledged object to object transfers (as in prostitution); and you can complain that my arrogance is less valid than your arrogance. I guess the proof is that you’re having a good go of it; right? Clearly, it’s not always as simple as it appears…
-Justhink
I suppose another way to frame the prior post is to talk about tic-tac-toe. Tic-tac-toe is a very simple game. If someone starts out with any of the middle squares on the perimeter; they automatically lose the game. That someone doesn’t want to take the time to play the game out; doesn’t make it false. If after a couple moves a certain pattern emerges; a draw can be forced, but no win can emerge. There are so few combinations in tic-tac-toe; that it is easy for anyone to memorize and grasp the dynamics of motivation, ethics and winning. If to recieve a companion, one must win at tic-tac-toe, the only person who gains an advantage is the person who has the entire game memorized and more importantly doesn’t tell anyone, ever. If they tell people; nobody will play with them, and the companion will not come; or people will feel cheated all around, violated trust. The person who doesn’t have the game memorized is still required by chance to play the same exact game, only they have the luxury of claiming sincerity; by virtue of their ignorance. Sincerity speaks greater volumes than virtue, as it’s evidence is much more transparent – sincerity very cheap; it’s expressions that simulate vigor are easy to come by. It’s so much ‘sexier’ to be able to tell someone “I’ve played a little tic-tac-toe in my day s”
or “I seem to be really good at these types of games.” or even better; “I’ve never played this before in my life.”; than “I have memorized tic-tac-toe, the only way you can defeat me is if I let you.” Out in the real world… that last statement does not fly. In the inner world; the lack of sincerity involved in even getting someone to play with you is depressing. It’s not any single persons fault; but rather the structure of the system; that uses the ‘security’ of game encryption as a test of human value. There are actually human beings who have decrypted the entire game that the population uses. Their best success is in simulating luck; being deceptive. The other combinations will incite anger and aggression, betrayal etc… Is this human being supposed to deprive themselves of all tangible experience simply because they don’t have a game to play; and are honest about it? Unfortunately, yes; that is often the case - otherwise you will most likely be killed (which is suicide to such a person). I believe these are called “pickles”.
-Justhink
Don’t discount you have loners among you who aren’t behind physical walls, just mental/emotional ones. People who can be alone in a crowd. They go to the store and buy their groceries, work, maybe say hello (but almost never more) to some of the neighbors, don’t objectize everyone around, don’t feel superior, but just don’t seem to be able to connect. They’re functional in some senses, dysfunctional in others. Some of these people aren’t outcasts rejected by society in general, but reclusive emotionally rather than physically. Relationships with others are superficial. They’re more misfits than outcasts. Flying under the radar, they live and die alone, unnoticed, and after they are gone, maybe people realize the car was always in the driveway, but almost never any visitors. “You know, nobody else on the block was in their house in the last 15 years…”. The SDMB here I think can be a sounding board. Message boards are more detached than email, which is more than phones, which is more than actual physical interaction.
I’m one, I think. Most of those "they"s could’ve been "we"s.
Wow justthink That was a very in depth post.
I had to read it three times just to grasp the full meaning.
On target from where I’m sitting.
I just thought this needed repeating. Wonderful point, Lucretia. I’ve taken my young son to a nursing complex nearby a few times to visit a friend while he was staying with his mom. I am absolutely amazed at how the sound of a young child can pull tenents out of their rooms. Everybody wants to tell him hi, and pat his head. It’s makes me feel kind of nice, and he gets lots of attention, so he loves it too!
bella
gaahhhhhhhh!!
I’ve betrayed you, Preview. Neglected you. I’ll never skip over you again.
::broken sobbing::
It amazes me sometimes how differently people can read and digest posts.
Clinically depressed? Wow, how about manic depressive? Or how about bi-polar for starters? Want to name some more? I doubt very seriously that you could top what I can. I very well understand exactly what you are talking about, dealing with, and living with.
My post had absolutely nothing to do with 'pulling yourself up by your boot straps." I’m fully aware that is not always possible. My point is that there are people out there that will help you by being your friend if you will only let them know. And I doubt very seriously that anyone on this board would desire to be me or to live the life I’ve led nor would I expect them to. It is, after all mine.
Okay, I’ve been meaning to get back to this thread but have been occupied with other things.
ultress, this thread wasn’t intended as a pity party, it’s an earnest effort on my part to try and avoid a pretty crappy future. I have a grand total of three friends I see on a regular basis. I’ve got a fourth that I see occassionally. That’s it. Out of those four, only one of them stands a chance of not ending up with the same kind of future that I’m looking to avoid. Obviously, I need some new friends. How do I go about getting them? I lack social skills, I can’t dance, I’ve got very little money so I can’t “grab a beer” with someone after work (and there’s not really anyone I work with that I’d want to hang out with, don’t dislike the folks, but their not really mind kind of people, most of them are “Joe Sixpack” types and I ain’t), and I’m really tired of this Unabomber kind-of-life that I’ve been leading.
Thanks for your offer to call, but I gotta admit, I don’t need friends over the wire, I’ve got penpals in various points of the globe, I’ve got the friendly folks here at the Dope, who’ve helped me through a rough spell or thirty. Nope, I need friends in the flesh, who show up unexpectedly at my place, or who call and saying they’re fixing dinner and would I like to come over and join 'em? (And I’ll be more than happy to do the same for them.)
That’s one of the reasons why I’ve suggested the Dopefest for the past two years is so that I could meet folks in the flesh. Still, it’s not enough, I’m not doing the right things and it’s because I don’t know what the right things are! The “just keep trying things until you find something that works” approach is time consuming and frustrating. (Not to mention there’s a severe lack of feedback in letting you know what you did wrong, only that you did something wrong.)
There has to be a better way, and that’s why I started this thing. I need ideas, because I’ve run out of 'em.
I have cats!
I have weapons! (all bladed ones, but still weapons)
I think I need more books…